cool story bro

DWON WIT U BRO. I DU LIKE DEM SHOOTAN.

>music-matters-way-more.png

You were already my hero, but that image name was great icing.

>any game that spends too much time on the narrative will always descend dangerously close to the hellhole of overwrought crap like Xenosaga and Persona 4
Good stories don't need long narratives. Plots can still be good or awful regardless of length. Is that what you're really complaining about?

>i'm compensating for my own lack of enjoyment from video games so i'll bash other people's tastes

u mad, bro?

will there ever be a great game about alcoholism?

>cool story bro

>music-matters-way-more.pn
yeah no

>I'm dumb as shit

>>55500967
I dunno. Maybe.

What's an example of a good game story that wasn't from a "long" game?

Imagine if tetris was a bald space marine

SOUNDS LIKE A LOT OF FUCKING FUN

OP speaks the truth.
/v/ skips over the plot and youtubes it later just so we can hate sequels for being rehashes.

>I CAN'T PAY ATTENTION TO BOOKS THAT'S WHY I PLAY VIDEO GAMES

>WHO ARE YOU TO TRY AND PUT A STORY IN MY VIDEO GAMES

>>55500670
>Op is a faggot who enjoys MW rehashes with regenerating health

Yes and no. The story doesn't need to be the focus for most games, but it's nice if there's some creative elements, instead of bald space marine / spiky-haired tween.

OP here.

It's funny because now everyone thinks I'm some FPS whore. FPS is probably my least favorite genre.

Gameplay should always be first or second in a game. Controls should technically be the first, since if you can't play the game because of terrible controls, then what's the point?

Graphics and plot are generally nothing in the grand scheme.

>>55501343
/v/ does not know the meaning of the false dilemma fallacy.

If developers thought the plot didn't matter, then they wouldn't be making one.

See ID Software and Quake.

>>55501350
>gameplay
>second
No

If writers for video games didn't exist you would likely end up playing the same exact game over and over. Ideas for gameplay changes come from story concepts, you know.

But you're trolling, so what the fuck ever man.

>>55501106
Braid.

>>55501465

Read my post in its entirety, faget.

OP is a casual.

OP is 100% correct.

>>55501539
I hated that game

>>55501439
oh, these fags know it, all right

it's their favorite one after the strawman

>>55501476
>Ideas for gameplay changes come from story concepts, you know.
>But you're trolling
I lol'd.

Story affects gameplay
Graphics affect gameply
EVERYTHING AFFECTS GAMEPLAY

>>55501476
>Ideas for gameplay changes come from story concepts, you know.

BAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHA. You think Okami's celestial brush gimmick was a STORY idea before it was a GAMEPLAY idea? Get the fuck out of my thread.

>>55501106
I thought Shadow of the Colossus had a nice story. It was very short and had very little dialogue, but I thought it did a pretty good job at evoking emotions right at the end.

Can't think of any others right now. Portal, maybe? I don't think many games have good plots in comparison to other mediums like books or movies.

>>55500670

>WAH! PEOPLE SAY BAD THINGS ABOUT FINAL FAGGOTRY'S PLOT, BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAW!

>Story doesn't fucking matter, alright? In the end, you don't give a fuck about the plot.

Unless a game has good multiplayer, the plot is the only thing that makes a game memorable for me.

>>55501621

Portal, for instance, derived much of its gameplay from an idea for a plot.

>>55501556
Controls are a part of the gameplay as they can influence it

Some of my favorite games

1. Godhand
2. Puyo Pop
3. Street Fighter
4. Sonic 3&K
5. Dark Cloud


now one of these games have a very extensive plot.

and yet I retained just as much enjoyment. As long as your game can back itself up, then go for the story.

If your story is great, but your game is a snorefest (God of War), then pooh on you

>>55501658

Shouldn't that be "playing a game for the graphics is like reading a book for the font"?

you know, the count of monte cristo didn't have what one could consider a deep nor complex plot...

>>55501539
Being vague to sound deep != good writing.

Because I love playing RPGs for gameplay alone
>music-matters-way-more.png

>>55501759

you should probably look up how and why portal was made.

>>55501679
Both of the stories in those games were great. Short, sweet, didn't clog up the works, moved things along.

>>55501940
>why portal was made.
Money
DERP

OP is the equivalent of that one kid who sat down in his living room Christmas morning and threw all of his presents at his parents because none of them were a BB gun

If a game has a bad story, I automatically pirate it or disregard it instead of buying.

Although I do agree gameplay should come first, I'm willing to forgive a game if it does have a truly great story.

For instance, Lost Odyssey. The gameplay is utterly generic JRPG gameplay. You run around a static world, click on shit, and frequently you stumble into random encounters and enter into basic turn-based combat.

However, the story and characters were so moving (to me at least) that I was willing to forgive the gameplay shortcomings. I kept playing through to find out what was gonna happen next, and my favorite parts of the game were probably the dream sequences, which were essentially glorified visual novels. But they were so well written I didn't mind that.

Oh yes, and this is coming from a guy who usually dislikes JRPGs.

Gameplay is always the most important thing in any videogame.

Always.

No matter what.

>>55502024

hmm, yes, you enjoy yourself /v/, I'm going to do something and remain educated.

What bothers me the most is all the millions of faggots who claim that Final Fantasy games have good story. Why are people so dumb? If you play Final Fantasy for the story, you're the cancer killing humanity. Go read a fucking book.

>>55501759
>implying Portal's gameplay didn't come from Narbacular Drop
Come on, man, try harder.

People forget what games are supposed to be

>>55502179

Game....game has changed....

Wrong OP, Assassins Creed 2 refutes your entire arguement.

I could deal with some of the modern day sci-fi shit, aka the simulation. But all that shit at the end? God damn, ruined the entire fucking game for me.

>>55502098
>implying you're smart
Wololo

I can guarantee all of the people in this game wouldn't enjoy a game as much if it had stellar gameplay but the story and characters were mind-wrenchingly bad.

Like Halo and Gears of War.

>>55502254
>ruined the entire fucking game for me

Explain.

>>55502063
The dream sequences were the ony good part about Lost Odysseys story. And they were BARELY a part of the main story. They were basically vague backstory for the characters, and those stories were written by an actual famous japanese author. That's why they didn't suck balls.

i've been playing games for 30 years, i've finished thousands of games. I don't give a fuck about story and neither should anyone that likes games to be about gameplay.

>>55502336
I have no idea what the fuck you're trying to convey.

>>55502220
Games can have good stories but if the gameplay is boring as shit it doesn't even matter.

>But you shouldn't demand nor expect The Count of Monte Fucking Cristo in terms of complexity and depth.

Why not?

>>55502498

Then you're retarded.

Now wonder you don't like video game plots.

>>55502506
cave story?
Haha, yeah, sure.

I'm with OP

>Besides, every story in every game is just copypasted copypasta from somewhere else.


That's the story from everything everywhere. Nothing has an original story. Everything is taken from somewhere else. The only time you will have an even pesudo-original story is when it's completely fucked and makes absolutely no sense. Even then you could break the story up into bits and put those pieces as the stories of other things.

Well fuck you too.

Games do NOT need a story.
Sure.
But if you INCLUDE one and it is bad, it is a problem.
If you include one and it is good, that is a plus.

Technically, games only need a hint of interactivity to be called such and be enjoyed by some.

How each game enhances the experience is another matter, and story is one of the elements.

Anyone who tries to argue anything else is retarded.

Goddamnit you people, greentext color is #789922. GET IT RIGHT.

Ok, so let me sum up OPs idea

>> all games should be this way, rather than be multidimensional, and just different from each other

thank god you don't run shit. i can only pray your stupid fuck opinion doesn't sway others.

>>55500670

>>55503001
Sorry, I used Paint to make the image.

Games used to be about fun and depth. Now they're about presentation. You had a bunch of nongamers come in and rehaul the industry.

That's why games suck nowadays.

Story is something that is usually narrated by main characters talking or arguing with each other and cutscenes. See FFXIII.

BUT. Story can also be told by environments, by NPCs and the overall atmosphere of the game. This is something that most game developers still haven't internalized. They use the obvious 'movie-way' of storytelling but I think there are far better ways to tell a story in a videogame.

It's about how the environment looks, how stuff behaves, why the world looks like it looks, what technology is in it, how NPCs cope with your appearance to their village/home/etc. All this are great triggers for storytelling that not many developers think about.

>>55502565
Or, you just have horrendous grammar. I'm pretty sure that is more likely.

Stories in game are fine, but when they overshadow the game you have failed.

Story keeps me more interested in most games than actual gameplay does nowadays.

I'm someone who would normally claim story doesn't matter. The best games had single line stories like "You are a bad enough dude to rescue the president.".

The truth is that a bad story is much worse than no story. A story where the character(s) under your control act completely against how you yourself would feels insulting.

>>55503174
I think Morrowind was best at story telling. No one sat down and told you the plot. It was a mixture of NPCs gossiping, reading books, discvoering new places, etc.

>>55503430
Then you should read a book

Don't mind me, just reminding you the adventure genre is dead.

Also if you actually read books ever, you would realize there are only a handful of stories that get repeated over and over. I suppose a true epic could even contain all of them.

>>55502336
>Gears of War
>Halo
>Stellar Gameplay

Hahahahahahahahahah

The problem is, most stories are bad. I love reading, and I love a good story. I don't love trying to play a game, and having hours of poorly written dialog delivered by characters with less depth than a pizza box.

>>55503553
Fuck you, it's just getting ready to make a comeback. I'm sure that's all it is.

;-;

Videogames could actually be a great storytelling medium if people actually tried, instead of cramming everything into cutscenes.

Pic related, a game that tells much of its story through the things that you examine and investigate, instead of just cutscenes.

>>55503553
Even though I grew up with PaC adventures like MI and Lucas Arts games, I do not miss them.

>video games don't need a good story
Make me wonder how awesome Borderlands would have been if it had one.

I turn off the music in games. Almost always.

>>55503174
Great post. I agree with you.

>>55503543
Here comes the fucktards. BOOKS ARE FOR STORIES, MOVIES FOR GRAPHICS AND GAMES FOR GAMEPLAY!! COMICS ARE FOR KIDS MEEHehehrherehueheuh

>>55503174
>It's about how the environment looks, how stuff behaves, why the world looks like it looks, what technology is in it, how NPCs cope with your appearance to their village/home/etc.
Oh god yes.

Hm..valid points OP. I guess when it comes down to it gameplay should be the end all of the vidya. Plot should be a good add-on but not absolutely mandatory.

Imagine if they wasted time trying to give Just Cause 2 a plot? Jesus Christ!

>>55503920
Hate to go offtopic, but why? Many games have great background tunes.

>>55503923
>announcing he's going to post something stupid
lol, why?

>>55503920

> I turn off the music in games. Almost always.

Why? Music enhances the experience.

>>55503920
Music is the least important thing in any videogame (unless it's based around music like EBA or Rock Band). If a game has bad music, you can mute it and put on music you feel is appropriate. In most cases, if a game has bad graphics, you can find a mod to enhance them.

But if a game has bad controls, shallow content and is easy as shit, there's no fixing it.

>>55503920
I feel sorry for you. Either you're playing games with shitty music, or you're an idiot.

All cutscenes do is say, "Video games are incapable of telling a story, so we'll just turn this into a movie."

>>55504326
>Music is the least important thing in any videogame
Except it heavily influences the atmosphere.

>>55504326
>I haven't played any Silent Hill

>>55504471
Oh hell yes. The first few Silent Hill games have such masterful audio, goddamn.

Personally, I like to have story in a game. However, I can appreciate games that lack stories, like old Mario games and all that, where having a story would be largely irrelevant.

But what I cannot stand is games that go halfway with their stories. If you're not going to have a story that's going to knock my socks off, then fuck it and go without.

Y'all threads postin' in a nigga's troll.

>>55504570
They have good stories, too, even if they are mostly told through cutscenes.

>>55504467
So what is less important? Graphics? If a game has awful music, you can just replace it with your own.

>>55504471
I haven't. I still don't see what could possibly be less important than the music.

>>55504326
>Music is the least important thing in any videogame

ITT: wrong people

>>55504326

>Music is the least important thing in any videogame (unless it's based around music like EBA or Rock Band).

That's an idiotic statement. Here is an example, Splinter Cell Chaos Theory's soundtrack is cut up into small bits; you're never going to hear the entire track in one instance. It's cut up like this because when you get seen or heard, the music starts playing, raising the tension but also allowing the player to be more aware that someone is following them and for how long as apposed to a guard just saying something along the lines of "Oh, it must have been the wind".

>>55504706
Add "horror games" to your list of genres that do require music.

Dispute solved.

i play for story...

For what it's worth, I tried playing Fable 2 last month. It's a poorly-made game with tons of bugs and easy-as-shit combat, but I managed to keep myself entertained with it for about 8 hours. I had to quit because the story got really bad at this one point. It was unforgivably, horrendously BAD.

After this one certain mission, I couldn't play the game knowing that the developers who made it were clearly retarded. In addition to the trillions of bugs and the stupid design decisions, they obviously had no clue what they were doing with the story.

IT'S NOT THAT HARD TO WRITE A GOOD STORY GODDAMN

>>55504800
>>55504832
Still no one has said what is a less important aspect than music. I agree that music can be used to enhance the presentation, but if I had to lower the quality of one part of a game greatly, I would choose music every time.

Plots in Video games can matter if they are written well and help the game. Take mario for example, Rosalina's backstory help to make Galaxy even better (besides the gameplay and all the fancy stuff). Why? because it helped the series out and was something more then "Hurr Peach durr".
TL;DR: Story can help some games be better if well written

>>55505124

>Still no one has said what is a less important aspect than music.

Graphics.

Story>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Gameplay

>>55501658

I'd read any book completely written in Comic Sans.

Whatever you say man. I play some games just to know the endings.
And I enjoy them

>>55505314
hahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahah
ahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahaha
hahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahahahaha
hahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahaha
hhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahah
aahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahh
ahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahah
ahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahah
ahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhaha
hahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahah
ahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahaahahahahhahaha
hahahahahahahahahahahhahaha

>>55505236
I originally stated in a previous post that I find music and graphics on the same level. Both generally only contribute to the presentation and not to the gameplay.

>>55503174
That's why the last few FF installments (FFX, FFX-2, FFXII, FFXIII) didn't work, because all they did was to put MORE SHIT on the whole environment. They didn't think about connecting story and design, they just designed all the games with the previous ones in mind and creating a mixture of stuff to put EVEN MORE SHIT ON. Story came later.

Not really the best way Square-Enix.

>>55505236
Would SH be half as scary if it looked like Rogue?

>>55505581
The stories failed because Square just does not have good writers.

>>55503174

Good Storytelling: FFCC
Bad Storytelling: MGS4

>>55505124
Ok maybe you are correct.

But it is very important in a horror game. I would say that is more relevant than the graphics, in that genre. The original SH had blocky graphics, but the music was so creepy that it catapultated it into a classic. Same as Super Metroid.

God dammit /v/.

Video games are a medium for entertainment, just as books, music, and movies are. Meaning people play video games to entertain themselves and have an enjoyable time. In order to make sure players enjoy the game, each game needs to have the story, game-play, music, controls and graphics to all be equally great so that the game is fun.

In other words: all aspects of a video game are important you idiots. Game-play, story, music, controls, and graphics are all equally important and need to complement each other for a good game.

I think 'story' isn't important in games. I think 'narrative' is. What I don't like is Kojima or Square, who cram everything into these long, boring as fuck cutscenes, at the cost of the gameplay. What a game should do is immerse you into the world, make you care, make the story a crucial part of the game. Games=/= books or movies, we have a chance to do something tremendously unique with a narrative, and a chance to immerse someone far more than any other form of media, why don't we use it?

So yeah, pic related I guess.

>>55505590

I've never played Silent Hill.

OP sure likes CoD, unreal tournament or quake series here.

and no, i worship Quake like a god. just saying that there are games out there that satisfy ppl more than twitch shotting and blowing bodies up. Such as ME2 it was a bold adventure which leans on a good book.

>>55505590

Probably even more. Not recognizing monsters? Slenderman looking creatures?

>>55505775
>Game-play, story, music, controls, and graphics are all equally important

That's not true. There are tons of great games with shitty music and/or graphics. Based on what you said, the majority of earlier games from the 80's and 90's aren't worth playing

>>55504157
Well back in the day music was streamed from cd which meant any time the music changed it would stop everything whill it spun up the cd. It just tended to cause problems in a lot of games. Before this I would leave the music on. Now I have my own music I can listen to so I typically do. Maybe a game has a good song at some point but I don't know because the rest of the music gave me no reason to keep it on.

I do love a lot of game music but it's either nostalgia or music that just isn't made any more. FF3, Chrono Cross, Megaman 3...

>>55506143

>Comparing technology from 20 years ago to technology from today.

Storyline can matter a lot, even if it's only going on in the background.

u mad lol

Story creates atmosphere and atmosphere creates immersion which makes shooting zombies or w/e else more fun if I buy into it. So suck it.

There is a level of appropriateness to uphold though and adding text to MsPacman for characterization would be taking it to far, but sometimes hey aliens look different is not enough to make me give to fucks when they eat NPCs

>>55505590
The doom roguelike is pretty much the same feeling as doom.

>Xenosaga and Persona 4
>crap

ahahahaha

>>55505707
Super Metroid was great because of the exploration, tight controls and great graphics. In fact, the first time I ever played SM was on an emulator on my old desktop that didn't even have speakers. It was still one of the best games I've ever played.

Even if we were to agree that music is a key component to the horror genre, that's just one small genre. Take into account RPGs, rougelikes, vehicle simulators, platformers, first person shooters, third person shooters, etc. and they dwarf the number of horror games. That's why I stated that music is the least important aspect.

It's also important to note that music and sound are different things.

>>55506547
If you don't think Xenogears is a cheap piece of shit for Japanese teeangers you are an uncultured pig and a weeaboo.

If you don't think Persona 4 is a cheap, overdramatic piece of shit for weeaboos you are a weeaboo.

Yeah well that's just like your opinion, man...

No really, a lot of games I ONLY play for the story and I enjoy them. Some games I enjoy just for the gameplay.

/v/ needs to sit down.... Play some vidya... And enjoy it for once instead of trying to be a professional critic the entire time.

I just laugh and shake my head at people who play games for the story. Can't complain too much, makes it easier for me to filter out the idiots.

i am 12 and wat is plot

>>55506711
>Xenogears

Xenogears is vastly different than Xenosaga and Persona 4. It's actually...you know...good.

>Newfags
Graphics > Story

>Oldfags
Story > Graphics

>>55506891
Hahaha Xenogears is good? anon you so funny!

Broken combat system
absolute SHIT dialog
convoluted non-sensical story
terrible cookie cutter anime characters
All this in the first disc but disc 2 manages to be even WORSE.

Game Storage Size

1970-1989 Could have gameplay (yes I know it dates back further)
1990 - 2000 could have story or gameplay
2001 - xxxx can have both

I think I'll demand both.

And crucify games that think one can compensate the other or that think story equals puking text at me.

>No really, a lot of games I ONLY play for the story and I enjoy them. Some games I enjoy just for the gameplay.

This.

Usually games with good story have good music, and usually games with good gameplay have a great graphical style.

if a person mentions graphics in a conversation about games, they are below the age of 16

graphics don't matter at all

Look at dorf fort.

I played Chrono Cross almost entirely for the story. The music was the best part of the game but I already had the soundtrack.

Turned out the story in Chrono Cross was completely shit.

Oh man I missed a story thread.
I play games for story, always.

The main reason I can't into games like Monster Hunter.

ITT:

[ ] Not Trolled
[x] Trolled

>>55507220

fucking Casual

>>55507024
Actual Gamers: Story, Setting, Characters, Design, And Gameplay are all Critical parts of a game's composition. Some games are better in different areas, Shepard~
I'm a little ADD, so I can't stand to play JRPG's too much, Shepard~
I do, however, feel they are decent games, except for Final fantasy games. They're aloof and lick themselves too much, like my cat, Mr. Trotsky, Shepard~

Whatever happens to entertain me works.

If it happens to be the story, I'm not going to complain. People like to bitch about games with a heavy focus on story (IT'S A GAME, YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO CARE ABOUT THE GAMEPLAY) but as long as I'm entertained, I don't care if I'm reading it, watching it or playing it.

Of course as OP said most video game plots are dumb copypasta'd shit, it doesn't mean that I can't get engrossed in them as long as they're executed well enough, though.

>>55507024
>Ancientfags
Gameplay > Story > Graphics

>>55507297
Casual or hardcore has nothing to do with it.
I just like following stories in games.
Story/Characters/Music are my main priorities.

>>55507479

because youre casual : /

i hope god will forgive you for being such a casual faggot

kkthxbye

>>55507479
Because you are weeaboo.

>>55507220
I like Ace Attorney,

I'd be hard pressed to call it a true video game.

It's an interactive visual novel. It literally has nothing going for it except for story and characters.

Agree with OP, but only to a certain extent.
While having no story doesn't mean the game is bad, having a good story is certainly a nice extra.
Look at Okami for example, I mostly played it for the side quests and because I loved the brush gameplay, and thet was enough for it to be one of my favorite games on PS2, but it's entretaining story gave it that little push it needed to become my favorite game on the system.
Also, sometimes what makes a game good isn't it's stomy as much as it's immersion. Such as Metroid Prime, which already had solid gameplay and level-design, a simple story, and yet it's immersive aspect helped making it one of the best games on the GameCube
Basically what I'm trying to say is that story and atmosphere don't make a game good, but make a good game better.

>>55507694
And the glorious music.

>>55507049
>Broken combat system
The idea of using combos and deathblows was better than even some JRPGs made nowadays. You couldn't just mash "X", you had multiple options for each encounter
>absolute SHIT dialog
I didn't see what was wrong with it. Everybody acted in character
>convoluted non-sensical story
Two warring factions battled each other for supremacy, one was backed by a super society. What's so hard about that?
>terrible cookie cutter anime characters
They were dynamic characters and not any stereotype I can think of. Besides, the game came out in 98, just as Anime was starting to get big in America
>All this in the first disc but disc 2 manages to be even WORSE.
The second disc was rushed but still manages to be better than most JRPGs even today

>>55507413
More like "Goodtastefags", mirite?

Whoa OP, if it wasn't for story, I would've never beat the first Assassin's Creed. Also, name one person who jumped into Metal Gear at number four and enjoyed the title more than the regular fans who started the series with the first MGS.

>>55507642
/v/ what is a casual then?
tell me?
I play SF4 i'm a casual?
i'm play Guilty Gear because the music and gameplay i'm a casual?
chezz this fucking board is full of Underage&B
in simple word's
Sir you are a faggot

>>55507807
Spoken like a true fanboy. Go read a fucking book, you disgust me.

Also, Xenogears combat was the DEFINITION of a fucking spamfest.

Why not have both?

>>55507780
You openly admit to liking games for the story, character and music(all of which have very little to do with actual gameplay). That's all fine and good but then you shit on certain games and praise others, acting like your opinion is law. It's like bashing a movie because the theater seat didn't have a cupholder or because your media player has a weird interface.

>>55507938
>if it wasn't for story, I would've never beat the first Assassin's Creed

So you're admitting that Assassin's Creed is a terrible game and your only motivation for finishing was to see how the story ends?

I think that's pretty much what OP is complaining about. A shit game has nothing going for it so it attempts to manipulate you into completing it otherwise, never to pick it up again.

>>55507955

youre casual too
and you dont even realise it....such a stupid casual :(

>>55508037

>>55508145
I rarely ever bash games and I don't enforce my opinion at all.
Or are you speaking in general?

The only game i recall hardcore bashing is Tales of Abyss and Star Ocean 4.

>>55508037

>Go read a fucking book

derp derp

why do people always rely on this shit?

>implying all books are good
>implying visual/interactive storytelling can be properly compared with prose storytelling

Silent Hill. Any of them, but mostly Shattered Memories.

if games dont need stories then what is the "adventure" genre supposed to be about.

>But you shouldn't demand nor expect The Count of Monte Fucking Cristo in terms of complexity and depth.

Someone who actually likes the stories of video games doesnt care about it being complex or deep.

Someone who enjoys stories for what they are, such as I, in all honesty loves video game stories and most of the time I'll play a game primarily for the story.

What the fuck is so wrong about enjoying a story every once in a while? Its not like their were egotistical pricks sitting around camfires centuries ago yelling at bards and storytellers OMFG YOUR STORY IS SO SHIT STOP TELLING IT WTF

you trolls posting in a nigga thread.jpg

>>55500670

>>55508356
Because you called Xenogear's dialog good. What else is there to say to such an uncultured idiot? Go read a fucking book you idiot. You don't even know what good dialog is.

What's the matter OP? Too deep for you?

>>55501350

>since if you can't play the game because of terrible controls

what kind of retard cant compensate for this.

>>55508521
Exploring and discovery..

>>55508233
Assassin's wasn't necessarily a shitty game, just repetitive as fuck. Just because a game isn't the best it can be in terms of gameplay and needs a great story to give it a bit more substance shouldn't make it a shitty game. I personally believe gameplay and story are two sides of the same coin. Ideally I want the best of both worlds within my game, is that wrong?

>>55508346
I've seen you go into threads and call them shit. The most recent being Street Fighter 4. I've seen you recommend Heavy Rain to people even though it is easily the worst game f this generation.

>>55508233

The difference is... Assassin's Creed 1 and 2 are great games.

THIS IS EXACTLY LIKE FUCKING WII OWNERS
When told the wii's graphics are shit they're like "hurr durr graphics don't matter" but there is absolutely no reason why we can't have graphics and gameplay together, just like the excuse for having a bad story isn't acceptable just because it's a video game.

>>55508788

>acting like your opinion is law

hurr double standards

>>55508890

herp derp

>>55508788

>I've seen you recommend Heavy Rain to people even though it is easily the worst game f this generation.

You're a fucking hypocrite.

>>55508788
I've said that I wasn't able to get in SFIV for a lot of reasons.
Besides, how does that relate to story in games? It's a fighting game.
I love BB/GG, Tekken, SFIII and Alpha 2/3.

And Heavy Rain being the worst games of this generation? How so?

If you play games for their story you need to be beaten to death.

>>55509117
I like how you said "need" lol

>>55509117
>>55509117
>>55509117
>>55509117
babbyz first troll

SF4 is shit and you know it

If the story is amazing, I'll love it. If the gameplay is amazing, I'll love it. If they're both amazing, I'll love it even more.

Playing a game and ignoring the story is sometimes a bit shallow.

However, it's even worse playing a game for only the story and "artistic appeal" (i.e. the graveyard)

>>55508890
I think most people have a problem with how Wii games tend to look like shit because it's an overclocked Gamecube, yet for some reason devs are so fucking lazy/incompetent they haven't been able to tap its maximum potential yet despite being almost 10 years old.

>>55509325
> babbyz

>>55509017
I honestly can't see any redeeming factor in Heavy Rain. The story was clearly changed halfway through development, the characters were flat and unrealistic, the controls occasionally were unresponsive, the models looked like they were from a PS2 games.

Every aspect of the game was just horrible. What can you honestly like about the game?

>>55509367
This is true.
But there are situations where one just has to be good to continue.

Example - Star Ocean 4.
I couldn't stand the characters, I couldn't stand the ridiculously slow moving plot, I couldn't stand Edge, and the music was boring.

The only good thing I experienced with it was the battle system and that just wasn't enough to keep playing a 100+ jrpg.

Then there is a game like Resonance of Fate which severely lacks a decent story but makes up for it in characters and gameplay.

>>55509552
>the controls occasionally were unresponsive
The fuck? It was just QTEs.

>>55509367

What if the game has no story, but is amazing?

>>55509552
I thought the plot was really interesting and all the characters were great.
How could you not like motherfucking Norman Jayden OR Scott Shelby??
Ethan was great and there were tons of times the game had me riding an emotional rollercoster.

The only thing "unresponsive" about the controls were the walking.

And I dunno man. I thought the graphics were pretty darn good.

>>55509831
Then you get Resonance of Fate. Or Monster Hunter.

>>55509654
On several occasions I had to repeat a motion with the sixaxis multiple times just for it to register.

>>55509831
well that's your basic mario for you

>>55509831

No More Heroes

>>55510083
NMH had a story!
A simple story that got the job done that is.

Video games are about gameplay and music. You know why only books and movies are the only medians that need Story? Because you can't "play" books or movies.

>>55510236

>never had a pop-up book

you poor child

>>55510198

Wish is almost like no story at all. I'm not saying it's bad, I'm saying it really has no story when compared to other more story-focused games, but it's an awesome game.

>>55510236
This one has never seen a choose your own adventure book or flip book!

>>55510236

WHERE'S WALDO MOTHERFUCKER?

>>55510236

I think the great thing about video games is that you can, actually, watch them. Thereby incorporating elements from all walks of entertainment into one medium.

>>55500670
If a person feels like they need to say "That story was bullshit" then it obviously does matter.

>>55510714

I love how some people try to feel the need to validate fiction.

>>55509937
>I thought the plot was really interesting and all the characters were great.
The characters didn't act like people in real life. They behaved like actors that had read a script. They didn't respond to situations with logic like a normal person.
>How could you not like motherfucking Norman Jayden OR Scott Shelby??
Norman Jayden was written to have an addiction as a weakness. This undermined his character from the very beginning. In the FBI, everyone undergoes constant drug tests and psyche evaluations. Also, no single FBI agent would ever work a serial killer case by himself, he would have a team of agents. Norman Jayden's situation was so inplausible to anyone with any knowledge of law enforcemtn that any interest in the character is immediately dissipated.
Don't even get me started on Scott Shelby. Most private investigators are at a high risk for being vigilantes and are closely watched escpecially in a serial killer case. Also, keeping the information that your character kills people off screen is such a huge mistake in storytelling, I can't even wrap my mind around the fact that the writers got paid.
>Ethan was great and there were tons of times the game had me riding an emotional rollercoster.
Ethan didn't behave like a father would. All parents care about in the world are their children but Ethan treated him like an inconvenience. As for emotions, the dialogue and voice acting in this game are so bad, the fact that you were affected by this makes me question your relationship with people. Microsoft Sam and Microsoft Sally could have been used for every voice in this game and it still would have been more convincing
>And I dunno man. I thought the graphics were pretty darn good.
Disregarding the E3 screens fiasco, the game itself is pretty ugly. The textures are flat, there's almost no AA and the models themselves lack almost any detail

>>55510866
You're an idiot.

If a good collection of people feel that the bullshit story stole a considerable amount of fun from the game then it DOES matter whether you personally believe it or not.

I like the storyline of Doom.

>>A space marine on Mars has to fight demons with guns.

>>55510946
Well before we get the ball rolling, you're doing exactly what you're accusing me of doing, that is, you're trying to enforce your opinions as law.

Now,
It wasn't clear if Norman was addicted to the tripto, or if he was addicted to the ARI glasses. There wasn't enough information given to be 100% sure, but from the signs, it was obvious that it was the ARI glasses he was addicted to - and you can't run tests on that sort of thing.
I never had him use tripto and the butler constantly warns him to never overindulge on "it" which we all thought to be tripto at one point.
He didn't take anything into his hands until the very end because he was with Blake the entire time. If anything, he simply thought outside the box from the other cops.

I dont see how Ethan treated Shawn as a nuisance. Especially after he did so much for him.
Cutting off his finger, driving on the wrong side of the rode, killing another human being. If he had thought Shawn a nuisance, he wouldn't have done any of that or he would have complained about it, but he didn't. It was obvious that he blamed himself for what happened to Jason and he didn't want Shawn to suffer the same sort of fate, so it could be said that he was doing it for himself as well as Shawn.

>>55511351

>the marine also has guns

Fixed for elegance.

>>55511351
Not enough belts, zippers or relying on friendship

PLAYING A GAME FOR THE STORY IS LIKE EATING SOUP BECAUSE YOU LIKE THE SPOON

>>55510946
And, since the children on /v/ spoiled it for me, I can't really comment on the whole Shelby thing.
I already knew he was the one due to the kids on /v/ but, due to the way the story was told, never really believed the spoiler until I saw him burn the pictures and all of the flash backs.

I have to say, I thought it was well done. And a lot of it did made sense since the game never directly lied to the player.

I disagree, OP. Without a good story none of it really matters does it?
We need a bigger meaning to things that explains the gameplay, gives you a reason to do it.

It doesn't apply to every games, but in particular in RPGs, where the battles aren't a strong aspect of the game, you need a good story to excuse it, to make it worth your while and make you want to keep going.

I'm not saying a story is necessary to every game, but for example Persona wouldn't be as interesting if it were just a string of battles, like say, Strange Journey mostly was.

>We need a bigger meaning to things that explains the gameplay, gives you a reason to do it.

hmm, well, no, because here's the thing - if you need a reason to 'do' the 'gameplay', then guess what? you're just playing a shit game.

>>55511658
Taste = Story
Nutritional value/to satisfy your hunger = gameplay
Bowl = console
Spoon = controller

HURR because you hold them both in your hands, right? DERRR

>>55511898
>>55511898
>>55511898
>>55511898
>>55511898
>>55511898
>>55511898
>>55511898
>>55511898
>>55511898
>>55511898
>>55511898
>>55511898
>>55511898
>>55511898
>>55511898

This a million times over.
I bet there's a lot of you out there who don't eat things purely for nutritional value.

>>55511898
Awesome.

>>55511135

Or you know, you could appreciate it as fiction.

Do I really think that most of the plot elements in Final Fantasy VII are made with incredible writing? No, not in the least. But I find the story interesting all the same.

If a fantastical story manages to incorporate elements that fit its overall setting then I can appreciate it all the same. But when a story becomes fucking stupid, thats when it gets bad.

Prime example, Metal Gear Solid. Most of /v/ seems to think that the story of the MGS series is ridiculous. Why? Its fiction for gods sake and its not like the game has fucking flying space llamas. Most of the people who seem to think that nanomachines are behind everything dont understand everything that happened. I personally think that the overall story of MGS, starting from MGS3 all the way to the end of MGS4, is very interesting and isnt TOO ridiculous to the point of not being able to take it seriously.

Its the same thing as if you watched Dragon Ball Z as a kid. Of course its impossible for people to channel their natural energy into destructive beams but at least the concept of chi was incorporated into the reason why everyone on that show can do the shit they do. Its impossible but its not entirely ridiculous and its interesting to think about and imagine.

I think the problem with most of the people on /v/ is they entirely lack that sense of wonder and what if and imaginative thinking.

>>55511898
Not really, I think it varies with different people.

>>55512152

faggot nigger

>>55511895
Again, it depends on the genre, but if we're talking RPGs, as I explained, the gameplay just doesn't change enough and it gets boring after a while.

And besides, just doing something brainlessly is kind of boring after you're 13 years old. If there's no meaning to your actions or no goal in sight then you just get bored, like it happened with many games I've played as of late.

Sure the gameplay is enough to entertain me for a while, but after I've explored it enough it starts getting old, and I'm not even halfway done with the game, and without an interesting story or meaning to it I just don't feel like going on.

Again, I must stress that I'm mostly talking about RPGs.

>>55511531
>Now, it wasn't clear if Norman was addicted to the tripto, or if he was addicted to the ARI glasses.
The ARI glasses were the only unrealistic thing in this game. If it's true that his addiction was to them, then that's equally poor writing. It's a plot device created out of convenience. Hell, if they wanted to, it could have shot lazers or would read minds.

>I dont see how Ethan treated Shawn as a nuisance. Especially after he did so much for him.
I must admit, I haven't played the game since release so I'm a bit fuzzy, but as a father myself I distinctly remember laughing at how he acted around Shawn. Not only did he not get him therapy, but he treated him like a stanger. Shawn was clearly depressed yet Ethan gave him space instead of trying to get to the root of the problem. He lived in a shit apartment, but instead of buying alot of food and cooking for him, he fed his son an apple or slice of cold pizza like he was his fucking college roommate.

>>55512302
good point there, /b/.

>bioshock - story
>Half life - story

>>55512406

you guys missed out on onosakumaru in a bi video gamer thread on friday night. he went anon and was posting embarrassing reaction pics of himself while complimenting all the boys and their junk shots. then a trap showed up and he got jealous.

>>55511898
>Taste = Story

Wouldn't taste be whatever you prefer? I mean, I couldn't give too shits about story but just about everyone cares about taste.

>>55512366

yeah, but the simplest answer is almost always the true answer. in this case, the simple truth is this - most "RPGs" are shit.

of course there are some exceptions, like fire emblem and a few roguelikes.

>>55512397
Why do you keep bringing up realism as a factor?
And stop calling it "poor writing".
It seems like they intentionally left it open for others to speculate, otherwise they could have simply said it.

"Show not Tell"

>>55512577
Have you been cheating on me, Onsokumaru? You fucker.

>>55512577
really?

>>55512172
You're trying to relate story to realism, which is fucking retarded.

Story is important to the extent that if, taking one of your examples, Goku waltzed on in the a new episode with a third arm with no explanation whatsoever.

That's a bad story.

As long as everything is explained well enough then a good story can be made about any kind of reality.

story is important in some games but in games like lost planet and racing games its the gameplay thats most important

the background story has to fit.
The time spent playing should make your story, not the cutscenes.

>>55512397
Oh, forgot about the Ethan thing.
Don't you remember what Ethan said during therapy?
He feels like he isn't allowed to be happy around Shawn, and that Shawn isn't happy and blames him for what happened to Jason.
It's not that Ethan treats Shawn as a nuisance, but he's just having trouble going back to the way things were.

>>55512687

haha yes I swear on everything that's good in this world it happened

a bunch of people saw it and called him out.

PEOPLE SHOULD THINK LIKE ME BECAUSE I AM BIAS AND ALWAYS RIGHT ACCORDING TO ME. IF YOU DONT YOU ARE A FAG AND DESURVE TO DIE!

thats what your saying op....well....basically saying. dont start complaining about stupid shit like this, it's pathetic

>>55512397

The reason the butler was telling Norman not to overindulge is not because he was getting addicted to the glasses, its because the glasses were making him hallucinate.

You said you've never played the game so theres this one scene where Norman starts hallucinating in a hotel room, and his hotel room is turning into scenery that was exactly the same as one of the environment settings on the ARI glasses.

The ARI glasses warp his sense of reality and cause him to hallucinate. The triptocaine suppresses the hallucinations but its also harmful to him.

>>55512687
>>55512669
>>55512577
>>55512849
Long story short, there was a bi thread, I complimented some traps in the making and someone from MSN posted my pic.

That's all that happened. Goddamn.
Unless he's talking about something that happened after I went to sleep.

>>55500670
Had me going there for a sec

>>55512690
No dude the point I was trying to get across was your last sentence.

>As long as everything is explained well enough then a good story can be made about any kind of reality.

>>55500670

The guy who made Final Fantasy admitted he couldn't make good games.

"I've always prefer'd telling stories."

OP, the games you see as bad have stories, yes? Try and see them as interactive stories rather than games.

Feel free to still not like them of course. My brother doesn't like Harry Potter and that shit is so critically aclaim'd.

I guess whether or not story is a big part of it is up to the developers, and whether or not you like that just depends on your tastes.
Heavy Rain: Almost entirely story, not much gameplay.
Bioshock: Lot's of story. Still good gameplay, though the gameplay itself does nothing to seperate itself from other FPS's, so really bioshocks success is based on the story.
LOZ: Most games have a story, that I think are pretty interesting.

>>55512924

My mistake, you HAVE played the game, I read your post wrong.

>>55512989
Man, you're quite the internet celebrity these days. How does it make you feel?

>>55512634
Because you need realism in a crime drama. If the characters act completely different than how you would act, than you don't care about them and no tension is built up. Why would i give a fuck about some guy's kid when the father apparently doesn't revolve his life around his son like every other father ever. The only time fathers treat their kids this way are when they're deadbeat dads. How can I relate to a deadbeat dad? Why would I care if he loses a finger or not? Heavy Rain is a perfect example of the writers "telling" us to feel emotions instead of "making" us feel emotion.

>It seems like they intentionally left it open for others to speculate, otherwise they could have simply said it.
That's fine in things like parodies, social commentaries, and manifestos, but in crime drama it's just retarded. We're supposed to feel a sense of closure at the ending, not sit there scratching our heads.

>>55513214

You're forgetting important details though.

After Shawns death, Ethan got divorced from his wife and he was living alone in that apartment. Shawn was only visiting him, his mother still had custody.

And because of the fact that his wife blamed him for Shawns death and he blamed himself, he felt he was a deadbeat dad anyway.

>>55512989

Hahaha you liar. It was you who was posting a shit load of your pics. You were taking reaction pics to suit your comments. There was no way someone had all those pics that just HAPPENED to exactly suit the posts. You weren't complimenting traps. You were complimenting dudes and flirting with them. You even said you weren't bi... so by inference that means you're gay. Which is fine except you keep trying to hide it. Stop being a pussy. It's the internet.

Hell, we even called you out in that thread and you just said "Me and onsokamuru look alike don't we?"

How many nigger faggots who know the name onsokumaru do we have here?

My guess is 1.

>>55513214
That's why you had the choice of what to do in some situations.
Drive along the rode or not?
Cut off your finger or not?
The choice of shooting the drug dealer with the daughters or not?

At the end of the day, it was all very realistic, but there were stuff here and there that you could manipulate.

And, personally, the style they used in leaving some points to speculation is fun.
I love dissected stories and discussing different interpretations.

And then there is the matter of DLC which I'm sure will clear up some holes.
Like what happens to Jayden when TANKS TANKS TANKS and the whole Tripto/ARI glasses thing.

>>55513386

lol holy shit

>>55513386
>How many nigger faggots do we have here?
Onso and Sho

>>55513386
Response from Onsokumaru in 2, everyone put this thread on hold until then.

>>55513031
Then you misunderstood my first post, my whole point with the

>If a person feels like they need to say "That story was bullshit" then it obviously does matter.

The "that story was bullshit" part wasn't meant to be about the players feelings towards the story by trying to relate it to our reality.

I was trying to convey the fact that if a story doesn't add up (eg Goku walks in with a 3rd arm for no reason) then it will subtract to the overall joy.

My argument was against the OP's post which was basically "Games don't need good story structure" which basically means that he's saying that story doesn't matter, which is false because any game about anything can be made better with good story structure.

>>55513386
Ohh so something DID happen after I went to sleep.
I was only in that bi thread after I came back from work.

Either that or you're lying.

they see me trolling

>>55513894

Hahahaha give it up, homosakumaru

>>55513894

phoenix wright: ace attorney is no substitute for law school

lrn 2 defend

My own backlash against stories is that once great series without stories have been destroyed by tacking on this unnecessary bullshit. Like Metroid no longer having Metroids.

Yeah, OP, so you say you'd feel the same way after killing terrorists and then disarming a nuke or overthrowing an oppressive government with close friends dying/betraying you along the way and you are the only one able to do it?

>>55514210
Samus is now part Metroid. Title is appropriate if you ask me.

>>55513894

At least we got you to admit that you were actually in the thread. Before you denied even posting in it.

>>55514536
Seems like he's talking about a different thread.
The one I'm talking about died then I went to sleep.

>>55514665

lol lies

I'd rather a readan game than a graphics hog, if neither had gameplay depth. Of course, if both had gameplay I'd want both, and if only one had gameplay I'd pick gameplay over anything. I'm a gameplay whore with appreciation for story, not as something necessary but something nice to add on. Graphics, on the other hand, they not only do nothing positive for me, but too much of the usual brown/grey turns me away from a lot of games.

In other words, gameplay is god, anything else is a nice add-on at best.

>>55510083

>No More Heroes

No More Heroes had a premise, a simple one that could have worked but didn't due to almost every other aspect of the game being garbage.

>>55513214

Christ, stop arguing with Onso in regards to writing, story, or characterization. The guy thinks Twlight is a great movie, and thought Valkyria Chronicles was flawless.

>>55500670
>Story doesn't fucking matter
>Setting matters
>Characters matter

last i figured out, setting and characters are part of the story.

>>55515218
But you didn't even play Heavy Rain.
And he's interpreting some things wrong.

Didn't know you're one to hold a grudge.

>>55515297
Gears of War has a good story.

>ctrl+f
>legacy of kain
>0 results
the fuck is wrong with you, /v/?

I like a good story. Stories are nice.
I don't mean "plot" or "narritive" whatever, just... a good story.
A bunch of flashy cinematic gibberish, and/or melodramatic drama is not a "story" either.
It's hard to explain what I mean, but I will say this as well.

Plot and Gameplay and all the other elements of a game are not competing for control. You can have all of them. True you usually don't, but it's not impossible.
Cave Story is a good example. It has a nice story, it has nice music, it has amazing gameplay. It doesn't seem particularly lacking an any area. it does everything it does well. Doesn't sacrifice anything. it has a nice balance between elements that I think other developers could stand to learn a little from.

>>55515339

Who are you to tell how something should be interpreted?

I guess it's kind of hard to believe trust any of your interpretations when I seriously doubt your knowledge when it comes to the basics of storytelling or characterization even in regards to the simplest aspects of them. All the games I've heard you talking about crying at, such as Valkyria Chronicles for example, leads me to believe you have very loose emotions and even the most poorly written character deaths or stories will serve as a basis for you to cry or get emotional for and you don't even question the matter at hand.

>>55515975
Well feel free to join the convo.
You're welcome to read whats already been posted and add anything else.

>>55500670

>>55500670

Look, bro. It's a terrible thing that you've got the attention span of a five year old, but the reality is, without a story, every game is the exact same. I wouldn't need to play a new FPS if it didn't have some kind of story. The story shapes the environment. Without a story, we could all just play Doom and Counter-Strike 24/7, because between them, those 2 games have encompassed basically every other element of every FPS released today.

Enjoy your Call of Duty.

>OP
>inb4