To illustrate, Growth stands opposite of Decay, yet displays traits of both Chaos and Order.

A character (or diety, or organization) can choose to define themselves according to either one alignment, or two, in which case one pole serves as the dominant, and the other the subordinate. Some possible interactions between dominant and subordinate include:

Growth & Chaos represent creation; Growth & Order, cultivation.
Order & Growth represent protection; Order & Decay, domination.
Chaos & Growth represent expansion; Chaos & Decay, destruction.
Decay & Chaos represent consumption; Decay & Order, subversion

The interaction between opposite alignments is more complex, and has a more linear structure.

When Growth triumphs over Decay, it represents evolution.
When Decay turns Growth to its own ends, it represents corruption.
When out of Chaos emerges Order, it represents inspiration.
When Order and Chaos something something. Obession [jazz hands].

I'm less pleased with these, but what can you do?


Overall, it's certainly more value-neutral than the typical 'GELC' axis, and less abstract than the Classical or Eastern elements, and with a bit of stretching, nearly any character, institution, or philosophy can be placed in a quadrant, or at the confluence of two.

Sorry for Timecubing on everyone.

Where did you come up with this?

So the 4 WH40k Chaos Gods. Got it.

I still say the best alignment system is none. A character's morality should be defined by what they say and do.

Where'd you get them icons

I like what I see thus far.

I've been needing an alignment system in my setting for a while. Might use this one.

>>10562406
>>10562369

That's it.

>>10562407

Yeah, but people are going to like a way to classify the different gods of your pantheon wherever you go.

>>10562388

Don't really care for the contents of this post. Everything else seems cool, though.

>>10562406
Ain't no Chaos god of Order, to be fair.

Well not in 40K. WF, if I remember correctly, has Order gods which work the same as Chaos.

>>10562419
I like using pantheons from history. People don't really need to know Zeus's or Odin's alignment.

>>10562406
...

So which of the four Chaos Gods represents Order?

>>10562407
Not if you're looking to underscore conflict between good and evil.

>>10562445
>Implying /tg/ doesn't try to classify both of them using the standard GE-LC scale every time an alignment thread rolls around.

You may or may not have played HoMM4 before you got stoned and got this.

It's not a bad alignment system but I think that fact that it's not nearly as precise as G/E-L/C and more allegorical presents the same problems as the standard system. People will have differing views and opinions on what each alignment means, even if you spell it out for them like they do for the normal alignment system. Yours can possibly be even more vague.

I'll stick with the Myers/Briggs test for simplifying a character's personality and possible motivations.

For more fun I sometimes use the taoist Elemental Zodiac as an alignment system. Each character is one part chinese element (water, wood, fire, earth and metal) and one part chinese zodiac (horse, dog, boar, snake etc...)

It adds flavor, especially to far east settings.

Im not very big on alignment systems. I just throw it out in my campaigns. Most of the time a player will exercise many different types of morality in a single session, so why bother.

>>10562505
The conflict between good and evil bores me. Frankly, I want a world where tough gray choices have to happen.

>>10562537 everyone can only play the kinds of games I like
Oh, ok.

The best alignment system is the one that doesn't exist because characters should have more depth than a cardboard cutout

>>10562563

Stop that. He's not saying that and you're just going to get everyone trolled if you keep that up.

>>10562537

The fact that it bores provides a good explanation for why you wouldn't want to use an alignment system of any kind, but you must at least acknowledge that it can prove useful for those who DO want a straightforward conflict between good an evil.

>>10562400
>Where did you come up with this.

I stayed up til 5:00 am last night obsessing over this with the singular focus that being high occasionally brings.

I was thinking about doing five alignments, but when I knocked one out of the equation, it all came together.

>>10562408
>Where'd you get them icons.

Made 'em. 5000 hours in MS Paint and such.

>>10562407
Of course. But morality doesn't really come into this. It's more about what drives a characters on the most fundamental level. Their personalities, interests, and actions exist in concert with, and in spite of it.

>>10562532
>Most of the time a player will exercise many different types of morality in a single session.
Same thing here.

>>10562588
>The fact that it bores YOU*

fixed

[disclaimer, I have not read the entire thread, just OP]

Yeah, I have something similar in my homebrew system.

Chaos, Order, Creation and Destruction. Each of these are also tied in with an Element.
Air, Earth, Water, Fire, in that order.

Fun thing to play with mostly, and using it more to define the forces that created the fantasy setting I'm working on.

>>10562656
But you forgot Heart!

>>10562407
This.

>>10562564
>The best alignment system is the one that doesn't exist because characters should have more depth than a cardboard cutout

I agree with your principal, but many religions, mythologies, and philosophies are based on the concept that there's some fundamental working order. My intention was to create something like that was less contentious and restricting than 'good' and 'evil', and allow for more diverse interpretation.

I mainly did this, though, because the magic system of the game I'm creating a campaign for insists on an alignment system to serve as the source of dieties and divine magic.

good stuff OP, but I dont think it will catch on

>>10562532
What do you mean?
Alignment in my campaigns does have a bit of a bearing: Our group uses it as a guide, especially when we start new characters and have no idea how they're going to be played.
Alignment was also made to change, and should never be permanent.

Since we play D&D, it does have mechanical effects. But roleplay wise, we keep the alignment flexible.

>>10562753

Fantasy Craft, by any chance? It certainly could use this, at any rate.

>>10562656
I was thinking of using an elemental system, but I found it hard to line up any given element with one of the concepts I'd settled on, since every one of them displays them all to some degree. I also felt that I'd be obligated to find some representation of what happens when they interact (Air + Earth = ???).

>>10562817
Don't I know it.

>>10562841
A kindred soul!

Second Printing soon, fellow Crafter...

>>10562753
>I agree with your principal, but many religions, mythologies, and philosophies are based on the concept that there's some fundamental working order.
"Principle," and that's horrendously vague.

>>10562753

If youre trying to avoid the contentiousness of good/evil, then you might wanna change decay.

Generally, growth/decay is just another name for good/bad.

Order/Chaos isnt, since both can be good in their own way, but decay, especially contrasted with growth, is a bad.

>>10562916

The idea was.. They don't. Each of these forces wanted to make the world. But they couldn't let up. So.. after a series of horrid wars, the world was finally made, mostly because all sides threw all they had at it, to make sure none of the others could win. A bit like how Tolkien's world was created. One side destroying, one side building. Except, four sides building and at the same time destroying.

The only reason it got mixed up is that neither of the sides had the power to eliminate their opposing element/force, so it was still there.

>>10562979
Creation/destruction seem more fitting. Both are completely necessary and ambiguous.

Decay just sounds horrible

>>10562939
>"Principle," and that's horrendously vague.
Aye aye. Again, I was up til 5:00 am last night.

But it's true though, isn't it? The human mind seeks to make sense of its surroundings, and philosophers and theologians have existed since time immemorial. I was just looking for a system that allowed characters to describe their principles on the absolute most fundamental level, and allow dieties and divine magic to function in my game.

>>10562369
>Instead of the traditional Good/Evil, Law/Chaos axes, it's based upon Growth, Chaos, Decay, and Order, each pole existing in conflict with its opposite, and in balance between its neighbors.
It's worthless. Alignment is supposed to be a tool to describe character motivation and behaviour. This system is not useful for that purpose, only for bizarre and useless metaphysics.

OP, I think you have the wrong idea of what an alignment system is
this is far more an elemental scheme

>>10562979
I agree that Decay has a slightly more negative connotation (as does 'Chaos', for that matter) than the others, but I really can't think anything to help that. Since it represents, in addition to oblivion, consumption and accumulation of power, plenty of characters will still be drawn to it.

>>10563039
I chose the terms I did because they look good grouped together, being close together in length and syllables, and don't start with the same letter. I'm an aesthete at heart.

>>10563091
Man, show me an alignment system that isn't.

>>10563091
>This system is not useful for that purpose, only for bizarre and useless metaphysics.
>>bizarre and useless metaphysics.

I'LL TAKE TWELVE! PUT THEM ON THE CART WITH THE ORGONE COLLECTOR AND THE JACOB'S LADDER!

OP, you sound pretentious.

>I've created what I think to be a superior alignment system

>>10562841
>>10562930
Here, here, and hail.

I like these as Alignments for FC purposes.

>>10563369
It's a combination of pride of workmanship, lack of sleep, and an intentionally contentious tone to make more people want to respond.