Yeah.. that's not even true.

Women look to men for things other than physical appearance for attractiveness (like confidence).

Men look towards women primarily for the physical appearance for outward attractiveness.

Men can look scruffy as long as it doesn't affect their confidence.

>>1527036

Yes it is. I've seen so many "plain" girls post their pictures on 4chan and it's always met with, "Good god, OP, do something with your hair ... pluck your eyebrows ... uh, a little mascara wouldn't hurt ... why are you wearing such a heavy shirt?"

Yeah, those women you are talking about are fucking repulsive, OP. Stop being a delusional cunt.

Ugly girls need to put in an effort to look good, naturally good looking girls don't need to do anything.
Also, I'm sure there's some biological aspects to scruffy men being attractive. They look dominant.

However, your argument fails to put into account that everyone has their own opinions and nuances to what they find attractive.

>>1527034
i prefer women like that. they're usually smarter, and easier to talk to

Because there isn't much guys can do to doll themselves up without looking feminine. They don't have to put in an effort. I like the scruffy look on guys. And generally guys are the one to make the first move, so why wouldn't they make that move on someone who looks good?

>>1527054
>be black
>walk into the kkk meeting
>surprised when you're lynched
Female detected. You probably think rape can't be avoided as well.
You might just be retarded OP.
We don't like any kind of women here unless they are getting us off. We don't even like it when they post.

I hate drawn on eyebrows
I think a girls hair looks best just being natural right after a shower (once dry)

Girls do this shit for themselves. Sure makeup helps but they do it so they feel more confident. Guys don't notice anything, like if your fingernails are painted or not.

I'm the opposite, apparently.

If I see a girl with too much obvious make-up, or fake fingernails, or too much jewelry, or even with an attitude like "i know i look good," I avoid like the plague. It's not a naive sense of fear, either. I've been around the block. It's more because I know that the person under the layers doesn't have the same priorities or values that I do, so I immediately dismiss a chance at conversation with them. they're on an alien planet as far as I'm concerned.

What would I possibly have in common with someone who spends all their disposable income on makeup and fake hair/nails, or boutique clothing? It's obvious female peacocking and telegraphs what they're looking for. And that's obviously not me.

>>1527078

You know what I hate seeing? That emo bump shit some girls do. I swear to god that's the most unattractive thing you could do with your hair, other than shave it all off.

Yeah, and I don't even notice nails either. I don't give a shit.

Here's how I look at it: scruffy men look good because they look like men. Scruffiness is natural. Womens to me look good if they look like womens, which means I think if they shave or wax their hair, or put way too much effort into making themselves look like little girls, well they look like little girls and not like womens. If you like little girls, I guess unrealistic hairlessness is attractive.

At the same time, I don't have asnything against minimal makeup, or legshaving or whatnot. But most women in the west take it to a ridiculous extreme.

Personally, since I'm a pussy eater, all I ask for is an occasional bush trimming from time to time to make things easier for me.

>>1527113
I thought OP was talking about different things. Like, I pluck my eyebrows, keep my split ends trimmed, shave, and occasionally wear light make-up. This is generally expected of females, and OP seems to think there's something wrong with that because men don't have to do it.

>>1527113
How cute
You just can't tell when women are wearing makeup. It's possible to cake it all on and not look like you are caking it all on.

Those girls that you think have "natural beauty"? They don't. They're just good at looking like they do.

>>1527132

OP is talking about a different thing, that's just his own form of peacocking by being a reebbbbbbbbbbbbelll

>>1527132

What I'm asking is, why is it that men notice women who alter their natural looks and women would find it off-putting if a man rearranged his eyebrows and skin color? You can tell me that it's cultural conditioning, but it's nothing like the rest of the animal kingdom where it's the males who peacock.

>>1527132

Vanity and hygiene are 2 very different things. I keep clean, trim my bodyhair and try to smell good whenever possible. I think that's more common courtesy and self-respect than anything else.

Also, girls in hoodies and jeans make me hard.

>>1527116
emo bump shit? You mean pinning a fringe straight back so it makes a bump? I fucking hate that too, shit looks awful.

>>1527170

At least one nigga knows what's up.

>>1527178
>maximum
>brofist

>>1527150

There's a big and obnoxious difference between someone who touches their face and eyes up before they leave the house and someone who obviously spends hours in the mirror.

When most women picture a "scruffy" guy they are actually talking about some movie star with a painstakingly cultivated look.

>>1527170

OP again. What's worse is those fucking messy buns they wear now. That's another thing ... why do girls adopt the styles that are proving to be currently most popular even when they look like shit? Remember the enormous glasses?

Why is it that men are perfectly satisfied with women that are completely devoid of personality, yet if a man similarly is boring, unconfident, un-alpha, he's overlooked for the guys who puff out their chests and act like douchey frat bros?

>Why is it that women are perfectly satisfied with the way ATTRACTIVE men look even at their scruffiest
Fixed that one for ya, OP. You can thank me later.

>>1527202

I think of hardworking guys who work in trades and come home smelling all yummy, covered in oil and sweat.

>>1527208

Oh, you're surprised women are attracted to attractive men? YA DON'T FUCKING SAY?!

I know this sounds cliche as fuck, but women are more attracted to personality than looks. Men are more visual. But make no mistake, both are equally shallow. Just in different ways.

>mfw men think they can tell when girls are wearing makeup
haha oh wow
concealer, light mascara, eyebrow pencils

these things can be done in moderation and still look what you perceive to be as "natural"

every girl looks "scruffy" without light makeup and grooming, no matter how objectively attractive they are

why do men assume every girl who isn't wearing two layers of foundation and visible eye makeup is "natural"

>>1527034
That's KStewart

All of my erection.

She looks hot even if it's scuffy.

Your post describes the opposite. Hot girls who dress like crap are still popular.

Dressing up is more important for guys than for girls.

>>1527217

do you get that feel from oilfield workers hunnie

>>1527254

>mfw virgins swear most men don't know what a girl in make-up looks like, just because they themselves don't

http://heartiste.wordpress.com/2010/06/04/dress-like-a-sexy-beast/

Dressing up never makes a difference for girls. If your hairstyle isn't hideous, you don't wear terrible glasses, nothing really matters.

Makeup, bone structure, etc, matter a lot for PHOTOS.

If you don't get approached by guys, you're ugly. It's that simple.

Girls without make-up and all that other gay shit: God-tier = attention from small group of friend-zoned guys.

Girls with make-up and all that gay shit: Wanting validation, can be given such in exchange for sex = gets attention from wide body of people.

>>1527076
Wait. There are girls who ACTUALLY think that rape can't be prevented? This isn't just an elaborate troll?

>>1527254
This

I've seen men post examples of "natural beauty", when the woman is obviously wearing eyebrow-liner, and subtle lip/eye makeup, and even some with mild foundation.

>>1527314
I don't really know what that person means exactly.

But I think they might mean it like, "Sexual agression/rape is hard wired into a few males' mind" because of the evolutionary benefit to prevent it dying out?

>she's overlooked for the girls who alter their looks in ways that aren't natural (ie. plucking eyebrows, elaborate hairstyles, etc?)

There are many guys who go for tomboys and otherwise casually styled or dressed females.
If I see a girl who hasn't put hours into her looks, gone natural, without being bothered by it on the contrary I usually get interested wondering why she decide to make an effort rather than live life in "lol ima girrrrl" easy mode.

>>1527333
Humans are pretty much evolved NOT to rape (check out the differences between a chimp and a human's cock, for a start), I don't really understand why people so into evopsyche want to pretend rape is oh-so-natural and the way nature intended.

>>1527271
Not me, but virginity has nothing to do with it.

My mother is a make-up artist, so I can spot it a mile off.

>>1527347
Ah, wait - I don't mean it's the most favoured method by natural selection. I meant that the reason it hasn't died out COMPLETELY (because obv consensual sex = better chances of successful mating and offspring surviving) is because it CAN be a successful method of reproduction.

The did a study with mice, about how male embryos with higher androgens mated with more females, but didn't stick around after mating. Those with lower androgens didn't get to mate with as many females, but stuck around to help bring up the kids.
the reason one wasn't favoured by natural selection over the other was because they're both successful methods. I know we can't really extrapolate that to humans, that's just to better explain the point I was making.

There's a difference between looking scruffy and not caring about your appearence.
We got beards and other unwanted hair growth too. Gotta shave that shit.
Acne? Gotta take care of that shit.
But I can wake up one morning and be out the door in five minutes because the grooming procedure is not as constant as it is for women. You have my sympaties for all that shit women put on even when they want to reach the bare minumum of acceptable. "Natural" is not natural at all.

lol they're satisfied with the way I look when I'm scruffy? In my experience not really... Sure if I have a girlfriend she's not going to leave me or refrain from kissing me because I have a beard, but I'm not going to be picking up chicks if I look like that.

>>1527418
I don't really know of what you're saying is true or not - I was just commenting on the fact that evopsyche follows love to claim rape is the natural way for humans to mate, when evidence points to rape being pretty unbecoming of humans.

>>1527481
You act like having a beard instantly repels any new woman that meets you.

If they're over 18, or otherwise immature, this is usually not the case

Because a guy doesn't have to look good to be attractive to a woman. He can make up for looks by being rich or famous. Men typically don't care that much about how rich or famous a woman is. It's about how she looks.

>>1527435
By Gandalf's beard, thank you. It's time consuming and painful at times to look nice. I have slight acne at times, my eye brows grow back, shaved hair grows back. If I find a little bit of unwanted facial hair, I pluck it off...On top of that, I apply make up to look "natural". Thank you, sir. Bless you. Truly.

>>1527594
'Character' can also be an attractive feature. Though hard to define. But it explains the attraction to humour and musicians and the like.

>>1527597
>I apply make up to look "natural".

Stop that.

>>1527635

or lack of it, in the cases of what most girls tend to flock to.

>>1527660
You ever seen a pale, blonde (i.e. light eyelashes and eyebrows, often flushed cheeks) go out without ANY make-up? They get comments like "You look tired"/"You look ill".

>>1527677
>caring what retards think

Are you even trying?

>>1527662
I think /r9k/ is damaging your view of woman a bit too much. You're only focusing on the airheads and girls, and ignoring the rest of them.

>>1527677
>This is me
Are you sure you're not just tired or ill?

>>1527694
You're using a pretty loose definition of retard there. I mean yeah, these are the people with enough lack of tact to actually say it to people's faces... which means there are going to be shit loads more that think that, and don't say it.

>>1527217

Yeah, but you're picturing a moderately handsome, slim young man in those positions.

Good luck finding one you unrealistic cunt.

>>1527677

She would look fine with a proper diet, exercise and going outside once in a while. The light eyelashes and eyebrows shouldn't be an issue. That's how blonde fucking works.

>>1527712

You're talking about people who can't recognize what humans look like. I'm assuming this is all male, but even still, it's at least borderline.

>>1527577
I don't exactly grow that whole indie hipster beard people seem to love so much, 3 days and I look like the god damned wolfman.

I can't pull that look, if I grow it out I look deranged. But my gf does say I look better with 1 day beard growth, anything after that is no good.

If it makes any difference, OP, I'm into eyebrows. Eyebrow plucking is a crime. That said, I'm not into grunge, so wearing some dark hoody that does nothing to compliment your complete lack of cosmetic style will do you no favors.

On a side note, I've gone through some pretty goddamned scruffy phases, and no, girls didn't into me. I think girls like to know that you at least give a shit.

Dunno about you OP.

But i like women with minimalistic classic styles. Plucked eyebrows/caked on makeup and elaborate hairstyles, mostly just turns me off, it can be especially ugly. Often it still works for women sometimes though. But i would still never consider them GF material if they are trying so hard.

>>1527734
No. 'Going outside' doesn't miraculously make your skin look better if you live somewhere cold (where blondes tend to be abundant).

It's mostly the 'washed out' looks, caused by a lack of defintion, especially around the eye area, that gives the look that people consider "tired". Plus some variation in skin tone over the face is natural.

>>1527594

Protip: The more rich and famous you are, the more you can afford to look attractive. The reason I don't even bother going to /fa/ is that no matter how good their fashion advice it, it still doesn't change the fact that I can only afford to shop at Ross, and can only afford a $7 haircut.

>>1527754
>3 days and I look like the god damned wolfman

...p-pics?

>>1527034
I for one much prefer my girlfriend when she hasn't done her hair, it's just slightly curly over one shoulder, and she has no makeup on. She only usually wears light makeup, she's not an orangutang with loads of fake tan or anything.

>>1527802

You can get a sunburn at a ski lodge. I think getting outside a little more would help your complexion no matter where you live.

>>1527802

Does this cold place also get no sunny days?

>>1527813

Some girls can pull this off, but I've seen too many girls who forego makeup on one day for whatever reason, and you realize how buttered their faces really are.

>>1527810

True, but a rich and famous guy doesn't have to keep his looks up to attract women. It's good for those in Hollywood, but there are plenty of millionaires who look like shit and still pull in women.

>>1527832
Same anon you replied to.

She is really pale, and looks kind of ill, but I find it cute. Same when she's in just some baggy clothing.

>>1527347
>I don't really understand why people so into evopsyche want to pretend rape is oh-so-natural and the way nature intended.

People who are into evopsych don't give a damn about how eolution actually works, they want an excuse for the next bitches and whores rant.
So they extrapolate from their half-assed ideas about "our ancestors" and if they're really thorough, they'll tack on some methodologically unsound study with random MRT scans stapled to it.

>>1527827
>the UK

Except for a bit in the summer, going outside doesn't encourage much of a tan. I'm sure the same would apply to some other countries near here too.

I don't know man, when I see an attractive girl with her hair all messy and barely any makeup I'm pretty into it.

>>1527810
Spoken like a newfag who doesn't know how to look for cheap clothes that look similar to the expensive ones.

[/spoiler]lolno[/spoiler]

Because you're looking for the wrong kind of guy to give you attention.
Similar to the robots who long for superficial girls who want nothing but money.

When I hear a guy say how attractive he finds natural beauty and how he dislikes makeup, I feel he has more value as a partner. I know he won't abandon me as I age and lose youthful good looks. Same probably goes for a guy who hears a girl values personality over money or something. She won't abandon him once he loses his job.

>>1527810

Isn't Ross one of those places that sells discount name-brand clothing? Like TJMaxx?

>>1527929
>Similar to the robots who long for superficial girls who want nothing but money.

G...Guys.

Guys, I think I found the problem with /r9k/.

>>1527949
B... Buh.... She's a beautiful angel and her eyes look so nice in that jpg I saved off her facebook. That asshole she's with will never understand her like I do

>>1527966
You hit a little too close to home there for me.

I like it when girls make an effort, but don't go overboard.

I'm a sucker for big messy hair though, that frazzled bleach blonde just doesn't do it for me. Extensions, too, what the fuck?
Eye make-up is fine, mascara and eyeliner and all of that as long as they dont look like a panda.
Just no fucking caked on foundation. If you can see the foundation or it's changing your skin tone, it's too much. I hate hugging girls and ending up with big brown marks on my shoulder.

Putting effort into how you dress doesn't have to mean wearing dresses everywhere, it just means not wearing sweatpants and Uggs.

>>1528110
>Extensions, too, what the fuck?
Haha, extensions are fucking retarded in most cases. I've seen people complain about wanting longer hair, then go and get their hair cut every month or so - and not just trimmed.

If you want long hair, fucking grow it. It's not that hard.

>>1528020
If that statement still phases you at all you need to spend more time on /r9k/
Misogyny cured me of that line of thinking. I'm actually grateful to /r9k/ for that.

>>1528286
No, the misogyny feeds from that sort of thinking. The belief that all women are like the ones you detest.

Because the scruffy girls are all addicted to crack or are stuck up bitches who are bitter at the world.

>>1527150
Or your just retarded and unable to tell so you think nobody else can.
Makeup can be a good thing, sometimes even when caked on when it's interesting but not when it's just a carbon copy of something someone else does or is to plain,
At that point might as well keep it natural.
Makeup doesn't change bone structure, It's used to try and fake it, but you can still see the original obviously.

>>1528320
Exactly. The problem is that these faggots decide they want one specific woman, they think they can groom her into getting in a relationship with them like a pedophile grooms a child...

Then when all their attempts to attract a woman fail miserably and result in embarrassing failure they suddenly decide that it's the fault of women and that they're all whores...

These people need to get the fuck out of here with that shit. First off not everyone is going to be compatible with you. Just because you like her doesn't mean she's gonna think you're perfect for her...

My solution to this is to try my luck with as many women as I possibly can at one time. The shitty ones I end up ignoring and I start to focus on two or three that meet my criteria. Which is not after money (easy to weed those ones out, tell girls you're broke, they drop like flies) not some kind of jesus freak who isn't gonna give up the pussy (I stay FAR from these ones) and I have to be able to hold a decent conversation with her...

If you avoid the shitty ones there's no reason to cry that women are bitches and whores...

If you have to wear makeup to look good then you're probably below average in terms of looks, asians in general are a good example of this.

I visited /soc/ for the first time since it came out to see if I could find a picture of a below average girl with make up on to show you what I mean, but I forgot that they only have chubby/ big girl threads there.

>>1527076

Get back to /b/, that type of mindset isn't acceptable here.

Is this true at all?

I live in a big city and I don't see girls with guys who're at least not 7/10, even when its an average girl.

Those guys look good without any grooming. And for guys look doesn't matter that much. I've seen plenty of girls who can sleep around and get boyfriends because they have a vagina but they couldn't do the same if they were guys.

I remember once a thread here that girls were asked to show their supposedly "average" boyfriends and no one showed up. The thing is that being average is not good enough for girls, but its good enough for guys.

>>1528560
lol but a big city is quite different from say, Traverse City, Michigan which is where I come from

It's a smallish city, a lot of bullshit hippie mentality there... Lots of attractive girls and all the guys look like shit. So you see lots of guys that look like they belong in a trailer park with girls that are easily 8s...

All depends on where it is and the pool of people you have to choose from.

Statistically, women find about 60% of men to be "below average" in looks.

>>1528617
more like 80%.

I assume op is a butthurt femanon.
You shit this bed with your feminist feces now deal with it.

>that feel when your ideal woman is wearing a sweatshirt, tight jeans, cuffed, and some vans sneakers.
>that feel when women wearing boots and weird skirts and all that flashy bullshit is terrible looking.
>that feel when women have the most fucked up fashion sense I could ever conceive of.

pic related, fuck the scarf, and I like pullovers more on girls, no idea why, but this is the easiest pic I found on google images

>>yet if a woman similarly puts no efforts into her looks
You're full of fucking shit.

I know a few gamer girls on youtube who don't do dick other then dye their hair and bath regularly and I'd still fuck them.

Look up pressheartocontinue and her pink haired friend.

>>1528729

>that feel when as I female I will always prefer dresses and skirts because they're feminine and that's what I like about being female, is being feminine

>>1527054
>>1527054
>>1527054
What the fuck?

I see the exact opposite. The only board that has high standards of women and critique them is /fa/.

/b/ will call you fat, but still want to see your tits

/soc/ will elevate you to the status of worship

/v/ will just be bad that you are calling attention to yourself as a woman

>>1528749
you forgot though, you are not a 11/10, so a girl wont care what you think of her, because she wants perfection

>>1528759
>that feel when I will always be attracted to dresses and skirts because they're feminine and that's what I like about females, femininity

My view is women who need makeup are ugly. If you arent pretty without then you arent worth any mans time hamface. I tell girls that makeup makes them look ugly, plenty actually stop for a time and they dont need it. Makeup and cosmetics are dumb.

Tldr: only ugly girls need altering.

>>1528868

>no one is out to impress specifically you
>suck it up

most girls have absolutely nothing other than their looks going for them

if i like a chick for who she is i dont care what she looks like (within reason) and i dont even rly notice other girls