Oh stfu you selfish capitalist fuck. You just don't want to spend any money to help people out, you just want to drive around a shoot poor people for fun you immoral, selfish fucks.

Op is either a troll or a ignorant fuck

>>7998208
Touch subject, eh anon?

but I agree with you. OP is a dumbass

>>7998208
You STFU, you communist moron. You think everybody deserves what you're too lazy to work for.

Go kill yourself instead of leeching off society.

Poverty isn't fixable, but we can at least try to close the gap between the rich and the poor.

Blacks are in poverty because of their genetically-linked low intelligence. In a market-based economy that values education and wit, they can't compete with Whites for good jobs so they will always be stranded at the bottom of the barrel.

Sorry, it's just nature.

>>7998231
Or correct, because no matter what system or society you have, you're always gonna have people that get the least benefits than everyone else, the lowest of the low.

>>7998246
Isn't that socialism?
I tought all americans were retards.

>>7998242
How about we kill you instead?

>>7998265
Good luck when you can't afford a gun, much less bodyguards.
Go smoke some wood and pretend you're intelligent.

>>7998261
Socialism can only really work in a society that's already wealthy, and has a good income sourced somewhere else. But such a thing is only make-believe.

>>7998242
Yeah not everyone does his work but that also includes the wealthy who have cheated and killed to get to the top so STFU

Governments cannot end poverty, they, however, can end the poor.

>Go smoke some wood and pretend you're intelligent.

>>7998208


0/10

Try harder faggot

>>7998277
Thanks for revealing yourself!

>>7998183
Actually yeah, you can get rid of poverty... But putting everyone in it.

>>7998252
>>7998277
omfg
where the fuck is the christian morals?
You are going to do anything to help the poor people dying under your nose.
really, you're going to hell.

I actually would like to drive around shooting poor people. Kudos!

Depends on what framework you mean it in. If eliminating poverty were all anyone cared about, I'm pretty sure it could be done away with. And I think even keeping everything else fairly similar to how it is, you could still significantly reduce how poor the poor are.

>>7998279
What do we have today?
Rich countries domitating the world.
if you share the money equally, you can still have an income source.
Also, Socialism is not only about capital, it's also about health care for EVERYONE, education for EVERYONE.
Maybe the american greed is too big for them to see that.

>>7998183
No one is asking you to have everyone have the same income or the same wealth. However rights and benefits and the law should be equal to all.

You got it all wrong OP, it's not about hand-outs or leeching. It's about helping people rise in society. I know Imma be making ridiculous money in the future, and I already plan to donate 5-10% along with volunteer work and community service.

It's not about being a Hippie, it's about making life easier for everyone. If you help the poor people stop being poor guess what happens? There's no more poor people! shocking I know, but get this, there will also lower crime rates! since poor people are usually the ones committing small petty crimes. Shit adds up OP.

I mean it is ultimately unfixable, yes. But we can still do shit to make life easier for them. "Poverty will always exist" does not imply "FUCK poor people, I ain't doing SHIT for poor people. In fact ima pass this law? SPECIFICALLY fucks them in the ass. Fucking poors."

>>7998351
But then you're start having inflation once you spread the wealth around. The value of said wealth would go down if everyone is able of gaining it willy-nilly, which ends putting the economy into the shitter.

>>7998291
They wouldn't end them.
Who is going to work for the rich people.
Also, People on /r9k/ talk like they're multi millionaire, when they're also affected by the capitalism and considered poor near the real rich people.
grow the fuck up and stop being the selfish fuck you are.

>>7998301
>where the fuck is the christian morals?
Who said anyone ITT was a Christian?
Or agnostic, or atheist, or theist, or anything, really?

You gotta stop assigning values to people randomly, ya little hippy dippy fuckstick.

>>7998351
god fucking damn it let's get this straight

socialism is SOLELY ABOUT THE ELIMINATION OF A LARGE MAJORITY OF PRIVATE ENTERPRISE. Anything that can be considered a means of production or anything that generates capital can no longer be privately owned. Instead, it is owned by groups of people or even a large aggregate. Socialism is not "lul health care for all!!!11!!"

>>7998370
But nothing's going to make anyone's lives easier, no matter how much you help them.

Hey guys i was born with money. Fuck all you dirty unemployed hippys

>>7998332
>the Syracuse study found poverty rates of 6.6% for Sweden and 16.9% for the United States

http://www.neoperspectives.com/internationalpoverty.htm

ITT: OP refuses to actually look at poverty stats in(or what constitutes poverty for) other countries.

Zero/Near zero poverty countries exist.

ITT: GREED and EVIL.

>>7998402

Fun fact, the united states uses tricky math to fudge the numbers of their poverty rate, to make it seem like they're not doing so bad to the rest of the world

>>7998429
Any proof to back up that statement, mate?

Because they believe people are trustworthy, competent and intelligent enough to distribute resources efficiently and without corruption. Which is of course not true, although we have some capacity for intelligence and altruism it's in very short supply.

>>7998409
inb4 i need to quote this part:
(...what constitutes poverty for) other countries

>>7998183
Your preaching will not be acknowledged by those in power. If you want to make some good for yourself and those like you you will have to get rich and that is not something easy; especially if you are Americans or in a similar capitalist country.

>>7998375
I'm start?

retardamericanblox

North Korea tried to solve their poverty problems, which now made it one of the worst poverties in the world.

"...In a world in which everyone worked short hours, had enough to eat, lived in a house with a bathroom and a refrigerator, and possessed a motor car or even an airplane, the most obvious and perhaps the most important form of inequality would already have disappeared. If it once became general, wealth would confer no distinction. It is possible, no doubt, to imagine a society in which wealth, in the sense of personal possessions and luxuries, should be evenly distributed, while power remained in the hands of a small privileged caste. But in practice such a society could not long remain stable. For if leisure and security were enjoyed by all alike, the great mass of human beings who are normally stupefied by poverty would become literate and would learn to think for themselves; and when once they had done this, they would sooner or later realize that the privileged minority had no function, and they would sweep it away. In the long run, a hierarchical society is only possible on a basis of poverty and ignorance. So we restrict the output of goods."

George Orwell would like to have a word with you.

>>7998466
i like how that's the only thing you're able to nitpick out of that post

>>7998301
That's Puritan Christian morals. Rich are predestined to go to heaven, poor are predestined to go to hell. And that's the reason god made them rich or poor, and that's the reason we should let the poor fuck themselves and strive to be richer at their expense.

>>7998471
Depends.

If you live in America you can be truly poor yes. Is America a first world country then?

It's about a fair salary and about a fair distribution of wealth. Rich aren't rich because they *work harder,* imbeciles. They're rich because they get more than they need and deserve at the expense of others, who then become poor. How fucking hard does Paris Hilton work, cretins? Yet, none of you hard workers will ever have as much money as she does.
Isn't that fucking obvious?

>>7998394
Hmmmm.... I guess the Scandinavian countries aren't socialist then. Those capitalist bastards, keeping people out of poverty and distributing the wealth!

Communism is not that different from Capitalism. Both communist and capitalist societies need money.
While capitalism is a instable system of greed and power, the communism gets all the private enterprises (killing the instability) and then moving on.

The fact is that Rich people run the US and they won't let americans adept to the communism. If so, many conflicts are going to take place. And rebellion is always good for teenagers and unsatisfied people.
It's true there were only fucking facists leaders, but we should move on.

>>7998546
>They're rich because they get more than they need and deserve at the expense of others
Cliched fallacy is cliched

>>7998567
retarded conformist is retarded
stupidblox

>>7998546
Shame, there's really no such thing as getting "more than you need or deserve."

>>7998601
>conformist
Lolz, underageb& hipster detected.

>>7998610
So you never heard of theft then?

>>7998633
But it's not theft if they earned it.

>>7998645
Pfft. the top of the top are all backstabbers, thieves mafia and and murderers.

People, who are YOU to decide how much is enough and "fair"? Seriously, who are you to decide that?

>>7998645
Fact: only reach people can be thieves. No one else.

>>7998656
Well if they managed to get to the top by earning it, they're neither. What you're speaking of is nothing but a common social fallacy.

>>7998409
Yea in countries that have 1/100th the population we do.

>>7998656
which is an urban myth only the poor and low barrellers believe and spread

To be greedy is to be human.

>>7998567
Yeah, Madoff deserved all the money he got. Sending him to jail was a fucking injustice.
How about banks, bankers are such fucking hardworkers.
How about Lady Gaga and similar crap? Their work is so much more important and demanding than the work of a teacher. I mean, we can go on without garbage people, just take the garbage to the landfill yourself. But how could we live without singers and movie stars. How could we live without coke, nike and adidas. Those people are rich because they work hard doing activities and making products that are essential for our survival.

>>7998677
You fucking wish you deluded bastard. If evil did not provide an easier way no one would be evil but as you can see there is a lot of evil in the world a lot of which is greed.

Socialism doesn't work, there is no way for the people to regulate it.

Capitalism isn't perfect but it works, when there are enough middle classes they will demand a level playing field with the elite with whom they have an equal level of education and they will get it, at this point the elite can only exist as a meritocracy thus nullifying the catch "the privileged minority had no function" posited here.

>>7998489

Also George Orwell was refering to socialism in 1984 after the negative experiences he had with it during the Spanish civil war.

>>7998709
>Yeah, Madoff deserved all the money he got. Sending him to jail was a fucking injustice.
Well he scammed people, therefore an obvious thief. If this wasn't true, he wouldn't be in jail at all.
>How about banks, bankers are such fucking hardworkers.
Bankers have to constantly work hard and number crunch to make sure wealth is distributed properly, having to break sweats to make sure the distribution is too little or too much.
>How about Lady Gaga and similar crap?
It takes a lot of hard work and talent to make such music which sounds good to so many people (at a current time).

>>7998718
No, it is a fact, they managed to work hard and earn it, therefore justified. Good and evil do not exist, they are just social and cultural perceptions of norms.

>>7998778
Good and evil do exist, it's just that social and cultural perceptions do not reflect what is truly good and evil.

>>7998764
Yes in anywhere less than anarchy greed is evil.

>>7998665


lol bitches can't answer this question

>>7998787
No they are what define what is "good" and what is "evil." If you lived outside of society, culture, or anything away from people, good/evil has no application on anything whatsoever and in fact contradicts and threatens your own survival.

>>7998809
There is no such thing as "wanting too much." But by your logic, complaining about the rich is just as greedy.

>>7998809

>too much

By who's standards???? Who sets the guidelines by what is 'too much'? Who are YOU to decide what's too much???

>>7998183
>>7998677
>>7998666
>>7998689
>>7998758
>>7998764
>>7998778

You people are either trolls or pathetic unbelievable naive tools.

>>7998665
People who have 13 hours a day to play video games. That's fair, needed and deserved. The world would be a much better place if everybody could afford using their time like this.

>>7998854
Or you're just unintelligent and inexperienced.

>>7998871

>>7998873

I study marketing and corporate tactics.

>>7998844

Sure there is, it's called greed. That's what it's been for thousands of years. Capitalist drones like redefining greed as a virtue because it justifies being assholes whenever possible, with the underlying assumption that the magical free market will stop them from being too much of an asshole (it doesn't).

Moderation has long been a virtue among human beings.

>>7998870
But then once everyone can, it'll lose it's worth and value.

>>7998894
>because it justifies being assholes whenever possible
So?

soblox23

>>7998892
If that were true, you would simply not be making the argument you have in this thread.

>>7998892

OH SHIT SON YOU GOT US!! THERE IS NO COMEBACk FROM THAT.

Oh and my father is a CEO of General electric and I studied ninja tactics in Japan while simultaneously having an orgy with the bitches from Danity Kane.

>>7998894
But to be greedy is to be human, since everyone wants and desires something, and will work for to get it, some harder than others. That is the definition of human nature, to desire something and try to obtain it.

>>7998835
The dictionary defines what good and evil are. Let's take a look..

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/good
58 definitions here

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/evil
14

hmm I see your point, though technically I am right since the correct definition for good and evil is proven by utilitarianism, since this definition of good and evil is right, good and evil exist

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utilitarianism

>>7998894
Moderation can only be applicable if it's a culture or society where everything is easy to get (much like the modern world). Otherwise, it's virtually a myth.

>>7998914
Really why so? I'm just telling backing shit here. It would really be funny to watch anyone of you getting in competition with another company expecting to play fair game. What are you the troll from the fairy tale?

>>7998933
But dictionary definitions are only invented when a society associates a word with something, and that something/word association becomes common knowledge among individuals.

Proof: Fascism. The word really means "Strength through unity," but thanks to Nazi Germany and Fascist Spain and Italy, it is now defined as mere dictatorships.

>>7998926
>But to be greedy is to be human

See, there's that capitalist propaganda machine again. No, it's human to want a reasonable amount; what you need, what you earned, etc. Wanting too much is usually seen as being "greedy," which is a desire that's destructive to the community.

"Greed" is not going to your 9-5 and getting what you earn.

>>7998925
Apparently you are just dream baby long for the tooth fairy or do you really think you can intimidate me with that?

>>7998183
>Why is it that people can't seem to grasp and come to terms that poverty is an unfixable issue?

Oh fucking christ it is fixable! The reason why poverty exist is because of a lack of decent housing and two not having enough income. You solve those two things but providing decent affordable housing and raising the minimum wage to a living wage.

>>7998955
Because being human and alive is being greedy. Poverty is not fixable because every barrel has a bottom with the less valuable and desirable of the contents will begin to dwell, especially after time. The poor cannot be helped because every society has low enders no matter what system is placed, since nothing can be distributed evenly and fairly without value dropping or abuse happening by the common man. Where corporations are able to gain perfectly well, but only so much, but they earned it rightfully so, otherwise nothing they get would happen. This is why greed is a practical myth, as long as you gain and can put ownership over it, it's yours and you deserved it so.

>>7999018
But there's no such thing as greed, since it is human nature to desire something. How much you desire is meaningless, by the fact you just do is.

Like capitalist propaganda, it doesn't exist because it is an ideal.

>Oh fucking christ it is fixable! The reason why poverty exist is because of a lack of decent housing and two not having enough income. You solve those two things but providing decent affordable housing and raising the minimum wage to a living wage.

This has been tried. Observe 'da projects' in any given country for results (or Section 8 housing in the US). Some people are poor because they're complete retards and criminals. In modern society, which has pretty good equality of opportunity, people who are poor for other reasons usually stop being poor pretty quickly. This means the freer and less rigid your society is, the more the remaining poor people just should all be rounded up and sterilized.

>>7999044
But raising minimum wage laws means you have to cipher more money from a source, since it has to come from somewhere. But if you force someone to do it, it is practical thievery.

>>7999066

OMG I can't believe you are still down there! LOL

>>7998985
Then we need a 59th definition, good as in "what is the best choice" which is objectives dependant.

Fascists wanted everyone to suck on their fasces like subservient prison bitches (metaphorically), thus they wanted people to believe things like "diversity is strength" or whatever and decided that this is now "good".

However likewise there must be a definition of good which is based on self-evident truths, the definition of what is actually good in the universal sense. I'd place my chips with utilitarianism on this one, I'm not an angel, I do not believe utilitarianism is what is best for me as an individual, I would probably have to give all my money to charity and dedicate my life to ending poverty or something if I truly believed in it, but I cannot deny that logically it is the definition of "good".

>>7999115
But I am not in poverty, I am intelligent to work hard and get a better and higher paying job, through both education and experience, therefore I am at the top, and can afford what I want with no problem. I would afford more, but I put 50% my income into IRAs and savings and stock portfolios.

We can't eliminate the gap between rich and poor, but we can raise the standard of living for the poorest of society.

OH WAIT THAT'S WHAT CAPITALISM HAS BEEN DOING FOR OVER A CENTURY LOL

>>7999018

>reasonable amount

what the fuck is a reasonable amount? Who the fuck are you to determine what a reasonable amount is? What the fuck? Who is anyone to determine what a reasonable amount is for someone else? For fucks sake! Where do you think we are Cuba? Look at them!

>>7999139
This, pretty much. Economic freedom essentially takes power from the evil capitalists and gives it to the people, decreasing it for "the people's republic" only results in shitholes like North Korea.

>>7999124
But there is no real definition of good or evil, one cannot be made without contradicting other ideals or bias. In order to make a true and real definition, you need one that can cover everything without flaw or conflict, that can include all sides and contradict none of them. But there is no general definition that isn't biased or has accuracy, therefore one cannot be made until so.

>>7993944
That's one of the most racist things I've read all day. I can't honestly believe you believe that. You're just trolling, right? ...RIGHT? DEAR GOD PLEASE SAY YOU ARE. :(

I love how conservatives are all christ this and jesus saves that, but as soon as it comes to the poor, it's "fuck em, it's their fault, they deserve to die"

Spoilers ahead!


I don't think god will like that.

>>7999194
But attempting to regulate it would only result in freedoms being taken away.

>>7999194
Ya, but dis shit we got is far from unregulated. There are established limits to contracts, bankruptcy, etc. Features essential to prevent abuses.

Now lately, some banks have been breaking the law and getting away with it (see: reserve ratio), which is very uncool. Just enforce the law people.

>>7999154
"Economic freedom"???

Do you think there are so many good jobs that just anyone can walk a block and pick up something paying $30k a year? Are you that dense? Have you been on Mars for the last 3 years, or do you live in some lucky country with 3% unemployment?

People with degrees and good work histories are one thing, but what about people without degrees or with limited work history? Are we going to let them beg?

"Economic Freedom" in the sense of being free to work part time for minimum wage if you are lucky enough to beat 30 other poor saps for the job is NOT freedom. True "Economic Freedom" is having enough that you have choices in your life and can better it through your own means.

>>7999139
That arrow has been turned in the opposite direction for the last 30+ years - the lowest 1/5th in America has had dropping income since the 1970's. So "capitalism" (which we don't really have) has LOWERED the standard of living for the poorest for the last 3+ decades...

>>7999114
That claim is proven false because the people who oppose minimum wage increases are the big companies.

The minimum wage has been increased many times, and they pull this claim, and when it was raised nothing big happened.

>>7999288
But it's true, if you force anyone to pay or give more than they are willing or able, then you're stealing from them.

Do you know how people get around minimum wage laws? They employ illegals.
Republican establishment loves the illegals and won't deport them because of the $.
Democratic establishment loves the illegals and won't deport them because of the future voters.

Americans get fucked.

>>7999304
Perhaps, but companies are not human. Walmart for example. If it could get away with paying it's employees $1 an hour, do you think it wouldn't? Companies do not give a shit about anything but the colour of ink and the number of zeros in their bottom line. You can't say "oh libertarianism would work companies would self regulate", because you're basing that on the idea that companies have morals, and they don't.

we need rules and regulations so we aren't all making the same wage as saheed in india.

>>7999341
>companies are not human
So? They are run by humans, therefore should have the laws and rights applied to them as well. After all, any businesses out there is helping to stimulate the economy.

>>7999341
>Companies do not give a shit about anything but the colour of ink and the number of zeros in their bottom line.

This is actually a legal fact - corporations are required by law to behave this way. See Dodge v. Ford Motor Company.

>>7999375
Yes, in our current system. But we can't give them free reign, this isn't the feudal era anymore. Companies with no restrictions would easily destroy a nation entirely.

Enjoy your Coca~Cola brand baby and Honda brand mandatory t-shirt on the way to your "unpaid work experience".

I think that a reasonable and effective step toward closing the income gap and alleviating the effects of poverty is to provide reasonable education, including primary, secondary and university education. an educated individual has the ability to critically analyze a situation, set goals and communicate ideas with others. In a free form situation a group of people can communicate and develop disparate ideas and eventually reach a consensus about what the best course of action is. The reason that poverty has been so pervasive in history is that illiteracy has always been equally pervasive; there has never before been an effective way to combat it. Once literacy and critical thinking skills are possessed by the majority of the people real reform can begin.

Thoughts?

ITT Puritans still alive and kicking, even at 400 years old.

>>7999512
Education is just another commodity in a capitalist society. The government has no real interest in giving tools to citizens to learn to think critically. This thread is a living proof that the more ignorant and imbecile people are, the better they fit the capitalist society. Schools are actually the waiting room for the work site or prison. Otherwise, kids would be out there, doing *bad* things or wasting their working parent to actually spend time raising them. And capitalists use the time spent in school to brainwash future cogs. It's all profit, really.

>>7999680
You never read Max Weber, have you?
Maybe I am wrong, these kids are just Greed is good Reagan left overs.

>>7999512
They still have to work somewhere.

If everyone had a PhD, somebody would still have to serve coffee at Starbucks or burgers at McDonalds. Education is not a replacement for a robust economy.

It's weird because fat fucks who eat more than they need should be gods for you. Then again, you are fat fucks.

>>7999716
robots, fellow robot.

>>7999716
It doesn't matter what you do, but how you do it.

>>7999716
Real educated people know that McShit food is crap and won't eat there. They eat healthy food not corporation crap. Small farmers would thrive and mass produced crap peddling corporations would die.

>>7999716
Rednecks and Capitalists truly despise education. It's visible in your post and all over this thread.

>>7999746
We're not there yet technologically. Also, robot espresso tastes like shit, I know, I worked at Starbucks on both manual and automatic machines and manual espresso is MUCH better.

>>7999806
This is like my second post in this thread. And I'm all for education, but guess what? You still have to have jobs. Having a degree does not guarantee work.

>>7999716
Ah, but some people actually want to run at and work in coffee shops, or small delicatessens. There are many small business owners who work in the service industry who are educated professionals. I'm not suggesting that everyone needs to work in a tech-related industry (although I am not convinced that a further and significant portion of our agricultural and service industries could be mechanized, further outmoding unskilled labor); rather I am advocating higher education as a means to enrich life AND to create a larger class of educated individual who possesses the mien needed to organize, confer intelligently and press their rights.

>>7999341

Quite the contrary sir, Corporations are technically "persons". Look that up.

>>7998183

Post-scarcity society called, it informs you that you are a niggerfaggot.