Fuck Liberals. They go out of their way to make life piss poor for everyone.

>USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA! USA!

>>8009450

but it's EQUALLY as piss poor for everyone. That's the important part, right?

>CRY SOME MOAR
>BOO FUCKIN HOO

>>8009443
Silly Glenn Beck, this isn't fox news. Go home to rush and cry yourself to sleep now you crazy guy

>Just saw the news...
You mean this news, OP?:

>McDonald's in Washington, DC receives order for 212 WHAAAAAAmburgers with 212 sides of french cries from GOP offices.

you best be believin son that shit is REAL
welcome to the 21st century where we pay taxes for shit other than invading other countries. Also the FEDERAL income tax is unconstitutional, fed only can tax interstate commerce.

The USA is finally starting to catch up to the rest of the world.

this is going to go over as well as Obama's presidency

which is to say horribly

except in this case, it drags the entire economy down with it over the course of 10 years

Delicious republican tears....so salty....so nourishing...

it must hurt to know that money is going to repair america rather than into your own fat ass

it hurts so good

Hey republicans. Hopefully this legislation helps America. We're not trying to give it to queers and Muslims, ok?

Let's see if this legislation works and, if it doesn't, we'll try something else and America will live on.

Calm the fuck down. I'm not gloating, I'm just interested and a bit optimistic.

The world isn't gonna end. We're all American in the end.

It's the end of the fucking world! America is Communist, now! LOL Republicans.

OMG everyone get's health insurace.
Clearly we are heading towards communism.

Amerikka will be a third world country within 10 years.

OP. Your ride is here.

>>8009617
Next thing you know you will be forced to become gay and take it up your ass. What is amazing, though, it that the rednecks are already butthurt.

TRAGEDY! People now can go to the doctor and get healed!
Clearly, it's the work of the devil.

>>8009443

What the hell? Is it increased taxes you're worried about? Did it occur to you that universal medical care is cheaper than your current system?

you people need to stop crying. im fucking ecstatic. its the beginning of the end of the democratic party's relevance, dumbasses :|

This new bill will cost trillions of dollars and deliberately kill thousands of americans and disables every year

>>8009695
I love it when ignorant liberals cite Scandinavia and Northern Europe as examples of socialism actually working.

As though those systems are not buoyed by massive trade surpluses. Surpluses that get smaller each year.

Sure is gonna be fucking hilarious when the oil in the North Sea dries up and all those norse faggots are left wondering why their marxist bullshit suddenly doesn't work right anymore.

Thanks for shoving a govt dick way up my ass. Now I HAVE to have health insurance or I will get fined.

And likely my employer will more than likely cut me and contract out to a firm rather than pay for my manditory health insurance. They don't even want to give me fulltime with the standard benies or an hour of overtime. And I'm payed with taxpayer monies as it is.

I'm gonna need to form a s-corp and contract myself out.

>>8009798
massachusetts here.

lol.

>>8009819
although we had a thread about this, you have to remember that those people are also extremely healthy. you introduce mcdonalds to them theyll be bankrupt in 5 years.

>>8009597
america IS a third world country, jackass

>>8009798
Only because the government got involved in the first place by over regulating the health insurance industry.

>>8009817

*disableds I mean, I like amputees and lepers.

How come no one is complaining about mandatory car insurance?

YES WE CAN! YES WE CAN! YES WE CAN! YES WE CAN!

watching all the democrats chanting "Yes we can!" afterward reminded me of this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GxJX3yn1DY

Sounds leik u faggts listen to Glenn Becker.

>>8009709
That's how Switzerland does it, works pretty well for them.

>>8009817

wut

10wuts

>>8009845
That as well.

I'm not exactly a picture of perfect health, but I'm also not some obese slob who eats McDonalds everyday.

Sure can't wait to pay for those people's heart bypasses.

>>8009857
Because you're using government roads with your car. You just have to exist to be forced to get health insurance.

>>8009857
Because its not manditory. You only have to have it if you drive a car. You can get by in life with out one.

I haven't been to a hospital or urgentcare since '00. I don't require it or WANT it. It's my choice.

>>8009835
Canada here

Fuck you guys, we're better at hockey.

>>8009859
>>8009865
lol...
anti-hivemind

>>8009899

Not anymore.

God you republicans whine like little bitch's.

>>8009857
because you can just move to florida or wisconsin if you dont want to pay car insurance

now its not just mass, its the whole nation thats infected :(

>>8009899
The problem comes if you were to fall and break something. You'd go to a public hospital without insurance. The hospital would have to eat the cost of treating you, thus driving up the cost for all of us. Plus, you if aren't getting immunizations and regular checkups you are probably going to get sick from an otherwise preventable illness.

>>8009857
Also, only Liability coverage is required...

You know, incase you fuck up someone else's car. Coverage for yourself is not required.

Of course it's interesting that you draw that parallel. The government hasn't regulated car insurance near as much as they have health insurance.

They've outlawed cheap plans that cover a bare minimum - plans which are ideal for younger healthier people. They've discouraged competition by limiting where you can buy insurance. And now limited it further by making it mandatory to buy it.

I love how faggot liberals basically rigged the private insurance system to fail and then trollfaced about how "the market had obviously failed!"

>>8009899
Fuck you, you self-righteous prick. When you do get hurt and go to the emergency room, it'll be my dollar you're getting served on. You're an idiot. It's people like you that have fucked up the system already.

PROTIP: HEALTH INSURANCE IS LIKE A VACCINATION, IT ONLY WORKS WHEN EVERBODY HAS IT.

Faggot.

>>8009443

agree with OP sad day.

America will just fade away now, just waiting to die of old ages and fat beurocrats eating our money lonas until budget is overblon and bankrupt without come back. even after obama is gone too late because now weare poisonsed with his death drug socialism

rip america

>>8009946
Which is what happens still with this governemt mandated shit that you will be paying for. Either way if I break my leg you will be paying for it.

>>8009892
You already DO fucking pay for his bypass. Why the fuck do people forget that insurance is all about a collective management of risk? You pay a premium and with that premium, insurance companies dole out funds for legitimate claims, such as a bypass.

>>8009968
No, you will because you have to buy insurance.

>>8009946
Protip: More people insured drives costs up not down.

combined with banning insurance companies from rejecting pre-existing conditions, prices are going to skyrocket now.

>>8009956

The Democrats want it to happen, so the Republicans have to hate it.

I'm petrified at the precedent that the GOP has set with their tactics against Obama. It is truly frightening how fucked this country is.

>>8010015
Protip:You're a fucking idiot if you think all those uninsured people still getting care aren't driving up premiums already, dumbass.

>>8009956
Pay less??? Yes.

Better??? Fuck no.
And don't cite that shitty WHO report, which had America at or near the top in every measurable category, then ranked us second to last in some subjective "fairness" category that simply measured how socialist the system was, dropping us to 37 overall.

Essentially the WHO said "your health care system work awesome, but we disagree with it politically, so fuck you"

>>8010033
Oh shit someone disappeared my post. It's the gestapo. Clearly Obama is Hitler!

>>8010051
No shit they're driving up premiums. But not nearly as much as mandatory universal coverage does.

Again, just look at Massachusetts since they implemented this idea. Costs have skyrocketed.

>>8009528
>if it doesn't, we'll try something else

lol someone doesn't know how the government works.

>>8010033
34 democrits voted agianst the healthcare bill.

all you fuckheads realize that there's no public option in this bill, right? in fact, it does nothing to make healthcare more affordable for poor people, it just makes it illegal to not have insurance and forces insurance to cover a bunch of shit that will make prices skyrocket.

it's actually making the problems you've been bitching about worse.

>>8010075
oh for fuck's sake. You get one more before I go to bed.

YOU ARE AN IDIOT, SIR. I POLITELY DISAGREE WITH YOU AND TELL YOU TO KINDLY FUCK OFF IF YOU DON'T LIKE IT. MAYBE YOU CAN FIND A COUNTRY THAT DOESN'T HAVE HEALTH CARE WAIT SHIT MAYBE YOU COULD GO TO IRAQ FUCK YEAH MAN NO UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE THERE, I CAN LIVE ANY GODDAMN WAY I WANT TO SO I DON'T HAVE TO POOL MY RISK OF PHYSICAL HARM AND FINANCIAL RUIN WITH EVERYBODY ELSE IN SOCIETY.

In b4 caps lock, cruise control, cool, etc.

>>8009528
Isn't that what you faggots said about welfare? How's that working out?

>>8010058
We can disagree, but I think fairness is probably the most important consideration for every action a human being takes. Especially when it comes to society.

>>8010090
AW CRAP your right anon :(

>>8010095
>Get told
>Unleash enfilade of ad hominems

Finally USA is one step closer to not being so fucking retarded. Next step is ban guns.

Well, If I was a rich dude who didn't like it, I'd drop my own salary to below the level at which I was taxed more than others to pay for this.

If I was a small business owner that was now going to have to pay health insurance for my employees, I'd let them go.

If I was a huge company with lots of employees here in the US, I'd move more work overseas.

If I was thinking about starting a business, I probably wouldn't do it now.

This is going to be a long, hard recession.

>>8010114
>Greentext like a bitch
>Cry some more

>>8010110
well then how do you quantify fairness? nobody in the US is dying in the streets because of preventable diseases, which is more than you can say for "fair" countries like cuba.

but i guess if everyone's dying equally that's better than treating anyone.

>>8010110
Fairness is a bullshit concept. At least the way many leftists imagine it. They imagine fairness as an equality of outcome, rather than equality of opportunity.

This type of thinking is responsible for everything from a broken welfare system, to this new trend of changing the score to a tie at the end of little league baseball games so no one's feelings get hurt.

It's fucking ridiculous and only makes us weak.

>>8010116
>Finally USA is one step closer to not being so fucking retarded.
>Next step is ban guns.

wait, what?

Any Canadafags here?

Out of curiosity what do you think of your health-care system? Not trollan', just interested.

>>8010116
i agree bro but guns um hell fucking no

Republican fag here...

It should be noted that no one is arguing the current system is broken.

But this bill is going to break shit even worse.

>>8010116
If they decide to start confiscating guns, I will open fire on the people who come to take them.

Enjoy your armed revolt.

>>AP Health Care Poll: Only FOUR PERCENT Of Americans Don't Want Any Reform

^What a crock of shit.

"Historically, the claim of consensus has been the first refuge of scoundrels; it is a way to avoid debate by claiming that the matter is already settled."
- Michael Crichton

i wish it had dental.

every single experience i or my family has had has been positive. and my sister (ny state) keeps a smaller % of her pay than i do after you factor all the insurances and costs of living on top of u.s. taxes

you guys just have the most adversarial politico in the universe. each side shouting bigger and louder nonsense, which is fine.

the only problem is you all believe everything anyone anywhere ever says so long as they wear the same shirt as you.

>>8010150

It has its problems and inefficiencies, but it sure is nice to be able to walk into the emergency room with a broken nose, hand them your health care and not have to worry about anything.

>>8010167
correction motherfucker this shit is going to fix the problem you fags fucking got us in
>Bush undiscriminated loan abuse and fraud
prove me wrong

>>8010150
there's a problem with questions like this. there is practically nobody on earth that has had significant dealings with multiple country's healthcare systems enough to make an comparative observations that have any value. combine this with the fact that the system in the US is largely decentralized so experiences differ between states and ever between cities in the same state, and the fact that tourist care is not indicative of what a citizen would go through, and it becomes effectively impossible to get a meaningful anecdote.

>>8010187
>Michael Crichton

WELL I'M CONVINCED

>>8010116

>Next step is ban guns.

AWW HELL NAW

Canadafag here, only problem with my health system is provincial, not federal.

Alberta Health Services, fucking up the provinces health-system. Only thing is, the reason they're doing what they do is because the whole province wants privatized healthcare. Sooooo... yeah.

Public Health rules

USA Confirmed for Great Depression II: Electric Boogaloo

hate to say it but any canadafag claiming they don't like our system is a troll.

i've not met a person in my life (aside from crazy old men on rascals (pedophiles?)) that didn't love the system

>>8010191
I thought it was prettly luzly how there were parking meters at the emergency room I went to canada.

>>8010214
Doesn't Alberta also want to secede?

>>8010190
>ny state

go fucking figure. one of the most liberal states in the union is in a fucking shit hole, reminds me of California, or Massachusetts. it's almost like there's a pattern here or something.

the rest of the country is quite alright. i enjoy paying a reasonable amount for excellent coverage and would prefer not having to live with the idiot plans that are running your states into the ground.

>>8010150
im a canadian working as a nurse in massachusetts and i think the only province in canada doing things right is alberta

so i think that should tell you both what i think about my native healthcare, and the bill thats been put up tonight

watch massachusetts: they're the future of america. just less broke. and they're already broke.

its like this bill was passed to hide how badly massachusetts is doing from the rest of americans :\

>>8010202
lived in US and canada.

My wife and I have both had our gall bladders removed.

Mine was in US, hers in Canada. My surgery was done a few days after the diagnoses. Her's was done 4 months after.

Nuff said imo

>>8010237

Yeah, they've got the oil money and they think the rest of the country is leeching off of them. Combine that with their conservativism and they're basically the Texas of Canada.

>>8010265

yeh cos 1 anecdote solves this conundrum

protip: we all fucking hate albertans but we don't tell 'em cause we're taken their oil :D

effing cowboys. not cool in texas, less cool in canada.

and her come the trolls

caldit

>>8010282
you now realize that cowboys are the only piece of history and culture the US has that isn't just inherited from Europe.

>>8010265
>Gall bladder
>Not life threatening

>>8010090
>>8010090
>>8010090
>>8010090
Everyone ignores the truth and continues arguing about the merits of universal coverage.

Just like good little puppets...

>>8010237
only like 25%, compared to quebec's 50%. by economical standards, they're one of, if not the, most conservative districts in north america (shit, the world), up there with south dakota.

>>8010259
massachusetts was actually doing alright. we were one of the only democrat states that was doing things right. if massachusetts reverse on healthcare and dropped more welfare, it would be a huge economic powerhouse for its size.

that said, hopefully the low spending, low tax, right to work states can rebound in time to show america how liberal policies kill economies. liberals are like freakin locusts, though.

>>8010271
The rest of the country IS leeching off Alberta.

Where do you think Canada's trade surplus comes from? What do you think buoy's your socialist system?

I really don't understand how people don't see that all the "successful" socialist countries are also countries with trade surpluses from oil exports.

>>8010322
keyword "was"

the healthcare system (which was basically copied in this bill) has run them into the ground and they're practically bankrupt.

>>8010338
because it would mean admitting that they're being propped up by american capitalist prosperity.

mmm our oil has the slimmest profit margin in the world.

our real wealth (believe it or not) lies in the commercial, financial (big time) and industrial belt along the stl seaway. the u.s. has way more oil wealth than us and harvests it much more actively.

>"But we have to pass the [health care ] bill so that you can find out what is in it."
-Pelosi

Nobody even knows what's in this bill. Not like we'd ever find out though. Obama's transparent governent at work.

>>8010343
LOL. Massachusetts legislature is already mumbling about rationing care.

>>8010368
the first time i heard that i thought i made a mistake, that she MUST have said something else and mumbled or something

what a fucking joke these people are

>>8010343
that's what i mean. but it's not like we're a total economic disaster like rhode island or something right now, and we haven't racked up as huge of a debt as connecticut, but more poor people are leeching off the system every year.

like i said, massachusetts isnt doing terrible yet, but its headed towards being the next california or michigan.

i really really like it here, but i think im going to see if i can move out west. somewhere nice, but a red state, where taxes are lower and living is cheaper.

but i'm an RN so my job is secure wherever i go anyway, especially with the baby boomers slated for retirement.

>>8010356
Most of that is internalized though.

The oil is what injects outside cash into your country.

>>8010382
yeah it's amazing how the rest of america seemed to ignore what is going on here. we still provide great health services...but everything is getting more expensive and the state is getting more and more into debt.

>>8010356
this guy is right. i'm not from alberta, hell i've never even been there, but despite their vast oil reserves, extracting it is extremely difficult.

>>8010116
Fuck. That. Shit.
Keep in mind that anyone with a basic knowledge of chemistry can make sarin gas.

>>8010387
>especially with the baby boomers slated for retirement.

hahaha yeah. it's going to fucking destroy just about every social program since the New Deal though, and probably crash the stock market too.

it's gonna be a fun decade.

>>8010387
New Hampshire is right around the corner.
No income taxes, no sales taxes. Only thing that's taxed is property, which doesn't really matter if you rent.

>>8010408
they also don't have a ton of fucking stupid social programs that they can't afford

Democrats: "We need health care reform"
Republicans: "Liberal fascists! Give us a majority and we'll do it better"
Democrats: "Done, you have majority of both houses"

12 years later, health care is irrefutably worse in every respect for every single person in the United States

Democrats: "We need health care reform"
Republicans: "Liberal fascists! Americans are tired of partisan politics!"
Democrats: "OK, let's compromise"
Republicans: "OK, get rid of half your ideas"
Democrats: "Done"
Republicans: "Too liberal, get rid of half your ideas"
Democrats: "Done"
Republicans: "Too liberal, get rid of half your ideas"
Democrats: "Done"
Republicans: "Too liberal, get rid of half your ideas"
Democrats: "Done"
Republicans: "Too liberal, get rid of half your ideas"
Democrats: "Done. Time to end debate"
Republicans: "Too liberal, we need more debate, we will filibuster to prevent you from voting"
Democrats: "OK, we'll vote--sorry guys, debate is ended. It's time to vote on the bill"
Republicans: "Too liberal, we vote no"
Democrats: "OK, it passed anyway--sorry guys."

>>8010438

One month later

Republicans: "Wait--wait, OK, we have less of a minority now so we can filibuster forever."
Democrats: "Sorry, the bill already passed, we need it to pass the House now"
Republicans: "But we have enough to filibuster"
Democrats: "Sorry, the bill already passed, we need it to pass the House now"
Republicans: "Liberal fascists! You haven't listened to our ideas! You've shut us out of this whole process!"
Democrats: "Sorry, show us your proposal"
Republicans: "Smaller government"
Democrats: "That's not very specific"
Republicans: "OK, here's our detailed proposal--It's our common-sense ideas we spent 12 years not enacting"
Democrats: "OK, we'll add a bunch more of your ideas"
Republicans: "Liberal fascists! You included all these back-room deals"
Democrats: "OK, we'll get rid of the back-room deals"
Republicans: "Liberal fascists! You're using obscure procedural tricks to eliminate the back-room deals!"
Democrats: "No, we're using reconciliation, which both parties have used dozens of times for much larger bills"
Republicans: "Liberal fascists! You're pressuring Congressmen to vote for your bill! Scandal!"
Democrats: "It's called 'whipping', it's been done since 1789"
Republicans: "Liberal fascists! Can't you see the American people don't want this?"
Democrats: "This bill is mildly unpopular (40-50%), doing nothing (your proposal) is extraordinarily unpopular (4-6%)"
Republicans: "We need to start over! We need to start over!"
Democrats: "We should really consider voting--"
Republicans: "Liberal fascists! Start over! Clean slate! Common-sense! America!"

>>8010402
Democrats honestly believe that there is an unlimited supply of cash for them to spend.

Thing is, the republicans feel pretty much the same way now, they just spend on different things. Eitherway, we're now China's Debt Slave.

>>8010407
i'm a residential nurse, i work in homes, so that's basically what effects me. three things

1. the tax returns are going to lessen
2. more people are going to be on medicaid (and medicare, but i deal almost exclusively with medicaid)
3. people are living longer
4. people save less. a higher percentage of residents go on medicaid each year.


>>8010408
new hampshire would actually be alright if they stopped electing democrats. you'd be kicked out of new hampshire if you touched their taxes, so they're basically spending with no income.

also their property taxes are one of the highest in the nation. i guess that doesn't matter to me because i rent...but there aren't many homes up there, and i got a green card for this job. anyway NH is basically a libertarian suburb of boston. they'd be doing a lot better if they could somehow attract more business there *shrug*

not really. they need you to succeed or their investment becomes worthless and they have no liquid. it'd be like investing microsoft and then inventing a linux that dumb people could use.

JESUS TOLD ME SOW-SHEE-LIZED MEDDISIN IS BAD

>>8010446
oh there's no question that both parties are just arguing over what to spend the hypothetical infinite cash on.

we need an ACTUAL conservative party in america instead of the "Tax&Spend" Party vs. the "Spend&Spend" Party

I heard that parks started becoming national. Just saw the news... can't believe it...

RIP America July 4, 1776 - August 25, 1916

>>8010443
the republicans have proposed several bills, all of which have been shot down

>>8010433
yes they are nowhere near as bad as us, but they really need to tighten their belts.

>>8010443
Implying Paul Ryan didn't have a complete plan, already drafted in legislative language, that was shittons better then the crap democrats came up with.

>>8010456
i'm still amazed you're all ignoring what's happening to massachusetts. this is your future, americans.

>>8010457
i think the republican party is finally starting to get the message. i still disagree with them on many things, but i expect real fiscal conservatism from them this year. its the perfect chance to piss in the face of heavy liberal states, i doubt they'll pass that up.

>>8010466
>>8010465
This. Republicans submit bills. Democrats and Media ignore it.

"HURRRRRR REPUBLICANS HAVE NO IDEAS"

>>8010477
btw id like to say that massachusetts has a good, albeit costly plan. covering people is a good thing. but considering the state is pretty welfare heavy already is giving the system a lot of leeches. plus the nation is halfway through economic meltdown. plus americans are still fatasses. youd be surprised how heavy senior residents can be.

ITT:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JuQXH2xQDeM

>>8010493
its coming from the same people that refused to recognize that the democrats caused the housing market crisis. if there is anything i don't like about massachusetts, it's barney frank, who outright lied and blamed the republicans for what he did.

>>8010493

The GOP never took reform seriously or brought forth any legislative or budgeting specifics. They proposed a 'set of principles', not an actual bill.

>>8010519
>i didn't read the thread

cool story

>>8010520
oh god barney frank is such a fuck up. in the top 3 biggest shiteaters in the US government, right behind Pelosi and Harry Reid.

>>8010541
there were many other congressmen and women involved, i'm just naming him since he was very vocal about it and from my state.

i like oliver north for top seat.

the (we all know he did it) high treason defying the congress and everything. I dunno, how is he a national hero to republicans again?

Cause he got away with it? or cause he did it? wierd

>>8010524
Why would I bother reading the thread? I was just looking for a place to post that video and this thread seemed good enough.

>>8010523
Incorrect.

Paul Ryan absolutely had a full bill, in legislative language, submitted.

okay i know how i'm going to sound like a douche here, but every time i bring up what is happening -right now- the thread suddenly gets all conservative.

now i think the democrats have many good questions and concerns that we need to address, but it's like as if there is a mass liberal/left leaning moderate "lalala i cant hear you!" and ditch the thread.

i dont watch fox news, so im curious as to anyone that does, have they ever brought this up? because i never really hear from it from other massfags (on the internet, anyway. i work in the same town that scott brown is from.)

>>8010569
>On April 1, 2009, Ryan introduced the GOP Alternative to the 2010 United States federal budget. This proposed alternative would have eliminated the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009, lowered the top tax rate to 25%, and imposed a five-year spending freeze on all discretionary spending.[6] It would also have replaced the Medicare system.[7] Instead, it proposed that starting in 2021, the federal government would pay part of the cost of private medical insurance for individuals turning 65.[7] Ryan's proposed budget would also have allowed taxpayers to opt out of the federal income taxation system with itemized deductions, and instead pay a flat 10 percent of adjusted gross income up to $100,000 and 25 percent on any remaining income.[8] Ryan's proposed budget was heavily criticized by opponents for the lack of concrete numbers[9] and the proposed privatization of Medicare.[citation needed] It was ultimately rejected in the house by a vote of 293-137, with 38 Republicans in opposition.[10]

Sounds great.

>>8009953

Since they lack reproductive independence, worker ants, being sterile, need their ant-queen to survive as a colony and a species and individual ants cannot reproduce without a queen, thus being forced to live in centralized societies.

>>8010606
hey, i grew up on lake pearl! i never saw any reason for scott brown to own a truck, he has a very nice house on oak point. heh

>>8010616
hm i cant really agree with some parts of the bill, but medicare IS going to go bankrupt. and msnbc told me that more americans believe elvis is alive than the economic stimulus work.

some guy from ohio over in /int/ actually took pictures of roadside signs telling him that the recovery act was working. guess what paid for those signs?

>the thread suddenly gets all conservative
i'm not certain about that.

there's certainly alot of anti-reform going on, but how much of that is conservative bias, and how much of it is that is such a huge bill that even with the good, theres a huge amount of bad?

YOU LITTLE PUSSY. Oh my god. You deal with four years of Bush and you say a much needed health care overhaul is what's going to be the demise of America?

There's a reason why we need more government in America: Americans are too fucking stupid to take care of themselves.

If you don't want your taxes to pay for other people's healthcare, there is a simple solution, documented here:

http://www.treasurydirect.gov/govt/resources/faq/faq_publicdebt.htm#DebtFinance

Donations to reduce the US debt are 100% tax deductible; just figure out how much your taxes would be, and send that amount in as a donation, then pay no regular taxes.

>>8010616
Someone has to be a man and admit we have to spend a lot less money.

>
There's a reason why we need more government in America: Americans are too fucking stupid to take care of themselves.

This is what democrats actually believe.

>>8010640
:o
lake pearl is so nice. I work at Maple right now. used to live on park street, too. living out of town right now though atm.

also I don't really like the fact that brown owned a gm truck (dont forget the canadian government has the second largest stake in gm right now) but i think the point where i stopped -liking- obama (ive never really agreed with his policies) was when he started ragging on brown's truck. it'd be like if harper ragged on hockey or something.

>>8010645
that's true. i know a lot of liberals don't think it's anywhere near enough. but nobody seems to want to match how similar it is to the plan we passed here (still not sure why romney is against the current plan...politics i guess?)

>>8010659
then let the stupid ones who can't take care of themselves eat themselves into artery clogged death, or subsidize healthcare for the rest of us by paying for a bypass every other year.

instead, you want them to get a free bypass every year, courtesy of taxpayers that are actually healthy and rich and not a drain on the system

fucking brilliant

>>8010659
>we need more government in America
you and the rest of you socialist faggots need to stop being a fucking man-children and learn the finer points of personal responsibility, instead of stealing money from everyone else through taxes.

>>8010677

Actually even if we dropped all budgets down to zero, and closed up most of the federal government, the debt interest would still exist. Taxes wouldn't even be enough to start reducing it. You can thank the Bush tax cuts for that. We could jack the top tax bracket to 90% and it still wouldn't help.

>>8010671
....

i'm going to be doing this every year now. this is the best thing i've learned on 4chan since i saw that instructional video on how to take a shirt off in half a second.

>>8010687
i think that's just liberals, really. the democratic voterbase is mostly moderate. its a shame to see the blue dogs getting kicked around. i could really get behind a blue dog party.

>>8010671
if you want to pay for other people's healthcare, mail a check to medicare

>>8010715
yes this is what i don't like about people like warren buffer (hard working intelligent man, trust me i love him overall. they're welcome to help out any time now....get ahead of the curve. shit they'd have the moral high ground, tbh.

>>8010715

By making the donation, you prevent your taxes from going into the general fund; they can only be used for the donated reason.

>>8010710
protip: tax revenue increased after the "bush tax cuts"

>We could jack the top tax bracket to 90% and it still wouldn't help.

because there would no longer be any incentive to earn that much money, and therefore we would lose the tax revenue previously generated from that bracket

>>8010732

Actually one of the more successful stable economic periods in our country, the top tax bracket was 90%

And no one bitched about it. Maybe you're just a pussy traitor.

There is only ONE solution for those of you pissed about the passage of this bill:

DO NOT TURN IN YOUR CENSUS FORMS!

They want you to do it because it will mean your area has to pay more for healthcare now! Don't let them tax you based on your census forms!!

Stand up to this attempt to figure out where to send the death panels! Stand up to their attempt to figure out where you live so they know how to find you when you refuse to buy THEIR insurance!

Make a statement. Tell Washington to keep their hands out of your lives and refuse to turn in your census forms!!

>>8010671
Holy shit, I hope that more people find out about this...
fucking up Obongo's shit while actually helping America.

>>8010732
>>8010710
laffer curve, yo

im not a fan of federal spending, debt is horrible, but jacking it up to 90% is bad.

the more you tax, the less can be used to invest etc. diminishing returns etc

>>8010710
>Blame Bush

Bush's tax cuts actually increased federal revenue, moron.

It's all the social programs that are bankrupting us.

>>8010752
>one of the more successful stable economic periods
during the great depression?

>>8010753
i hope you're just being sarcastic

anyway i live in a heavily democrat area so im not turning mine in. i dont want to give this congress more fucking democrat representatives, or electoral college votes.

>>8010732

Didn't help that Bush started two off the books wars and it was never rolled into any budgets. That entirely offset any increase in federal tax income receipts

>>8010768
lol....

we were doing fine in the 20's until we got hoover (original rino)

>>8010768

Derp, lern to history faggit

He is referring to the post WWII era from the 1950's to the late 1960's.

>>8010770
that may be true

but after the tax cut, more tax money was brought in

>>8010763
No they fucking didn't, correlation != causation.

>>8009443
So you condone a false war, killing millions of people, thousands of your own, wasting money, etc etc etc etc Yet, you oppose something that is supposed to help your own people?

Americans are fucking retarded.

>>8010800
millions of people....wha?

i dunno if you noticed, but the wars arent really popular with america right now. we dont want to be there, we just want to get the job done.

and for fucking sakes, fucking -egypt- had the same intelligence as us.

What happened exactly?

WELCOME TO THE REST OF THE FUCKING WORLD AMERIFAGS

>>8010783
Is this even properly adjusted for inflation? And if more money flowed in because even more money we didn't have was spent doing dumb shit that eventually exploded the economy, then are those numbers even meaningful?

I say bring back the 90% marginal tax bracket, the time of greatest growth of the middle class was under that system. It's not a coincidence, distribution of wealth leads to a more egalitarian society and more real freedom for the masses.

Fuck the rich. They are killing this country, sucking it dry and exploiting it like a $10 hooker. We need to bring back sanity and opportunity for all.

>>8010831
im all for a strong middle class dude, but you really oughta meet some rich people. they're just the boss at your company (yknow the one giving you the paycheck....) and its more about the game than the money to them.

plus if you havent noticed, but high tax states like california arent doing too well right now...look at the auto industry. its not in michigan anymore its in the midwest and the south.

>>8010816
In the invasion of Baghdad alone you killed one million people. The astonishing thing is most of them were just normal citizens.

>>8010852
California is just a huge clusterfuck in general and has been since the 1970s; high taxes have nothing to do with it.

>>8010823
YEA BECAUSE POLICE STATES AND NANNY STATES SURE ARE GREAT.

>>8010782
>He is referring to the post WWII era from the 1950's to the late 1960's.

oh, well, then he's an idiot, because the maximum effective rate was lower than that

>>8010800
They'd have just killed themselves anyways.
HURP DERP I AM RELIGALOUSLY OPPOSED TO THE WEST SO IMMA GO BLOW UP MY MOSQUE AND MY MARKETS

>>8010871
yeah business are just flocking to low-tax right-to-work stats because they just want a change of scenery right?

>>8010889
not sure why we even bother. we need to pull out and let them all kill eachother.

>>8010901
We gotta release the MUHREENS everyonce and awhile. They need to 'GIT SUM' and we need to make sure that the training we paid for works.

>>8009891
faggot from Steam forums detected

10faggots

>>8010950
>implying Steam forums invented 10char

>>8010852
I know how it works. I know that personally they are usually good people. However, their actions and policies are destroying the country's economic base.

It's like aerial bombing; you don't see the enemy, you just drop the bombs from 30,000 ft. Or rather, you fly the drone through a computer like it's a video game. The actual moral weight of the action is never felt.

To be more concrete, a close relative used to work for Union Carbide (before it split into a million pieces). Now he's medium-high up in a different company. The company pays something like $10 an hour to it's bottom rung workers, and the people above this relative are rich like crazy. They don't need it! The people making $10 an hour need more for sure!

Now apply that to Wal-Mart, the heirs of which are billionaires and the bottom rung workers are making absolute minimum wage. How are they going to buy goods, or even survive, on minimum wage? So much for the consumer economy.

Only high taxes on wealth and trade unions can encourage demand side growth and higher wages for lower paid workers. We've lost the unions for good.

>>8009819
Actually, the real secret to their success is the fact that they have fewer nonwhites than anywhere else in the world.

>>8010971
high taxes on high incomes just make it harder for people to move from lower incomes to higher incomes. the richest will still be the richest, even if they're making less total money.

ITT: America gets dragged into the 21st century.

Those people protesting about the bill were on TV worldwide, and you guys wonder why the entire world thinks you are all idiots.

Suck it down, 'Murkans. That's Socialism you will be enjoying.

>>8011058
and they offer 4 dollar prescriptions, proving once again that wal mart has done and will do more for the poor than government can ever hope to

Walgreen doesn't accept Medicaid to pay for prescriptions anymore. Wallgreen looses to much money by doing business with people sucking government's medical tits.

Doctors might not honor the mandated insurance from the government. Then your health insurance will be useless.

Okay, I think this bill is a great idea. Healthcare for everyone, for the rich, poor, black, white, blue, it's great. The thing is, I don't think we should be passing a bill such as this when the economy is in the SHITTER.

We need to focus on creating more jobs and careers rather than passing bills that drive taxes way WAY up. The government needs to get its priorities straight. What happened to this "green jobs" thing I heard about a few years back? You know, where people here in the states can create wind mill farms, solar panels, and all that shit? What happened?! It was a great idea, until this pointless health thing came along.

Thankfully, we can just vote the dumbasses out of Senate and House in November. The government isn't going to do shit, but you can.

>>8010976
>fewer nonwhites than anywhere else in the world
Oh fuck no you didn't. Have you ever been there?

Shit's been working pretty damn well for the rest of the world, why do you stupid yanks not want healthcare?

>>8011003
Bullshit. Explain to me why the middle class boomed in the 1950's and 1960's under a 90% tax rate for top earners - you can't.

Conservative economics is all lies. LOW and regressive taxes promote the growth of a rich ruling class and class stratification. High, progressive taxes promote a more egalitarian society.

The data is right here:
http://www.truthandpolitics.org/top-rates.php

>>8011105
the overwhelming majority of the country is happy with their healthcare. the tiny fraction of people that can't afford it, don't qualify for current government programs, and aren't illegal immigrants is not worth fucking around with the other 300 million people's situation for.

>>8011105
Because they've had about 70 years of corperate-backed propaganda telling that not only is anything that helps the poor evil, it is also effeminate and elitist.

They're their own worst enemy, I swear to fucking god

>>8011105
See this >>8011096

fuckingseeitblocksdfgr

>>8011132
it moved the top earners down to the middle brackets, it didn't help the low end

>>8011096

The only voice of reason drowned by the voices of rhetoric ....

Doctors, pharmacies, hospitals, and the likes are not required to accept medicare, medicaid, or insurance companies. They are a private business and can do what they like. If they are going to loose money then why would they do accept it.

So even if you have insurance, your doctor might not accept it. And I lol.

>>8011165
If you think a real doctor is more concerned with money that saving lives then you country really is shit.

>>8011096
>green jobs
>good for economy
dohoho

>>8011158
I love Neocon newspeak. 'Rhetoric' and 'Intellectualism' are somehow bad things in your eyes. No wonder you think healing people is a bad thing.

>>8011177

If they can't pay their support staff, buy quality equipment, pay for training and schooling, then the patients are as good as dead. It takes money to save lives.

>>8011192
reading comprehension isn't your strongest skill, is it?

>>8011165
Protip: If they don't accept those people, they won't make any money whatsoever.

NOT TO MENTION! UHC does not cover abortions... GOD DAMMIT! The more low rent niggers and white trash fucks get abortions the better... So, fuck conservatives in this respect.

Fuck both sides... can't the middle win for fucking once?

>>8011204
My reading comprehension is fine. If the only 'voice of reason' is one guy churning out the tired but only vaguely acceptable Republican dissent then you clearly have a bias.

Look at this post, for example, here's some fucking reason for you:
>>8011132

There's a reason Germany and France got out of the recession first: a strong welfare state. You don't improve the economy without sorting your shit out first.

>>8011187

>>8011096
here, it's just a suggestion. It's better than no jobs at all.

Living in Holland, with great health-care, Feels good men.

I got the feeling all the anti-bill guys are just egocentric people that only care about them self.

>>8011230
I'm pro abortion, but if you want an abortion then you can pay for it yourself.

Maybe it would teach you some god damned responsibility. I don't want to pay for your abortion when you could have just bought a fucking contraceptive or pulled the fuck out.

>>8011243
Absolutely not. Don't be ridiculous. Jobs that cost more money than they make are never good for the economy.

>>8011262
Meh, in extreme circumstances where there's rape, statutory rape or incest going on, that shit should be free.

To be honest, it should be no-questions-fucking-asked. I'm willing to pay for a few coat hooks so the rampantly promiscous underclass sends a few less shit heads into the world.

>>8011260

I'm not anti-bill at all! Again, I think it's a good idea but we're in this little thing called a recession. I think we need to sort that shit out before we start doing passing the UHC bill.

God, this thread makes me lol. You guys have to sit back and read some of the posts over again. On the topic, I have a question that hasn't really been answered clearly yet. WHEN is all this going to REALLY happen? At the current moment, I have no health insurance, got knocked off the family plan of my father's. When am I able to go to the doctor's again? By next summer I hope to have a doctor look at a fucked up knee of mine, I think it's a meniscus tear

This thread is dildos.

Dildoblox.

Seriously I was going to emigrate to America, but now it'll be turning into the same shithole as western European countries. Fuck this. I'm pissed.

>>8011271

Force the big corporations to give jobs to millions of jobless Americans instead of outsourcing them?

>>8011306
Hahaha, you fucking suck. Unless you are an abundantly wealthy plutocrat you have no idea why you really want to move to America.

>>8011310
If you care so much then why don't you hire a bunch of people to work for you?

>>8010177

Enjoy going down in a hail of federal gunfire, one at a time in isolated pockets of resistance.

Revolution my ass.

(That said I personally think we're better off with everyone owning guns, since guns will always exist in the world - the technology is out of the bag and so MAD is the way to go.)

>>8011310
Enjoy big companies going bankrupt by forcing huge unexpected costs on them.

>>8011238
so let me get this straight... calling the guy that says "healthcare for everyone is great" the voice of reason means you think healing people is a bad thing?

also
>>8011147

>>8011321

I lack one thing.

MONEY THE MOTHERFUCKING CENTER OF ALL THIS SHIT

>>8011136
>the tiny fraction of people that can't afford it
>tiny fraction
>32 million

>>8011321
Totallyreasonableargumentblox

>>8011328
>(That said I personally think we're better off with everyone owning guns, since guns will always exist in the world - the technology is out of the bag and so MAD is the way to go.)
That's flawless logic.

>>8011262

Broseph, not saying I need an abortion, I'm saying these low-rent fucking retards are going to use up our fucking tax-dollars, at least put it to use by getting rid of a god-damn crack baby that is going to be an even bigger ward of the state.

>>8011355
>implying lack of money is why poor people don't get abortions

>>8011347
that's the inflated number that includes people that can afford it or qualify for medicaid

and it's still less than the unemployment rate.

>>8011335
He's not the fucking voice of reason because he's supported by fuck all evidense. Know how we've gotten out of recession before? By supporting quality of living resulting in more people playing the game. First on the list is Healthcare and Education, if you don't have them then you don't have a good economy and if you don't have a good economy you are not getting out of fucking debt.

>>8011341
So if you can't afford to employ anyone without making a profit so you can keep them employed, then why bother giving them a job?

Let say you need to hire a tutor. I charge $14 and hour. The indian kid, who is just as educated and qualified, charges $6 and hour. Who are you going to hire? The Indian kid.

>>8011391
still not explaining your fuzzy logic that lead to "healthcare for everyone is good" -> "healing people is bad"

>>8011391
>out of debt
This will never happen. Seriously, it's too much money.

>>8011391
that's absolutely retarded

how do you explain prosperity at various points in the United States' 234 year history, none of which included healthcare and many of which didn't include education

>>8011391

Fucking Christ, I say I support the bill and spout out one suggestion and it turns into a shitstorm. Instead of saying no and explaining how it won't work, people rabble.

And who's the fucking idiot who called me the voice of reason?

>>8011413
Because that dude is more concerned about financial issues than quality of life, the latter threatening the former.

>>8011405
Don't forget that you get an hour paid lunch and 2 15 minute paid break periods. Also, your employer needs to pay for your health insurance and allow you to form a tutors union to "negotiate your saluary to increase $0.45 every 6 months. And you can't be fired after 3 months of providing tutoring services.

>>8011443
I was talking mainly about Europe. Prosperity in America was due to socialisation, which only indirectly benifited Education (but benifited it none the less).

>>8011453
Iknowrite? And people wonder why jobs are being shipped over seas.

>>8011452
when those financial issues can bring everything this bill proposes to a grinding halt it's a pretty big concern

ESPECIALLY if you support it.

>>8011485
But those financial issues cannot be fixed unless the lower and middle classes are catered to, and have a good quality of life. The economy runs on the cogs, not the guys sat on top of them.

>>8011465
>Prosperity in America was due to socialisation

Hahaha you aren't a big student of US history are you? The only socialization in the US has been since the industrial revolution, and only significantly so in the past 70 years. Curiously, those 70 years have been a clusterfuck of boom/bust cycles than benefit only the insanely rich.

>>8011534
Socialisation almost always involves greater taxation of the rich. The batshit recent cycles you describe occured after top end tax payers had it cut, or before they had it increased.

>>8011505
It's clear this argument will go no further, since we have reached a disagreement on a very core principle.

I invite you to do more research on your theory, especially diminishing returns, and the logical justification for how providing for people's every need will encourage them to "play the game" as you say.

>>8010177
going to have to say I agree with this.

>>8011569
I'm going to prickishly deny your attempt at having the last word and point you towards the evidence of central Europe, which is thriving compared to the U.S. thanks to potential cash vending-machines not losing their savings whenever they break a leg, or being financially stunted by insurance that is more severe the worse off they are. Good luck climbing the ladder with that sword of Damocles hanging over your head.

But yeah, if we were to continue this any further we would need to do a bit more research.

>>8011638
i'm going to ignore your hyperbole about health care in the US since it's clear you've never dealt with it. I'd just like to say that it's plain silly to blame any possible prosperity in europe 100% on health care, especially since Sweden, Switzerland, France, Finland, Germany, and the UK have been consistently behind the US in both unemployment and GDP per capita for the last 30 years. To blame recent recoveries entirely on the form of healthcare(possibly not you, but>>8011238)
is disingenuous at best.

>>8011760
Nobody ever used the word 'entirely' and GDP per capita counts for little when it the resulting wealth is so absurdly unevenly spread and therefor does not assist the average standard of living (something which, we can all agree, is the most important thing).

>>8011787

Standard of living doesn't mean shit when you die awaiting your government to allocate you health care.

>>8011811
Are you high? Dying due to shitty implementation of Healthcare is a perfect example of a bad standard of living.

God damn, that's some mental gymnastics there. Standard of living is directly affected by quality of available health care services.

I'm a registered republican and I am for health care.

>>8011901
You should write to Obama, the poor bastard needs you right now.

It is not just a money issue. It is an issue of compassion.
If you have none, please form a new party call it the New Republics or whatever and leave the decent normal, pro healthy american conservatives alone. We want our GOP back.... pre Reagan.

massachusetts, anyone?

>>8013414

MAfag reporting in. I used the mandatory state insurance when I lost my job last year. Cost about $170 a month for basic coverage, including a few doctor visits per year and an admittedly high deductible.

Still, it wasn't that bad, as my new job takes about $210 per month out of my check for a better plan.

Insurance costs a lot, but paying out of pocket = insta-bankruptcy. It's nice to have this option around because it lets you be more flexible with jobs, like if you have to put together some part-time stuff or whatnot.

As far as paying the uninsured fee goes, it depends on how much money you make. If you make under the poverty line, you pay no fees. If you make three times the poverty line, you pay the full fee. If you make anywhere between 1-3x the poverty line, you pay a partial fee. Not so scary.

And if you make 3x the poverty line (about $45k I believe) then why the fuck do you not have health care coverage? Just waiting to go to the poorhouse because you fall down a flight of stairs?

Also, this national bill will save us a whole shit load of money in the long run due to its influences on cost controls. Check the CBO (Congressional Budget Office) report--they estimate it will save Americans $1.5 trillion in health care costs over the next 20 years, EVEN INCLUDING the fact that the bill costs $940 billion itself. Does it suck for this year's budget? Yes. But long-term it makes sense. And it was decades of short-term, 'make the budget look good so I get re-elected' thinking that put us in this huge fucking mess in the first place.

It definitely isn't perfect, but neither was Social Security and Medicare when they started--but like those hugely popular programs, this one can evolve over time.

>>8009443

Actually it passed on March 21st. That's 3/21, 2010.
Destroying republicans is as easy as 3-2-1.

>>8014018
social security was perfect when it started out since the people that could start collecting it didn't have to put anything in.

now the fucking thing will be bankrupt after the baby boomers rape it.

>>8014040

Social Security encouraged people to not save their money for retirement.
Social Security is a flawed system.

>>8014018
um social security and medicare worked when they first started, mostly because we had a huge tax base funding a very small old-people base. and the only reason they have lasted this long is because the baby boomers provided a particularly large taxpayer base.

>>8014074
i work in a home and medicaid is doing the same thing. more residents go on it every year. people just don't save like they used to.

And actually, if you want to know the real reason that MA is bankrupt, it's because the rest of you leech red-states are taking our money. For every federal dollar we put in, we only get $0.82 back.

Easy for you red state fags to mock our budget issues when we and our blue state friends are balancing your budgets for you. Just like you mock our gay marriage laws as immoral while our divorce rate is half of yours. Fucking dead weight dipshits, we should have never fought to take you back in the first place.

the gritty awesomeness of america is dead. yay welfare state.

>>8014094

That's because government encourages people to spend to boost the economy.
What did Dubya and Cheney say to do right after 9/11? They said to spend money!

The rich want the poor to stay poor so that they can continue sucking on the multi-million nippled cow that is Middle America.

>>8014094
>people just can't save like they used to.

Fixed that for you. Working Americans make less money compared to the cost of living than they did in the 1970s.

>>8014109
I agree that it's not fair for the blue states to contribute more than they receive. But it's not the reason why blue states' economies are in bad shape.

>>8014117
1. bush was an idiot
2. poor people dont buy much other than bills and food. movie tickets, video games, a new ipod once in a while and that's about it. the rich need a strong middle class to get richer.

>>8014109
i dont live in mass anymore, i live in ri now, but that's because we get completely screwed on federal tax brackets. why? because we keep voting for people that raise our taxes and minimum wage, and increase the cost of living. so we have to make more money just to have the smae living as red states.

we screwed ourselves over. take some responsibility.

You'd be hard pressed to find 1 on 10 people here who would go without healthcare just to save on taxes. Personally, if it wasn't for our healthcare my sister would be dead, my mum and dad would of suffered more than I'd want to imagine. We aren't rich, but maybe if we lived in the land of the free we would be and could afford it but then my upbringing taught me to be caring to each other and the society round me has been largely that. So we take the NHS for granted - yes, we complain to but we are British - find a Brit who ain't complaining and you've found a needle in this haystack.

What a lot of Brits don't get is that a lot of americans think socialism is a bad idea. I only really learnt this since Obama took presidency, I thought it would be aim of most countries to have some sort of caring state for its people?

I would love to hear from a brit or any1 who has lived here for a long time that would swap healthcare systems with america.

Oh look, ANOTHER hyperbolic thread with no sense of context. YAY.

:|

FUCK YOU republican right wing motherfuckers
hahahahah you fuckarse dumb motherfucker cunthole shitslag filthcunts.

i laugh at your fucking distress, USA has become a better place for everyone who lives there, poorer people wont simply DIE of shit that could be treated.

i fucking love watching you fuckhole motherfucker shitcunts squirm at this healthcare reform

SUCK YOUR OWN SHIT, you fucking filthfucks.

SUCK SHIT, ALL I CAN SAY, while i laugh at you

YOU SCUM CUNT MOTHERFUCKERS, SUCK SHIT.

USA= fix'd

>>8014109
also that shits old. new mexico, west virginia, colorado, and ohio are def blue states. and new hampshire is pretty red at the local level.

I'm hoping this fuels a second civil war. The rest of us can just sit back and watch the USA burn.

Watching Americans talk about health care is like watching a monkey piss in it's own mouth.

>>8014162
although technically brits contribute more to charity via taxes, americans contribute more voluntarily.

>>8014179
its stuff like that that is going to get you killed in november. and hospitals dont deny treatment. you just go bankrupt, you dont die.

you have a right to life, you dont have a right to financial security.

>>8014186
It is funny, because it is true. Some Americans campaigning about healthcare don't even give a shit about it. They are just doing it because they dislike obama(wtf?)

>>8014194
>although technically brits contribute more to charity via taxes, americans contribute more voluntarily.
I'm assuming that is per head right?

>>8014201
Once out of power, an individual or group of individuals will do everything to get back in power.

's not hard to figure out.

>>8014206
even shoot their own feet in the process?

>>8014204
yeah. america contributes vastly more by volume. you have to remember the us is like what, 6 times the size of britain?

>>8014206
like lie about who created the housing crisis?

>>8014194

shut your fucking animal face.

i dont even live in the USA

enjoy your health reform you fucking gay cunt.

>>8014215
> yeah. america contributes vastly more by volume.
USA - 2010 estimate 308,918,000
UK - 2010 estimate 62,041,708

>>8010116
> next step is to ban guns
wonderful. I'll just look forward to being mugged and assraped by criminals who have guns illegally, because i am not allowed to have a gun.

awesome! yes!

>>8014269

Straw-man non-sequitor slippery-slope is a straw-man non-sequitor on a slippery slope.

>>8014269

hey you stupid dumb cunt.

look at how many deaths by gunshot per capita in the USA compared to say, Canada.

then compare their stances on gun ownership.

then shut your fucking face. you dumb carcass halftroll

>>8014281
Aren't guns still legal in Canada though?

>>8014285

yes my son, but there are limitations set in place.

good work.

canada has the second highest rate of rape in the developed world

just putting that out there.

>>8014306
Good enough for me, Brit here btw.

Baby killers!

Let's just give the government waste machine total fucking power. That's the plan for defeating democracy, just so you know.

>>8014308
Oh shit he's right. 77 per 100K. Damn Canada, you scary.

>>8014325
THEY RAPE NOW

Well, it's not really equally piss poor for everyone. Here's what it comes down to:

You make $200k or more, you're fucked. Below $200k to middle class, you're probably going to be alright. Middle class employed, you'll see little change. Middle class self employed, you're really fucked now. Lower class employed or unemployed will see no change in welfare benefits.

>>8014312

guns are also legal in australia, but similarly to canada, you cant just waltz up to a gunsmith and buy a rifle that is designed to kill 30 people in as many seconds.

also, old mate here >>8014269 with his paranoia and infantile use of sarcasm; id hedge bets he'd be the first to pull a gun on someone. he is part of the problem they have in the US of A, this gun worship, built out of fear and phallic obsession? whatever it is, its strikingly different to most other western countries.

obama will remedy this if he gets in again, im certain.

>>8014342
over 200k wont be fucked, they make over 200k. theyll be 'fucked' in the sense that their income will be less, which isnt right, but theyll still be able to live.

this shit is going to kill small business though. the democrats have been killing small business in their states for years, and scaring away big business to republican states. i have no idea how they can say that they're trying to represent middle class america.

>>8014308

bored white teenage girls feeling guilty about what they did last night, can afford to cry rape because they know it will get them all the attention their parents never gave them

>>8014359

Isn't it ironic, though? Obama is fucking small business over like this, but pretty recently was heard sucking the dicks of the RIAA and MPAA.

Fuck that nigger, man. He's getting rid of the pure capitalism in health care and killing small business, while the fucking RIAA and MPAA get to rule.

Fucking niggers...

>>8014382
hm i dont think it really helps us to call him that, but yeah, the far left just freakin loves to tell us what we can and cant watch and listen to.

that said the far right is cool with everything on the air AS LONG AS THERES NO GAYS but you know what i mean

I hate guns and I don't think banning guns would work in america. Purely because of the saturation of guns already. There's no adequate way of removing them entirely, it'd have to be slow process over many years.

America just has a culture of shooting each other and wanting to be allowed to continue to do so.

>>8014485

at some point, maybe towards the ends of our lives, this might change.

>>8010116
I'm not giving my gun up assfucker