Takes some amount of balls to go through with it. I say it's your life do what you want with it. It's up to friends, family, and anyone else who cares to stop you.

>>9676537
There's nothing inherently wrong with it.

However emotions are temporary, people would kill themselves on a whim, while in the next moment be all "huh, well it's not so bad".

Kinda like people thinking about cumming in their own mouth.

It's selfish.

>>9676594
So....?

sobloxtgothe4thbowerwall

>>9676585
>emotions are temporary
Not OP, but I've been depressed for about 4 years.
My mother has been depressed for about ~10 years.
I have two uncles that have killed themselfs from depression.
My grandfather on my mothers side also killed himself from depression.

For me the case is genetic, and I'm not going to feel better any time soon. Suicide looks better and better every day.

>>9676585

These are wise words. Every now and then, /r9k/ manages not to be total shit.

Once you're dead, it won't matter what anyone else thinks.

>>9676658
Yah yah, for the most part, they are temporary. You satisfied?

Kill yourself. There's nothing wrong with it.

>>9676669
These are wise words.

iagree100percent.png.exe

>>9676681
I plan to. The only way I get though the day is a promise to myself. I'm going to kill myself when I run out of money, which will happen someday.

Have you read Battle Angel Alita? In Tiparthes, theres a suicide booth on every corner and even though the place is paradise compared to the trash heap down below, they believe that it is every citizen's choice to kill themselves or not.

I can tell you that from my experience that wanting to kill yourself is just a way of covering up your insecurities and denying yourself any hope. People like that need help, they got that way because of environmental and genetic factors, not because they decided purely they wanted to kill themselves out of a rational choice.

Those people did exist though, they were called Stoics and if they lost their dignity they would kill themselves, similar to samurai. I can assure you that not even five percent the of people thinking about suicide care about those things.

>>9676711
>a manga series created by Yukito Kishiro

There's nothing inherently wrong with anything if you want to believe that.

>>9676709
Huh, I'm less emo about it, but I have the same thought. Basically, once/if I'm forced to become a drone/hobo, I'll put on my trollface and "escape".

Too much of a pussy though, only way I'm prepared to go is GUNSHOT TO THE HEAD FUCKYEAR. None of this slow dying shit.

Read Myth of of Sisyphus by Albert Camus.

I forgot, the internet, right.

Anyways, depression is treatable.
You take meds, you do things that make you happy, you work to put yourself in a better situation, and then maybe you could try to gradually stop taking the meds and see how you feel.

That's what I did with my bipolar symptoms and anxiety attacks.

and it is selfish, and I believe not giving yourself up to some greater cause is lazy and selfish, whether that cause be fixing cars and making art.

>>9676753
Being a drone is my lifes dream. Like, taking a drug that blocks my personality.

My dream...

The only problem is the people around you.
I wish I never made friends now. I just don't feel right leaving them in despair.

>>9676765
Selfish to whom? You owe the world nothing, and the world owes you nothing in return. The only cause worth living for is self-determined you fascist.

>>9676765
Meds really did work for you and helped you work at making life better? I also suffer from bipolar disorder and anxiety and refuse to believe meds help those things. I think I just need to hear it from someone else who suffers rather than someone obviously trying to make money off of me.

>>9676778
If personality is randomly determined by chemicals, than why not alter them?

>>9676711

All so-called "rational choices" we make are influenced by irrational factors, such as mood, instincts or time of the day. For example, wanting to stay alive is a continuation of the survival instinct, which is not rational because it does not stem from the conscious mind. Unless you focus on going against it, you'll raise your hands when you fall and other things like that.

>>9676658

It's a well recorded fact that most people who attempt suicide and survive change their minds as their falling through the air or whatever.

>>9676829
>randomly
>completely ignores neurons and electrical fuckery in the brain.

You sure understand the human psyche brah,

>>9676860
Hmm... sounds just like what people say... about cumming in their mouths.

There is nothing wrong with it.

People always shout "make something out of your life, it's your life". And suicide is one option.

if you actually want to kill yourself you should use potassium cyanide

>>9676863
It probably just seems random to him because he understands little or no science behind the brain.

For that matter there is no universally agreed on explanation of consciousness.

>>9676909
how do i get it?
can i order it online? lol, get it at school? (in college)

mootybloxxy.png

>>9676863
By randomly I really meant to say "has little to do with our own choices" or determined.

>>9676800

What if you knew for a fact that the people around you would be happier without you?

>>9676914
Yes there is.
It's electrical fuckery in the brain.

The details are sketchy though.

>>9676829

Because they're expensive. Then again, if drugs make you happy and productive, you get money so you can afford them and much, much more.

The only reasonable arguments against such behaviour are from a societal scale: some drugs decrease life-spans and thus working age, some make people and most can/will lead to crime. On a personal level, though, cry havoc and be thine own master.

>>9676930

pretty sure you go to a jeweler and say you need to clean jewelry. if you drink of a solution of it you'll pass out relatively quickly and completely painlessly.

IIRC

>>9676931
Determined is kinda the, I dunno, OPPOSITE of random? But really, if you wanna be all philosophical about it, go ahead and be a bitch.

Realize one thing though, you don't know shit.

>>9676809
Well, I do believe at least I owe the world something.
There are things that I like about the world, and somebody has not killed their self and took time to make it. Endless people have worked towards creating things or services that make being alive a little easier. And certainly, there have also been douches making life harder, but so what?
I feel like I owe the future something; a movie, a tv show, a book, a compute program, whatever.

>>9676815
Yes, there is a history of it in my family, I started to notice symptoms, took a low dose of seroquel and an anti depressant for a few months, and during those months I found the things that would trigger unhappiness or mood swings and removed myself from them as best as I could. I stopped taking them because I didn't want to become reliant and blahaba healthcare sdcjdck

Every worker is an asset to society.
All workers have a great potential to exploit this asset status and create new opportunities for the benefit of society.
Depriving society of this asset is an offensive maneuver AGAINST the advancement of society.

>>9676961
Here's what will happen:
>"HURR DRUKS! I'LL BE HAPPEH 4 SURE!"
>shoots up untill out of cash
>"I NEED MOAR!"
>Turn to crime, steal from your friends, alienate everyone, who cares right? Just need more drugs, well your friends are a finite resource, soon they won't tolerate your shit. Then:
>if female:
>whore out for cash.
>if male:
>..... whore out fo- ok that won't work.
>eventually starve to death with no job and no drugs.
Awesome fate in store.

the ability to choose should be respected
however by taking your own life you remove your ability to choose
problem?

>Is there anything inherently wrong with suicide?

Its selfish.

>>9677021
just say to the "society" that i am going to be late.
that is all.

>>9677030

Good point. Drugs are bad because crime is easier if you're sober. Unless you have an anxiety disorder, in which case weed might help you pull the heist.

>>9677032

Nah, it counts as a super-choice.

>>9677021

>saying and wording it like we would be slaves of the society

No thank you. It's your choice.

People like to say easily "It's your life, make something out of it".
But when it comes to suicide..it goes like this "hurrdurr, so wrong, bad etc."

>>9677097
Well, maybe you'd get away with it:
>become crime lord
>all the cash and drugs you need

>>9677021
Social contract. If the cost of working for society outweighs the benefits gotten from society, then contract terminated.

Since benefits are emotional in nature here, there is no value unbalance from expecting society to "give more". Imagine ugly person going through a miserable life at a minimum wage. Society is being exploitative.

>>9677132

>die in Scarface-style shootout
>become famous post-humously
>live forever (or at least until 2012)

Organised crime might be fun if you could make your way relatively painlessly to the top quarter.

It's a lot more selfish of other to expect you to keep on living when the your pain is permanent (making suicide not a permanent solution to a temporary problem but a better alternative to a permanent problem i.e. terminal illness, not being able to achieve your life's dreams).

Hahah, i wonder how people , who insistently only write "it's selfish", answer to this question.

If you don't plan on being a productive (god,this is so vague..) member of society for whatever reason, what is better and less selfish?

Get rid of yourself and stop being a burden as a leech for society.

Or continue your life as a leech?

>>9677205
if you don't plan on even trying to be productive somewhat that your dumbass tripcode name is correct

>>9677205
It's just their PCness talking, most of the "it's selfish" responses come from people who have never really thought it through.

>>9677233

Wrong, good sir. I was the first to say "It's selfish" and then explained why I feel that way.

>>9677205

this shouldn't be a reason for suicide.

people state that suicide is either selfish because its hurts them emotionally which is void because if your pain is permanent than your it is your choice alone and it would make you not only happier in ending the pain, your pain is also greater than theirs.

furthermore, seeing people say that suicide isn't moral because it means that society loses a worker shows me that they value people's contributions to society more than theur inherent worth as a human being

>>9677123
Our choice? Why would it need to be our choice?
If you are going to believe in any morality, believe in progressive benevolence and cumulative advancement for the Human species.
From an objective perspective, most humans dedicate their life to selfish and personal progression toward their own Paradise. This is useless, as death is final; Whether or not deities exist, humans do not come back to Earth (even in reincarnation, you must start over) with their possessions or their personal gains.
Thusly, the only permanent contribution to society would be an artificial (not "fake," but "man-made." You know, the original meaning of the word) advancement of the collective Homo sapiens Quality of Life.
Your genes will outlive you.
Your community will outlive you.
Your environment will outlive you.
Either contribute or become a (by this examination's definition) detriment to society.

Understandable?

I haven't had anything to drink for 28 hours and I'm going to continue eating bread whenever I get hungry while I slowly shrivel up

>>9677222
>>9677260

social contracts shouldn't be the reason against suicide. besides, if a person wants to kill themselves they are going to, regardless of your bullshit obligation to society arguments

>>9677303
DUDE I WANT SOME BREAD.
SO JEALOUS

It's my firm belief that suicide is the only true way to determine if a person has any real sort of control over their life.

In our (natural) lifetime they're probably going to develop narcotics and technology that will allow someone to enter a state of seemingly eternal bliss.

You're basically giving up IRL heaven just to escape your current problems.

JUST HANG ON AND WAIT FOR THE FUTURE TO BLOW YOUR MIND.

>>9677288

What i meant with choice. It's your view on things and it's your choice for having such a view.

Don't force your opinion on other people.

But sure i understand that you are a radical utilitarian.

Yes. Thou Shalt Not Kill, even yourself.

>>9677288

some people find their genes to be undesirable and their legacy unworthy.

i for one will commit suicide when im 27 or if there is no hope of achieving my life goals, earlier. my genes are inferior, i am ugly and have a host of personality problems. there is no legacy i can leave behind. suicide is my choice

>>9677330
IMO, if someone chooses to kill themselves, then society couldn't "provide" for them.

Expecting that person to give to society then is selfish from society's standpoint.

Society is not your "master", it's a symbiotic relationship, if you think otherwise, then clearly we've lost focus here.

>>9677288
>Either contribute or become a (by this examination's definition) detriment to society.
By living in society, you are, in one way or another, using up some portion of society's resources.
If you truly believe in this social contract explanation, you would require all people who don't provide at least as much as they take to kill themselves. With due respect to their future potential contributions, of course.

>>9677288

If your life by itself is useless because it ends, then logically everything is useless because everything will one day end.

>>9677330
It's not a contract, you don't have to do anything if you don't want to. And you only should if you want to.

I just think it takes a whole lot more to not want to contribute than to actually contribute.

>>9677412

as another already said

>Social contract. If the cost of working for society outweighs the benefits gotten from society, then contract terminated.

if a person finds no pleasure in life or sees has no chance of ever finding pleasure, then it is his/her choice

>>9677403

Ooh, are you going to self-terminate when you're 10k days old, too?

>>9677414
What's a resource and what's a value?

I assume many are happy so long as they have a wife and steady job. In that sense, society has provided for them, and they provide for society.

>is there anything inherently wrong

no, right and wrong are imaginary and subjective

next

>>9677494
you're good... can I keep you?

>>9677403
A colossal percent of suicide victims do not agree with my roles of society. I understand that many detrimental humans have offed themselves, but for a much different motive than a justifiable realization of their lack of worth.
In practice of progressive society, detriments would be criminally tried, with what is now "community service" being a much more common "punishment." If they bore no worth (Mentally disabled people with no means of rehabilitation/no "gift"), they would obviously be removed from society (Exiled, if the society felt that death was too harsh of a punishment [Which I never understood]).

>>9677455

this.

although i said in this thread that social contracts shouldnt be a reason against suicide, society should have no obligation to leave you in your misery

>>9677399

Or what? Arbitrary rule is arbitrary.

>>9677503
Not the guy, but how about this one:
Right and Wrong only matter when describing how an action affects a desired outcome. If the action promotes the outcome, then it's right, if it does not, it's wrong.

>>9677494

Ooh, clever. Good boy.

>>9677471

A resource is something that is needed and/or used by an actor.

A value is the associated threshold of how much effort the actor is willing to expend to obtain said resource.

To the idiots who only reason that suicide is selfish, what the hell do you think everything you do all day is? Not selfish? Every action you take is for selfish reasons. Stop being hypocrites.

>>9677569
The question was rhetorical... but thanks anyway. I was just pointing out that there was not necessarily a value imbalance since the "perceived" value is the one that matters.

>>9677521
Well, I'm glad we agree. *hand shake*

>>9676669
>ergo, everyone should kill themselves

it's selfish.

I have three people in my life whose friends/family killed themselves. One by hanging when the daughter (my best friend) was eight years old. One shot herself right in front of my ex, he friend, and the last was my uncle, who just went to his bathroom, dismantled a razor and crossed the superhighway with it (cut his own jugular)

It's selfish because even if it seems horrible to live, there are people you're going to leave behind, lives that are going to be irrevocably changed because you were too much of a fucking pussy to man up and take it.

My best friend, a girl I love with everything I have left to give, lives in an unending hell because of what her mother did. She will never escape that shadow.

oh, and trust me, I was there. I was about to finish the last knot around my neck not a few years ago. I could not be happier that I was found before I was lost to the world. Yeah, life still sucks but I can handle it now, because I'll never go back to the point ever again.

Someone /will/ miss you, anon. If you're too much of a pussy to think of your own potential, think of theirs.

>>9677553

religious morals are void, ignore him

>>9677507

your roles of society are utilitarian and apathetic. to say that a person is only worth how much he/she gives to society is to take away all worth from life.

>>9677615
They took the misery they'd leave behind in account. Their pain was more. How selfish of you is it to force their existence so you can be at peace?

You're disgusting.

>>9677590
Hypocrisy has no meaning in the "right" or "wrong" world.
PREMISE:
You believe murdering is morally unjust.
You are talking to a murderer.
POSITION:
The murderer posits, "Murdering is wrong."
CONSEQUENCES:
The murderer is being hypocritical.
You agree with the murderer.
You agree with a Hypocrite.
The murderer posited a hypocritical BUT agreeable statement.

>>9677507

The system that you're describing has, at least from my perspective, one massive problem: it would work, i.e., it would be really, really boring.

Crime, terrorism, financial and political instability, war, fear, discrimination, violence, accidents and loss are all exciting, interesting and, most importantly, *fun*!

Sure, they all scare me shitless if they get within a mile from me, but without the news, where would I get my daily dose of feeling alive? Nascar?

Boredom's pretty much the only reason I'd off myself. Luckily for the people around me, I'm still enjoying myself.

>>9677615
Grow up. Grief is a part of adult life. If you or others can't handle it, kill yourselves, too.

Why don't people who want to die join the army and rip shit up then get killed on purpose?

Why do you never see people who want to commit suicide do a bunch of coll shit first, like go sky diving or whatever?

>>9677615

because their loss of a loved one that they can get over is a greater pain to them than the crushing pain that is felt by serious suicide victims (why victims? it was their choice). people who are left behind after a suicide will always be able to find happiness elsewhere in life, and happiness for themselves. people who commit suicide because of serious reasons have nowhere else to go and usually do it because they will never find happiness.

>>9677615
If the pain they caused by offing themselves was NOT enough to drive the others to suicide, THEN WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU BITCHING ABOUT?

Too many christian moralists on /r9k/

Get off. Seriously. Get off. You might feel better.

>>9677630
Where is this worth derived? I applied a worthiness to ALL humans: Their ability to further advance the efficacy and functionality of further lives.
If everyone applies this potential, success seems guaranteed, and the quality of life would soar in current and future generations.
If people were indoctrinated with THESE beliefs, and not, "Remember the little people when you get rich, kid," I believe that others would think less selfishly, or their SELFISH actions would have SELFLESS tendencies.

>>9677680

That's actually a fair point. You might as well have fun because it's the last thing you'll ever do.

>>9677738

Yes, but why should we?

>>9677738

to give a human life a worth based on utilitarianism and only how much they can provide to society is to take away human worth away altogether

i for one believe that human life automatically has infinite worth and stays that way until it interferes with other peoples' worth (i.e. Hitler; would you kill 5 normal people or 1 genius if you had to?)

inversely, this does not mean i dont believe that suicide is immoral because it is their choice and their benefit to society and future generations is irrelevant.

Your duty as a human being is to put the feeling of others before your own. Before you do anything in your life you should think about the affect it will have on others.

>>9677759

the same reason we dont go to the office with an ar-15 and shoot every man and woman that has ever treated us like dirt -- fear.

you think suicide is hard? try killing someone else when you ARENT a total psychopath

>>9677794
Bahaha.
Scroll up, young one.

>>9677830

ahah! and here is the flaw in "it selfish" logic. the pain of the suicide victims is usually greater than that of the people who were close to them.

also, what about people who have not close ones who care for them?

>>9677836
You are about to end your own life, the cessation of everything you have ever and will ever know and you are comfortable with that

What else do you have to fear?

>>9677830
If someone feels it is their right to rape you then it is your duty, based on your (il)logic, to lie down and take it.

>>9677726

>More like (extreme) utilitarian, who basically say that you are a slave to society and have no choice, and depending on your contribution , you may be a good, productive slave or a bad one

>>9677879

have you tried killing a human being? have you tried running into oncoming traffic? its harder than you think

>>9677857

Nope, sorry, can't see any legitimate justification for it anywhere in this thread.

>>9677819
I am not saying that the current generation has no worth--in fact, most "contributions" to this society would be immediate in reward. Everyone for the whole means all for one, and one for all.
Is that not the motto of most working states?

>>9677759
I would.

Unfortunately, my depressive history made me not eligible for the army. Basically when called in for mandatory service:
"You've been depressed, had thoughts of suicide?"
"Err, yes."
"Well, basically you can just go home now."
"Eh well. Off to higher education 1 year before everyone else."

>>9677906

I can't imagine either of those is much hard that pulling the trigger of a gun at you own head, or cutting your neck with a razor blade

>>9677938

Really? Mine was more along the lines of:

>*glance*
>"You're a healthy young man, on you go."

>>9677925

this generation? what about the individual human life? does it mean nothing to you? the human life has more meaning than just what it can give to others.

the whole flaw in utilitarian logic is that utilitarianism states that people should only do things to make things better for other people. what is the point of making others happy if they arent supposed to make themselves happy or dont want to?

>>9678011
I even checked the "I want to be in the army" option. Got the medical check first, they took a look, told me what I wrote, then "Go home. No need for the other tests."

That was quick.

>>9677925

>Everyone for the whole means all for one, and one for all.
Is that not the motto of most working states?

Is there any real socialist country out there? Otherwise there is not such a state with such a motto in reality.

>>9678051
I thought the musketeers said it, too.

>>9678051
It's simpler when you just look up to a God instead, or someone posing as God.

ALLAHU AKBAR!
NORTH KOREA IS BEST KOREA!

>>9678051


who's to say socialism and utilitarianism are the same and that socialism doesnt allow for selfish tendencies? socialism is more of an equilibrium while in utilitarianism people are only there to help others?

Suicide is selfish? Its selfish to want someone to prolong their easily endable suffering because of your retarded version(s) of "morality".

When someone that makes you happy kills themselves it detracts from your happiness so it becomes a bad thing Regardless of how much they suffer, if it detracts from the happiness of the collective, its bad.

That's fucking selfish.

inb4 oh you're so edgy nihilist derp

>>9678043
The point is that having millions of people focusing to make YOU happy is much better than making yourself happy. Additionally: If you put your effort into contributing for the whole, you are enhancing the life of everyone -- including yourself.
Restatement:
A SINGULAR BEING IS PART OF ITS WHOLE SPECIES.
A SUCCESSFUL, COLLECTIVE EFFORT TO ENHANCE THE QUALITY OF LIFE FOR THE WHOLE WILL YIELD AN ENHANCED QUALITY OF LIFE FOR THE SINGULAR.
The all-capital letters are to eliminate emphasis. Sorry if it offends you.

>>9678076
But that's why i am asking such a question.

Because that idiom alone itself would rather speak against his utilitaristic views!

>>9678148
You should know that your statements in this thread offer quite many logical fallacies.

>>9678218
I need evidence, not accusations.

>>9678148

that is true but to put all emphasis on this social obligation is to value a person's life based on how much they contribute is taking it too far.
when everyone works for both themselves and for others, we have a utopia. when we have everyone working for themselves we have a failed capitalism and when we have everyone working for everyone else we have unhappy utilitarianism

or not? im learning.

It doesn't take guts, think about what you are saying. Guts is almost never the path of least resistance. Suicide is specifically such a path.

You can't really honestly justify living or not, so just keep living. Whatever is on the other side can wait the 50 or so years you have left, and who knows, in the meantime you are bound to find stuff you like on this side.

That's philosophical. If you are legit considering suicide, just keep waiting, and don't do it. I thought about it probably daily for five years, but I kept plugging at school, friendships, etc. and now I know I don't want to do it. Matter of fact life has shown me I was born to be a leader. Just stick it out, and if that doesn't work, there's nothing wrong with therapy or pills, had numerous friends get on them, they're still great people with the same personality and respect and drive as ever.

When you're doing this low self esteem stuff, remember, people are actually awful at reading behavior. Nobody can look at you and know that you're suicidal or anything else going on in your head. Regarding success, fake it until you make it.

(Anyone who says they can do so are either lying [faith types] or at best misguided and generally judging with 20/20 hindsight. Truth comes from within.)

There are people in India working for a dollar a day with homes built of trash and they manage to be happy.

If you kill yourself just because you can't get a girlfriend or you think you're ugly or some other bullshit, you're just an idiot. It's a temporary phase (and yes, you can say "BUT I'VE BEEN LIKE THIS FOR YEARS", but 2-20 years is still a phase) and you can get over it through living eventually.

If you really think your life is bad enough that you're willing to kill yourself, buy a plane ticket to some random country and try to adapt. Your only other option is death, so no matter what happens, it can't be worse.

The only time I see suicide as a valid option is if it's 100% certain you have a terminal illness and you're only living to suffer more. If you're not strapped down to a bed and waiting to be consumed by cancer, your life still has potential.

That's just my outlook.

>>9678275

>ignoring that some people will never find happiness no matter how hard and long they try

>>9678148

i dont mean to sound like ayn rand here but that shouldnt be the primary concern of all human beings. of course we should help other people as much as we can, and how we help them shouldnt be based on utilitarian principles. this shouldnt have to interfere with how much we help ourselves

>>9678247
I am saying that by working for the whole, you are working for the singular.
If you develop a cure for ebola (Already happened, but this is situational), I am not saying that YOU cannot use the cure for ebola. I am saying that some people would start working on ebola for selfish purposes ("I have ebola, I need to cure it!" "My mom has ebola! I did not get on her good side yet! I need to cure it!"), a "morally just" person would notice ebola was a problem and work to contribute to the society.
My original argument is that your POTENTIAL to contribute to society is typically enormous (even if you work in a factory mass-producing machines for vaccines), and committing suicide is destroying that potential, which creates a detriment to society.

>>9678229
Well, if you read the arguments pointed at your post, you would get it.

>millions of people focusing to make YOU happy is much better than making yourself happy.

Where do you take that claim? Where is your base?
You also practically say that you can only be happy by contributing to society.
Also what if your claimed peope focusing of making YOU happy can't achieve it?

You have extreme radical views.
I am quite glad that society, atleast the one i live in, doesn't work this way.
I think North Korea will welcome you with open arms.
Ever considered of moving there?

>>9678340
>implying that there is an end goal of existence, and personal happiness is it

>>9678275
>It doesn't take guts, think about what you are saying. Guts is almost never the path of least resistance. Suicide is specifically such a path.
Have you ever tried to kill yourself? It is hard as fuck to do, because your body has the instinctive animal desire to live. It is hard as fuck to go against that biological imperative to stay alive.

Suicide should only ever be done for people other than yourself.

In most cases yes.
/thread

>>9678407
Most people that kill themselves intentionally do it because they're afraid to live.

Thus living is harder than suicide for those people; for a normal, healthy individual, it's the opposite.

>>9678148

Millions of people are focusing on making millions of people happy. If everyone does it, everyone gets the same amount of utility, which could be more or less than what they would get if everyone was acting solely for themselves.

>>9678275

Why?

>>9678301

Death isn't the worst thing, not by far.

>>9676658
>>9676658

its genetic alright.. your ugliness

you must be one ugly fat family ..

most of the good looking people arent depressed


pic related ; i trol u ..

>>9678428
>Death isn't the worst thing, not by far.
Name something worse than not existing.

>>9678361

regardless of motivation, benefits to society are always good, morals aside. if you want to take it from a moral standpoint, i stand my ground and say that sometimes the pain of life is permanent or so great that a person can justifiably commit suicide

everyone has potential. this irrelevant. again, a person's potential to society shouldnt determine their worth to society.

damnit i couldnt go thru this thread

generally i love these threads

no its too long, didnt read

>>9678413

Doesn't that violate some fundamental law of physics?

>>9678445

Existing.

>>9678361

You are gonna be the first one to supervise all your working ants, with the given technology for your arbitrary defined goals which will definitely make you happy.
You sound like some crazy dictator.

>>9678445

living everyday for the rest of your life in crushing physical, emotional or psychological pain.

for instance, if i had the choice to either be executed or be jailed for life, i would choose death because i would never find happiness in prison, and i am sure of that. is this suicide?

>>9678390

all schools of thought are to give people happiness in the end. when your strategy is to give happiness to people by taking it away from the, your strategy is flawed

>>9678445

The taken away freedom of not being able to not exist.

>>9678379
>Where do you take that claim? Where is your base?
The idiom "two heads are better than one" sums it up quite nicely, but more concretely, multiple people aiming to achieve one goal (the betterment of society in any form) will, on statistical average, be more efficient than one man doing so.
>You also practically say that you can only be happy by contributing to society.
I do not understand how you have derived this, but I was attempting to say that happiness (enhanced quality of life) would be a consequence of all beings working for the whole (and thusly the singular).
>What if your...peope [sic]...can't achieve it [Bettering society/Personal quality of life]?
Rest assured that success is inevitable, comrade. (Bahaha)
Statistically, you can read it as six billion people attempting to do ONE thing. Viewing this VERY GENERALLY, six billion cases multiplied by just one "act of betterment" per year, you get 6*72 billion separate cases.
At least one of those is bound to work, right?
>You have extreme radical views
I am attempting to be general to appeal to a large audience and grasp a wider range of attention -- some will agree, others will not.

I do not see any listed fallacies. Can you be more specific?

Oh wow.....almost 5 AM here.
Time to get some sleep.

>>9678492
>You are gonna be the first one to supervise all your working ants...
I do not want to limit these disciplines to systematic implementation. I would certainly decline any opportunity to "lead the people," as they are fully capable of motivating themselves (If they do not believe so, others can prove to be a very reliable source of encouragement).
Supervision should not be necessary if all moralists are truly morally just.
>You sound like some crazy dictator.
I have never intended to imply my desire to lead or implement this societal structure, especially not by force -- then again, "dictators" are elected, and can be immediately removed from the consulate by popular vote.
Did you mean "tyrant?"

>>9678596

>Viewing this VERY GENERALLY, six billion cases multiplied by just one "act of betterment" per year, you get 6*72 billion separate cases.

What did you pull that figure out of?

>>9678596
either troll or very retarded moron.
i hope that atleast you aren't a hypocrit and serve society to its fullest....

OH WAIT , you are steadily posting here on 4chan.

What the heck? You should be working for the betterment of the society! Posting here doesn't include this, you selfish troll.

you see, you really fucking dumb. promoting shit when you are breaking your own words.


northkorea best korea!

>>9678677
He thinks everyone lives to be 72, and that they will be willing to do these things when they are 1.

Well, this little amoralist is off to sleep. Busy day today.

>>9678703

S/he/it's not that bad, once you get to know him/her/it. Besides, they are providing utility for others through the medium of social contact and entertainment. There's no one way of measuring the aforementioned utility, after all; at least, not a way that more than two utilitarians have ever agreed upon.

>>9678596
>>9678654

to be honest, you are not a really subtle troll

>>9678751
leeches are also useful to society as they are not saving their received money, but put it into circulation by exchanging it for things like food.

therefore unconditioned basic income should be granted to every citizen.

Good bye. Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out. Do it and prove you mean what you say. Otherwise, fuck off and leave the rest of us who've decided to keep on living alone. You're either going to do it or you just want attention. Get some attention by doing something positive or go fuck yourself. Or better yet - fucking kill yourself and be an hero. Work out your problems or go be stupid somewhere else. And for the love of fuck, don't take fucking anti-depressants. Depression is a made up disease. You aren't depressed. You're pissed off because your life isn't the one you dreamed up in your head. You've got the same problem as 99% of the fucking planet. Shit isn't going your way right now. Shut the fuck up and just keep going. You die at the end anyway. Might as well stick around and see how it all turns out.

http://depression.about.com/library/weekly/aa072202.htm

Thanks for making me realize what i have always tried to deny: i wanna kill myself.

Thank you, OP

>>9678703
>either troll or very retarded moron
That was fallacious. I could be many more things.
>i hope that atleast [sic] you aren't a hypocrit [sic] and serve society to its fullest....[sic]
I have already stated why Hypocrisy is irrelevant. If a bad guy says a bad thing is bad while he does said bad thing, it does not mean that he is wrong.
>What the heck?
I do not know, either.
>you see, you really fucking dumb. [sic]
I do not understand.
>promoting shit when you are breaking your own words.
See rebuttal 2.
>northkorea best korea!
I do not understand.

>>9676800
The only problem is the people around you.

Tha'ts totally true. I hate my friends. They are fake persons and treat me like shit but I don't think how would I feel without them. I know this is bad but I don't what to do.

>>9678741
I was merely giving very general terms. Seeing as I put that the betterment acts would occur ONLY once a year, I was giving myself a bit of elbow room in the other variables.
You know, just because all contributions to society take a year, like cleaning the side of a highway, or fucking a goat.

This thread reminds me of a heart-wrenching documentary I watched on the bombing of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. This old terribly disfigured Japanese woman was recalling her experience after the bomb. She was 8 at the time, her entire family died except her teenage sister. They were desperately poor orphans, living in a devastated city and treated like freaks. One day her sister calmly stood in front of a train and took her life.

The way she thought of it really stuck with me, she said: "I realized there are two kinds of courage -- the courage to die and the courage to live."

I just looked it up, it was "White Light/Black Rain"

the path of least resistance is the only path.

Inherently wrong? If you are not religious than no.

But when you do kill yourself you hurt those around you.

>>9676537

"Dans l'attachement d'un homme a sa vie, il y a quelque chose de plus forte que toutes les miseres du monde"

Albert Camus

>please excuse the missing accents

>>9677284 furthermore, seeing people say that suicide isn't moral because it means that society loses a worker shows me that they value people's contributions to society more than theur inherent worth as a human being

Humans have no inherent worth.

WHEN LONELINESS BECOMES CRIPPLING AND ALL SEEMS TO HAVE GONE, SUICIDE LOOKS TO BE PRETTY NICE
ESPECIALLY RIGHT ABOUT NOW