Canada, 1914 !!Kr4AwRi+w4o
09/12/12(Wed)08:22
No.5428568

Canada, 1914 !!Kr4AwRi+w4o 09/12/12(Wed)08:22 No.5428568

File: 1347452534769.jpg-(82 KB, 425x593, 1339072317951.jpg)

Whoa, seriously? Second this.
Dutchbros, report in.

We need all the information we can get.

Canada, 1914 !!Kr4AwRi+w4o
09/12/12(Wed)08:23
No.5428582

Canada, 1914 !!Kr4AwRi+w4o 09/12/12(Wed)08:23 No.5428582

Replies: >>5428728

>>5428509 (OP)
OP, you might wanna check out /int/ as well.
They may have some Dutchbro's garunteed online.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)08:31
No.5428691

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)08:31 No.5428691

>implying the dutch labour wont win this

nothing is happening and if it would people wouldn't do shit about it

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)08:34
No.5428728

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)08:34 No.5428728

Replies: >>5428736

>>5428582

Don't think I'll lay a foot in there. Just did a search and it looks like the outcome will be a "pro-European centre-right coalition".

Kind of disappointed. But still, I would like some /pol/ dutch to aware us.

Canada, 1914 !!Kr4AwRi+w4o
09/12/12(Wed)08:35
No.5428736

Canada, 1914 !!Kr4AwRi+w4o 09/12/12(Wed)08:35 No.5428736

Replies: >>5428765

>>5428728
What about Geert? Any word?

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)08:37
No.5428765

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)08:37 No.5428765

>>5428736

He will be 3rd or 4th from what I've seen.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)08:37
No.5428766

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)08:37 No.5428766

Replies: >>5428784

A while ago on /int/:

>>>/int/5864967

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)08:38
No.5428784

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)08:38 No.5428784

>>5428766

Thanks for the heads up! Will take a look.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)08:44
No.5428866

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)08:44 No.5428866

Replies: >>5428922 >>5428972 >>5429199 >>5430156 >>5431200 >>5432543 >>5434829

Dutchbro here, I'll try to explain the current situation:

We have a total of 21 political parties but there are about 7 important ones that I will describe here shortly:

VVD (Capitalist, for personal and economic freedom, small government)
PvdA (Social Democrat, pro-immigrant, higher taxes for the rich, also pro-EU)
SP (Socialist, kind of like the PvdA but way more socialist and less pro-EU)
PVV (Geert Wilders' party, Anti-immigrant, for personal freedoms on most points, small government, very anti-EU, want to quit the Euro)
D66 ("Democrats", very pro-EU, don't really know their other points)
CDA (Christian, center party, probably halfway between the VVD and PvdA for most issues)
GL (Green, environmentalist, socialist, pro-immigrant)
Christenunie (Christian but a bit more Socialist than CDA)

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)08:45
No.5428885

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)08:45 No.5428885

http://nos.nl/liveblog/417626-live-de-verkiezingen-2012.html

The party leaders now have all cast their votes it seems.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)08:48
No.5428922

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)08:48 No.5428922

Replies: >>5428983

>>5428866

Thanks for taking your time posting this.

Can you tell me what is the expected outcome?

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)08:52
No.5428972

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)08:52 No.5428972

Replies: >>5429075 >>5429365

>>5428866
cont.

Now the latest polls:

VVD 35
PvdA 35
SP 20
PVV 17
CDA 12
D66 11
Christenunie 6
GL 4

In the past 2 weeks the PvdA has climbed a lot from 18 to 35 seats, but I don't really believe this is real. On national TV the PvdA has been in the spotlight the most, expecially at the expense of the SP, and most polls and media are biased toward the PvdA, I think they hope to get people to vote for the PvdA by releasing these polls.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)08:52
No.5428980

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)08:52 No.5428980

Replies: >>5429044

PVV sounds good.

Good luck dutchbros I hope you don't vote in the nigger lovers.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)08:52
No.5428983

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)08:52 No.5428983

File: 1347454353129.jpg-(94 KB, 550x612, 1347293595469.jpg)

>>5428922

Different Dutchfag here. The Social Democrats (PvdA) and the Economic Liberals/ Conservatives (VVD) are going to be the big winners. The question is, who is going to deliver the new PM? This is why I voted for the rightwing VVD.

No left wing goverment under my watch.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)08:56
No.5429044

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)08:56 No.5429044

Replies: >>5429151 >>5429153

File: 1347454581281.jpg-(53 KB, 537x755, 1342609109462.jpg)

>>5428980

The PVV are (although anti Islam and anti Immigration) puppets for their zionist overlords.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)08:58
No.5429075

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)08:58 No.5429075

Replies: >>5429151 >>5429152

>>5428972
cont again (this could be a long story and it is my personal analysis, so it is not necessarily true)

To understand these polls one must look at the previous election when the PVV had 18 seats in the polls, and 24 in the real elections.
The total number of seats in the Dutch parliament is 150 by the way, and a number of parties need to have at least 76 seats to form a coalition.

Another thing that could be important for your understanding of the policies of the different parties, /pol/, is that I just checked the Dutch subreddit and exactly as I expected almost everyone supports D66 and a few GL and PvdA.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:03
No.5429151

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:03 No.5429151

Replies: >>5429219

>>5429075

4/idontknow

>>5429044
They are actually against the kosher (and halal) slaughter of animals, which made 2 Jews leave the party and write a book with bad things about Wilders.

The PVV is pro-Israel though, and a lot of people in Holland have more trouble with muslims than with Jews.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:03
No.5429152

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:03 No.5429152

>>5429075

Well shit. I guess you guys over there like dem immigration.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:03
No.5429153

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:03 No.5429153

Replies: >>5429231 >>5429239

>>5429044
proof?

oh thats right liberals can only simply conject.

NationalistischKindje
09/12/12(Wed)09:04
No.5429156

NationalistischKindje 09/12/12(Wed)09:04 No.5429156

Replies: >>5429266 >>5429277

File: 1347455047577.png-(219 KB, 488x487, 325251.png)

From leftist to Right our most important parties simply put

>GroenLinks
Enviromental activists

>SP
Socialistische Partij, the major hype of the moment, absolute pigdisgrace leader.

>PvdA
Partij van de Arbeid, Immigrants, and merely because they are "Arbeid" in their name alot of elder working class folk blindly vote them although they have spit on their own roots more then any other party.

>D66
Democraten '66, Centrist, barely anyone knows their standpoints as all they say is hurr this is bad hurr that is bad, but never bring a solution.

>CU
Christen Unie, Shit tier Christians.

>CDA
Christen-Democratisch Appèl, Mainstream christian party, becoming more centrist by the day while their folk is jumping ship at rapid rates.

>SGP
Staatkundig Gereformeerde Partij, Protestant conservatives, they don't get national funding because they don't allow women in the party.

>VVD
Volkspartij voor Vrijheid en Democratie, very capitalist, been the main leader the past years, a reliable party.

>PVV
Partij voor de Vrijheid, Nationalistic, with both interesting very right and very socialist stands. Mainly known for Wilders and anti-Islam.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:07
No.5429199

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:07 No.5429199

>>5428866
>>5428866
>>5428866


The only logical choice is the PVV

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:08
No.5429219

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:08 No.5429219

Replies: >>5434824

>>5429151

5/

I've voted for the PVV myself because they're the only party that stands up against the growing power of the non-democratic EU.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:09
No.5429231

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:09 No.5429231

File: 1347455349408.jpg-(25 KB, 600x450, fractiekamer_pvv.jpg)

>>>5429153

Here is your proof.

http://pvv.nl/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1523

http://www.krapuul.nl/blog/69610/pvv-kreeg-idee-voor-polenmeldpunt-uit-israel/

Pic related, it's their party headquarters.

NationalistischKindje
09/12/12(Wed)09:09
No.5429239

NationalistischKindje 09/12/12(Wed)09:09 No.5429239

Replies: >>5429261 >>5429287 >>5429339 >>5429816

File: 1347455382885.jpg-(77 KB, 604x457, 1335820292772.jpg)

>>5429153
The PVV doesn't get national funding because it doesn't want to say where they get their money from, so there is rumor going that they get it from the Mossad.

Alot of "Neo-Nazis" unrightfully spit on the thought of the PVV as they only see the Jew-Muslim conflict.

True National Socialists see that we must preserve a Christian identity and that neither Jew or Muslim should be welcome here.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:11
No.5429261

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:11 No.5429261

Replies: >>5429326

File: 1347455483111.jpg-(615 KB, 1780x1776, 803341326347.jpg)

>>5429239
>True National Socialists see that we must preserve a Christian identity and that neither Jew or Muslim should be welcome here.

> True National Socialist
> Preserve Christian Identity

Nigger what?

Pic related

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:12
No.5429266

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:12 No.5429266

Replies: >>5429326 >>5430123

>>5429156
>Groenlinks most leftist
You couldn't be more wrong. Actually even the PVV is probably more leftist than Groenlinks. PVV likes to pretend to be a right wing party, but that's only on social issues. On economical issues they're probably left wing. In the meantime, Groenlinks has economical views that belong to a centre party like D66 and CDA. Both PVDA and SP are more left wing. Groenlinks are only a leftist party by name anymore.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:13
No.5429277

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:13 No.5429277

>>5429156

6/

This is probably a better description of the parties than mine.
The only thing that's wrong is that the CDA voters aren't jumping ship, they're dying.

And before anyone goes "PVV sosilism bad hurrr": The only socialist stands of the PVV are on affordable healthcare and care for the elderly if I'm correct, for the rest they are quite economically right wing.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:13
No.5429287

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:13 No.5429287

>>5429239
>Christianity
>not a Jewish belief system/ideology

Pick one.

NationalistischKindje
09/12/12(Wed)09:17
No.5429326

NationalistischKindje 09/12/12(Wed)09:17 No.5429326

Replies: >>5429400

File: 1347455821883.jpg-(57 KB, 354x500, 1328483138978.jpg)

>>5429266
I'm sorry then, I have never put any process of thought in Groenlinks.

>>5429261
National Socialism is a secular political ideology, so it could be implemented in any area with it's corresponding religion.
What I meant was Dutch National Socialism, and as our fundamentals are based upon Christianity and more specifically Protestant that is what we should treasure.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:18
No.5429339

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:18 No.5429339

Replies: >>5429467

File: 1347455881856.jpg-(45 KB, 468x347, article-1104752-02ECEE0C0(...).jpg)

>>5429239
>neither Jew or Muslim should be welcome here
pic related

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:18
No.5429348

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:18 No.5429348

pol

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:20
No.5429365

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:20 No.5429365

Replies: >>5429450

>>5428972
Remember that first RTL4 debate where Samson was decided to be the 'best' debater as decided by an internet poll? He got well over 50% of the votes, while Roemer only got a couple percent, definitely stuffed. Roemer isn't a great debater, but he's not that bad.

This along with all the pushing PvdA received on NOS, to the point of them saying it was VVD fault for them not entering into a coalition last time around instead of Cohen's stubbornness makes it really obvious it's a lot of bullshit.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:23
No.5429400

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:23 No.5429400

Replies: >>5429437

>>5429326

Dutch National Socialism is based on the "Dietsche Volksgemeenschap" thought. Not based on religion in any way.

NationalistischKindje
09/12/12(Wed)09:25
No.5429437

NationalistischKindje 09/12/12(Wed)09:25 No.5429437

>>5429400
Yes that's what I'm saying.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:26
No.5429450

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:26 No.5429450

Replies: >>5429565

>>5429365

Yes that's when I first thought something was kind of fishy with the sudden succes of the PvdA, I think it was all planned a couple of weeks ago when they saw the real polls were in favor of the SP.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:27
No.5429467

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:27 No.5429467

Replies: >>5429506 >>5429509 >>5429858

>>5429339
What does it say in normal language? I don't speak moonbabble.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:30
No.5429506

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:30 No.5429506

>>5429467

That moonbabble is my native tongue you swine.

Translation:

This is a picture, like I wished it to be forever.
Then I would have a chance to go to Hollywood.

Anne Frank, 10 oct 1942

NationalistischKindje
09/12/12(Wed)09:30
No.5429509

NationalistischKindje 09/12/12(Wed)09:30 No.5429509

>>5429467
This is a picture, as I would wish to be.
Then I would have had a chance to go to Hollywood.
Anne Frank.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:33
No.5429565

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:33 No.5429565

>>5429450
Yeah, it is kinda reminding me of the last elections where Cohen got a similar boost but not this obviously done. Lets hope we don't get stuck with an terrible purple cabinet this time.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:49
No.5429759

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:49 No.5429759

I miss Fortuyn ;_;

Wilders is out of the game. I'm thinking he's installed by some kind of lobby to make the right look bad and the left look better. He's basically a clown now.

I'm hoping for a VVD + D66 with some christian groups (so long as they keep bullshit morality out of the policies)

SP and/or PvdA should not come into power.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:53
No.5429816

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:53 No.5429816

Replies: >>5429912

>>5429239
We do actually know they get funding from the American Israel lobby though.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:56
No.5429858

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:56 No.5429858

Replies: >>5429886

>>5429467
There's actually an English translation in the picture itself.

Picture is of Anne Frank. Even you must have heard of her story.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:57
No.5429875

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:57 No.5429875

>is it happening guyse?

It's never gonna fucking happen....

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:58
No.5429886

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:58 No.5429886

Replies: >>5429940

>>5429858
No. Who is she? I'm American. I don't know anything about Poorfag history.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)09:59
No.5429904

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)09:59 No.5429904

Replies: >>5429913

>Om 21.00 uur, meteen na het sluiten van de stembussen, verschijnt de eerste voorlopige prognose.

You guys can vote until 21:00?!?
Wow!

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:00
No.5429912

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:00 No.5429912

>>5429816
It was hilarious to see them throw a hissyfit when they heard about how Wilders opposed Kosher and Halal animal slaughter.

Wilders should have stayed in the VVD, while I admire some of his standpoints, he's too much of a populist to make it happen.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:00
No.5429913

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:00 No.5429913

Replies: >>5429964

>>5429904
You can't?

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:02
No.5429940

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:02 No.5429940

Replies: >>5429974 >>5429995

>>5429886
>Who is she? I'm American.
Wow. This is ignorant.
She was a Jewish girl that was hidden when the Nazis invaded the Netherlands. But in the end she and her family got caught and they died in a concentration camp. Her diary survived and her story is compulsory material in about every school in Europe.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:04
No.5429964

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:04 No.5429964

Replies: >>5429988

>>5429913
8:00 - 18:00, always on sundays.
That's fine with me, I'm always voting as soon as they open anyway.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:04
No.5429974

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:04 No.5429974

Replies: >>5429993

>>5429940
>Her diary survived and her story is compulsory material in about every school in Europe.
It's really not though.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:05
No.5429988

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:05 No.5429988

Replies: >>5430007

>>5429964
That must be crazy inconvenient for work

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:05
No.5429993

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:05 No.5429993

Replies: >>5430010 >>5430059 >>5430069

>>5429974
OK, can you name an exception?
I'm not doubting you, I'm just curious.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:05
No.5429995

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:05 No.5429995

>>5429940
>Her diary survived and her story is compulsory material in about every school in Europe.

Seriously? You read some bullshit diarrhea of Anne Spank? No wonder your country is a shithole.

Enjoy sucking all that jew cock

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:06
No.5430007

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:06 No.5430007

Replies: >>5430420

>>5429988
for those who can read:
>8:00 - 18:00, always on sundays.
>always on sundays
>sundays

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:06
No.5430010

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:06 No.5430010

Replies: >>5430093

>>5429993
It's not compulsory in the UK. It's not compulsory in Ireland. It's not compulsory in Spain, Italy, Portugal, Denmark, Norway, Sweden, Finland, Poland, Czech Republic, etc, etc, etc.

I don't even know if it's compulsory in Holland.

(This is the bit where you start arguing about what "compulsory" means."

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:09
No.5430059

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:09 No.5430059

>>5429993
The Netherlands.

Hey wait a minute, you claimed that it was compulsory, how about you prove that first?

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:10
No.5430069

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:10 No.5430069

>>5429993
It's not even compulsory here either or something must have changed in the schooling system since I went through it aside from the fact that kids these days only have to read one or two random books instead of a dozen.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:11
No.5430093

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:11 No.5430093

>>5430010
>This is the bit where you start arguing about what "compulsory" means."
OK, here I go:
The School makes sure that every student knows the story. Not read the whole thing, but you must have heard the name and know what happened to her.

They have these plans here what every pupil has to know, like reading, writing, addition, and having heard of Anne Frank is part of it.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:13
No.5430123

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:13 No.5430123

Replies: >>5430241

>>5429266

> On economical issues they're probably left wing.

I've heard this before, but what's the evidence, beyond wanting to preserve old people's pensions?

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:16
No.5430156

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:16 No.5430156

Replies: >>5430519 >>5432543 >>5432708 >>5433088

>>5428866
Also dutch here. Let me fix that for you.

VVD, neo-liberals. Against personal and economic freedom. Unless you're rich, then they will allow everything. Wants the EU to become federal Europe, much like the USA is a federation of states. Uses tax money to fund villas and other expensive houses. Current party leader just flat out lies if the truth isn't convenient.

PvdA, former left-wing party, now mostly center. Loves immigrants, loves taxing everything, loves the EU. Has a vocal leader that did well in debates.

SP, classic socialists. Not much to say about that. Never got a chance to rule, probably going to just be ignored after the election because they're anti-EU

PVV, like the VVD, except extremist nationalist, so anti-EU and anti-immigrants. Going to be completely ignored because of the anti-EU stance and perceived instability.

D66, "We love Europe, fuck the people"-party. Claims to be centre, but is actually right wing. Goes after uniting europe under the EU with almost religious zeal.

CDA, whores for power, will roll over and bark like a dog if you offer then enough cash. Claims to be moral protectors, but the only morals they protect are their own.

GL, "Green" "Left" party that could better be renamed GrayRight. A part of 'pacifists' that approves of war and interventions.

CU, confused, less slutty sisterparty of the CDA.
They're actually pretty center.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:19
No.5430209

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:19 No.5430209

Replies: >>5430241

Only 37% of the population is reported as voting.

Low as fuck.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:20
No.5430222

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:20 No.5430222

There isn't a single party here in the Netherlands left worth voting for, they're all bad and it doesn't matter who wins because the cabinet will fall again in the next 2 years

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:22
No.5430241

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:22 No.5430241

>>5430123
It's not so much that he is left wing but that some of his economic policies corrospond to those of left wing parties. Namely keeping the pension age at 65, cheap healthcare and the like. It's mostly pandering to his voters.

>>5430209
Same as in 2010, which still ended up at 75% total. The workerdrones haven't had time to vote yet.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:30
No.5430377

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:30 No.5430377

Replies: >>5432477

File: 1347460226734.jpg-(292 KB, 800x450, 417866.jpg)

>Bij banketbakker Dekker & Winkler in Hilversum kunnen klanten taartjes naar hun politieke voorkeur krijgen
I think putting pictures of politicians on muffins is a sure way to ruin your appetite ...

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:33
No.5430420

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:33 No.5430420

Replies: >>5430537

>>5430007
>not working on sundays

Lack of Ordnung is disgusting

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:38
No.5430519

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:38 No.5430519

Replies: >>5430589 >>5430633

>>5430156
well that's definitely a more realistic picture of our governmental system.
So far most dutchfags in this thread have been VVD and (unless they're trolls) PVV supporters, what about you?

PvdA here. What I care most about right now is not letting VVD into our government again otherwise I might have voted something else progressive/left-wing.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:39
No.5430537

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:39 No.5430537

>>5430420
Not working on sundays is ordnung and not the lack of it.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:43
No.5430589

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:43 No.5430589

File: 1347461024225.jpg-(49 KB, 400x600, 1333201383604.jpg)

>>5430519

Ga de neuk van mijn /pol/ af.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:47
No.5430633

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:47 No.5430633

Replies: >>5430763

>>5430519

I'm mostly an SP supporter. They're anti-EU, and anti-privatisation. Both things that the country needs and the VVD hates, so a vote on them will be pretty much a vote against the VVD. The VVD would never cooperate with the SP.
I'm pretty much just voting for them because they haven't tried before, and they can't do worse than the CDA/VVD combinations we've had the last few years.

I honestly expect the PvdA to just bargain away most of their points so they can join a coalition with the VVD. Maybe they're stronger than that, but I don't trust them to be.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)10:56
No.5430763

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)10:56 No.5430763

Replies: >>5430853

>>5430633
"bargain away most of their points"?
The real problem is that a PvdA/VVD coalition is unavoidable. I guess by bargaining you mean allowing a coalition with CDA, which would make the government lean heavily toward the right. I'd personally rather see GL and D66 joining them than CDA but the point remains that there won't be a complete, strong left-wing government, especially now that GL (they may not be what they used to be but they're still left-wing) has obliterated its own chances.

On the topic of SP and the Eurozone, do you really see an answer in that? Neither VVD (when they were pretending to be anti-Euro) nor PVV nor SP managed to say how they would exactly oppose the Euro.
Also, don't anti-privatisation and pro-EU go hand-in-hand?

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:01
No.5430822

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:01 No.5430822

Replies: >>5430911

>Nederland wordt toch al vaak de zeventiende deelstaat van de Bondsrepubliek genoemd.
What?!? Who said that?
I didn't notice, and I live right next door, country-wise.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:03
No.5430853

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:03 No.5430853

Replies: >>5430883

>>5430763

What I meant by the bargain thing is that I fully expect them to just bend like a cheap straw as soon as negotiations get tough.

I know there won't be a left government, but there should not be yet another right wing government either.

SP and the eurozone is mostly that they're trying to reduce the political treaties and bullshit, while keeping the trade treaties.
And that's all we need. We don't need to give the Germans control over our budget, or to help the Greeks. We just need to trade with them like we always had in the past.
It's hard to find their stance on the EU, but it's pretty much just "We've given them enough for now, be very sceptical"

Anti-privatisation is a leftish kind of thing these days. And pro-EU is mostly right wing.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:06
No.5430883

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:06 No.5430883

Replies: >>5430958

>>5430853
We need to have some kind of fiscal union within the Eurozone, or else this type of crisis will just continue to happen.
The only alternative would be to leave the Euro, which would be disastrous for the (already fragile) economy.
Anti-EU is nice and all, but i's not a realistic option.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:07
No.5430895

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:07 No.5430895

Replies: >>5430920 >>5430982 >>5430997

Could een nederfag please tell us foreign devils what made these elections necessary? Didn't you already vote around the time when the Football World Cup was in South Africa, which would make it 2010?

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:07
No.5430911

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:07 No.5430911

Replies: >>5430967

>>5430822
I don't think anyone has the balls to say that in public, but we are not much more than an extension of their economy. A very prosperous one, but dependent on us being dozen schuivers for the Germans.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:08
No.5430920

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:08 No.5430920

Replies: >>5431001

>>5430895
Wilders left the coalition after weeks of budget talks.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:10
No.5430958

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:10 No.5430958

Replies: >>5431007

>>5430883
We don't need a fiscal union, that doesn't really matter and it's the cause of the crisis.
If Greece still had it's own money, they would have just started printing like they always did. A Greek bankrupcy wouldn't effect much more of Europe with maybe the exception of tourism rates.

But now, they have Euros, and they can't just make more of them. And now that they've fucked up the entire currency gets fucked, which effects everyone using it.

Anti-EU is only unrealistic because people want it to be unrealistic. Just the northern European countries would have done just fine with a single currency. But add Greece, Italy and Spain and it's a recipe for disaster.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:10
No.5430967

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:10 No.5430967

Replies: >>5431410

>>5430911
I read it here:
http://nos.nl/artikel/417842-italiaanse-toestanden-achter-hollandse-dijken.html
It's at the very end.

Wow. I wouldn't have thought there are people in your country who think that way. That's depressing.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:11
No.5430982

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:11 No.5430982

>>5430895

Government broke up because they couldn't agree on things.
So the rules say they had to hold new elections.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:12
No.5430997

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:12 No.5430997

>>5430895
The PVV/Wilders didn't want to agree to a CDA/VVD plan for austerity. So he stopped supporting the minority government and which made it ungovernable.

Or, if you are a pessimist, Wilders saw that he could get more seats by dropping out of the talks saying they were disgusting and against everything he stands for, so he wouldn't have to justify his support and possibly lose seats at the next official elections.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:12
No.5431001

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:12 No.5431001

Replies: >>5431029

>>5430920
>Wilders left the coalition after weeks of budget talks.
OK, and what wouldn't he agree on? What was so to say 'der Zankapfel'? (Don't know how that translates. It's from Greek mythology, the Golden Apple of Eris.)

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:13
No.5431007

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:13 No.5431007

Replies: >>5431066 >>5431097

>>5430958
>We don't need a fiscal union, that doesn't really matter and it's the cause of the crisis.
The cause of the crisis is fiscal irresponsibility by certain countries in the Eurozone. If the Eurozone had some type of oversight in the drafting of budgets of its members, the currency would be a lot more stable.
>Just the northern European countries would have done just fine with a single currency. But add Greece, Italy and Spain and it's a recipe for disaster.
Sure, but it's too late to go back now. That's the problem with anti-EU sentiment.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:14
No.5431029

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:14 No.5431029

Replies: >>5431083

>>5431001
It depends on whether or not you believe Wilders or every other participant in the talks.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:15
No.5431042

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:15 No.5431042

Replies: >>5431072

If I want the most freedom, should I vote for PVV. Their name implies I should.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:16
No.5431066

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:16 No.5431066

Replies: >>5431110

>>5431007
>Sure, but it's too late to go back now. That's the problem with anti-EU sentiment.
It's never too late, in fact this thing seems to be boiling up.

I don't want a fiscal union, that would be bad. But we clearly have to discuss a mechanism for countries leaving the Eurozone (read that "being kicked out of the Eurozone"). They need more monetary flexibility to fix their problems, and we won't get that when they stay in the Eurozone and leech off northern money.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:16
No.5431072

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:16 No.5431072

Replies: >>5431122

>>5431042
If you're an idealist, vote for the Piraten Partij, although I don't think they'll earn a seat.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:17
No.5431083

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:17 No.5431083

Replies: >>5431156

>>5431029
Sounds a bit chaotic to me.

Oh dear. I just hope you'll get a stable government now.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:18
No.5431097

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:18 No.5431097

Replies: >>5431163

>>5431007

>The cause of the crisis is fiscal irresponsibility by certain countries in the Eurozone.
That's pretty much what I said, but Greece didn't fail because of their budget or anything. They failed because the population has a systematic tax avoiding issue.
If nobody pays tax, what money does the government have to spend?(Also, they had ridiculous tax advantages for the companies in Athens' harbour. Again, this gives the government nothing)
Oversight in the budget wouldn't mean anything, except that someone outside of the country would have to decide what to do with the money they DO get.
Can't the people of a country have a say in what THEIR tax money is used for?

>Sure, but it's too late to go back now.
This is a logical fallacy. If we go back now, there's a cost. But if we continue, there is also a cost.
The cost for continuing with the political and fiscal union could be many times more than the cost of leaving it right now. And what is the price of a country being able to control their own budget?
What is the price of freedom?

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:19
No.5431110

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:19 No.5431110

Replies: >>5431168

>>5431066
If we kick out Greece, Spain tanks. Italy tanks.
All the while confidence in the Euro plummets and the currency becomes near worthless.
For a consumer/import economy, that's bad.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:19
No.5431122

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:19 No.5431122

>>5431072
I did some questionnaire to see what I should vote, and although the Piraten Partij got quite high, they had some things I disagreed with heavily, and I doubt they will get anywhere like you said.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:22
No.5431156

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:22 No.5431156

Replies: >>5431196

>>5431083
Not counting on it, our political system is filled with opportunists left and right who'll drop the government as soon as it appears advantageous to them. Nobody is interested in actually running the damned country.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:23
No.5431163

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:23 No.5431163

Replies: >>5431362

>>5431097
>Can't the people of a country have a say in what THEIR tax money is used for?
What? This doesn't make any sense. Of course they can, but a democratically elected government can still sign a legally binding treaty relinquishing part of their budgetary authority. There are a bunch of things EU members have (democratically!) agreed upon handling jointly instead of individually, this would just be another one of those.
>The cost for continuing with the political and fiscal union could be many times more than the cost of leaving it right now.
But it isn't, according to economists and the Court of Audit, amongst others.
>What is the price of freedom?
Let's not go into dramatics.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:23
No.5431168

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:23 No.5431168

Replies: >>5431239

>>5431110
Who says Italy and Spain can stay in the Eurozone?

If the Eurozone gets rid of failing members, that would on the contrary boost faith in the Euro, the exchange rate would go up steeply.

It would shift a lot of production work to the southern states as a result of this, though, since there everything would be cheaper in the first time.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:25
No.5431196

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:25 No.5431196

Replies: >>5431410

>>5431156
->
http://nos.nl/artikel/417842-italiaanse-toestanden-achter-hollandse-dijken.html
>Column: Italiaanse toestanden
> ....
>Wordt het daarom misschien tijd om vernieuwingen door te voeren in het Nederlandse kiesstelsel

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:25
No.5431200

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:25 No.5431200

>>5428866
Saved. Thanks dude!

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:28
No.5431239

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:28 No.5431239

Replies: >>5431267

>>5431168
>Who says Italy and Spain can stay in the Eurozone?
Nobody, that's the problem.
>If the Eurozone gets rid of failing members, that would on the contrary boost faith in the Euro, the exchange rate would go up steeply.
No, because it would just raise fears of it being abolished completely.
>It would shift a lot of production work to the southern states as a result of this, though, since there everything would be cheaper in the first time.
Of course it wouldn't! Their economies would still be crap, worse, actually. Without EMF money, they'll most likely go bankrupt. If they have to print their own money again, without any economy to give their currency value, they'll experience Weimar-style hyperinflation as they struggle to pay off loans/pay for daily shit.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:28
No.5431240

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:28 No.5431240

>Er zijn tot 16.00 uur niet meer dan wat kleine incidenten gemeld.
There are incidents in civilized Nederland?!?
Alsjemenou ...?!?

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:30
No.5431267

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:30 No.5431267

>>5431239
>Of course it wouldn't!
Ah, we won't find out anyway. The way things go, the Euro will die a very slow, cancery death.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:35
No.5431362

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:35 No.5431362

Replies: >>5431628

>>5431163
>What? This doesn't make any sense. Of course they can, but a democratically elected government can still sign a legally binding treaty relinquishing part of their budgetary authority.
Can't say anything about that. The German court is going to make a ruling on that.
I personally disagree with the ability for a government to give away ANY of its power though. It only takes one poor election and it's gone forever.

>But it isn't, according to economists and the Court of Audit, amongst others.
How does one measure the costs of being able to control your own inflation and currency? There's a cost aside from money. That's a cost that can't be predicted. Situations change.

>Let's not go into dramatics.

No, let's. The EU is taking more power from the countries, and the people in those countries.
When are the countries, and the people in those countries getting power in the EU?
When will we vote for our EU representatives?
When will we be able to check out the EU's full budget, like we can with normal governments? (And related, when will they ban bribes, sorry, I mean 'lobbying' to EU personnel?)
The EU is taking power, but they're not giving anything in return.
It can only get worse if they don't start doing concessions.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:38
No.5431410

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:38 No.5431410

Replies: >>5431474

>>5430967
>>5431196
I read the article and while I agree that political system isn't great these days, I don't this can be fixed with a German electoral system.

I'd say it is mostly failing because (rightly or wrongly) the stabilizing factor of a large CDA has been removed (mostly due to their own idiocy). This effect is worsened because politics has become a lot more media savvy these days with the internet and the like, which is not something you can change anymore.

There's little that actually can be done and instead of becoming more like Italy I foresee us becoming more and more Americanized with a two party system with divisions that actually matter little.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:42
No.5431474

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:42 No.5431474

Replies: >>5431709

>>5431410
>I don't this can be fixed with a German electoral system
I don't think it should be. It should be studied, though, to see if adopting some elements would help the Dutch system.

>more Americanized
I don't see how and I'm not sure that would be a good thing.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:51
No.5431628

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:51 No.5431628

Replies: >>5431679

>>5431362
>When are the countries, and the people in those countries getting power in the EU?
You can't be serious.
>When will we vote for our EU representatives?
Okay, you are serious.
Do you know how the European Parliament is formed? You should look it up.
You are already represented by your democratically elected officials in the EU.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:53
No.5431679

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:53 No.5431679

Replies: >>5431760 >>5431784 >>5431916

>>5431628
I may be represented, but as the political situation shows, politicians don't give 2 shits about that.

The people hold no power over the EU, and you can easily check this by looking at the EU.

If the people had any power over it, there would not be a EU.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:55
No.5431709

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:55 No.5431709

>>5431474
The splits that occur aren't all that damaging, in fact I'd say they are a positive force in our democracy and ensures we can at least get some new voices and ideas into the system. Without Fortuyn/Wilders we'd still be stuck with a lot of immigrant/foreign policy political correct bullshit that Bolkestein didn't manage to bust through for example.

We are starting to become a country that not so much into polderen/compromising as it is into polarizing. We're starting to define our system ever more into left and right, us and the enemy. This is becoming especially obvious because there is no correcting force they team up with like the CDA to form a government. Now it's becoming more and more all or nothing.

For the record, I don't think Americanization of our system is a good thing either, but it's where we are heading.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:58
No.5431760

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:58 No.5431760

Replies: >>5431901

>>5431679
>If the people had any power over it, there would not be a EU.
I think that people welcome the fact that you can easily cross borders now and maybe even that you don't have to change your money anymore. (Banks always took a fee for that.)

I also think it's great that German and Dutch policemen patrol cities together (example: Münster), so that law enforcement doesn't stop at the border.

What I don't like though and I hope most people agree are stupid bureaucrats in Brussels, banning light bulbs and telling roofers to wear shirts with full-length sleeves and shit.

We should get rid of the bureaucracy and stick with the good parts.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)11:59
No.5431784

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)11:59 No.5431784

Replies: >>5431901 >>5431916

>>5431679
You seem to think the majority of people are anti-EU.
That may be, but the majority of people does not vote for anti-EU parties, and that is how things get decided.
"The people" don't have direct power in any representative democracy.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:05
No.5431901

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:05 No.5431901

>>5431760

Well, yeah, that's pretty much what I'm aiming for.
Cooperation between countries? Great!

Dumbshit bureaucrats deciding on things that people don't want?
Get those idiots out of office and replace them with sane people, or better yet, make it so the EU can not pull this crap. Leave that to the countries, at least we can stop it if a single country does it.

>>5431784

Depends on where you ask. Italy and Spain? I'm sure they approve of the northern countries giving them cash.
Germany? They don't like it.

>"The people" don't have direct power in any representative democracy.
And that is the problem. The politicians that are elected don't care about the people. They care about themselves and their friends/business partners.
The people need some form of power over these politicians, even if it's just a binding referendum on small things.
If the people can not participate in government, they will hate the government.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:05
No.5431916

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:05 No.5431916

>>5431679
>>5431784
The EU is a non-democratic organization by design, it is focused on integration through lawmaking and combined policy. The directly elected Parliament is marginalized and what power it holds is destroyed through lack of interest and voter obedience to vote the same political parties they do in national elections.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:06
No.5431923

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:06 No.5431923

>Strijd tussen waddeneilanden
>De gemeente Schiermonnikoog zet vanavond alles op alles om als eerste de stemmen geteld te hebben.
>De burgemeester van het waddeneiland Sjon Stellinga wil niet opnieuw verliezen van Vlieland.

LOL.

Ihr habt Sorgen ....

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:08
No.5431954

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:08 No.5431954

Replies: >>5431999

The two winning parties are now VVD (liberal in European political terms, libertarian for the Americans among us)
and PVDA (Social-Democrats) are in a neck-and-neck race.

The third party is the SP (Socialist anti-Europe party)

The fourth is the PVV (the nationalist anti-Europe party of Geert Wilders)

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:09
No.5431983

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:09 No.5431983

Replies: >>5432037 >>5432068 >>5432095

Friendly reminder that although people may believe pvda is an immigrant loving party the number of immigrants has never been as high as the last two years under a coalition of VVD/CDA/PVV.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:10
No.5431999

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:10 No.5431999

>>5431954
>17:54 uur Opkomst is 48 procent
3 more hours to go ...

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:12
No.5432037

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:12 No.5432037

Replies: >>5432056 >>5432363

>>5431983
Non-EU immigrants are down, EU immigrants can't be stopped.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:12
No.5432056

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:12 No.5432056

Replies: >>5432144

>>5432037
Give me some numbers.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:13
No.5432068

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:13 No.5432068

>>5431983
The whole "labor parties bring in immigrants!" is a fable the right loves to spread throughout Europe, to mask the fact that the right brought in immigrants as cheap labor and the labor parties had to put a stop to it.
Yes people, immigration restrictions happened when Job Cohen was minister.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:14
No.5432095

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:14 No.5432095

>>5431983
And nobody has imposed strict immigration laws like PvdA's Job Cohen.

PvdA is friendly to immigrants, but not to immigration.

PVV doesn't like immigration either, but they are completely incompetent.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:17
No.5432144

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:17 No.5432144

>>5432056
Go look at the CBS yourself, you lazy prick.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:27
No.5432363

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:27 No.5432363

>>5432037
Total immigrants:
2009 146 378
2010 154 432
2011 162 962

Of which EU:
2009 52 026
2010 58 353
2011 66 298

source: http://statline.cbs.nl/StatWeb/publication/?DM=SLNL&PA=03742&D1=0&D2=0&D3=0&D4=0
,8&D5=0&D6=a&HDR=T&STB=G1,G2,G3,G4,G5&VW=T

Meaning non-EU:
2009 94352
2010 96079
2011 96664
-> a clear INCREASE during the far-right coalition

Next time don't talk bullshit when hard fact are available to call out your blatant lies.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:32
No.5432477

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:32 No.5432477

File: 1347467566134.jpg-(41 KB, 373x500, 87078237_5_c-IL.jpg)

>>5430377
I would lick her sweets, if you know what I mean.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:36
No.5432543

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:36 No.5432543

Replies: >>5432708 >>5433130

>>5428866
>>5430156
WHICH ANON DO I BELIEVE
HALP

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:46
No.5432708

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:46 No.5432708

Replies: >>5432799 >>5432852

>>5432543

This one:
>>5430156
Pretty much spot-on.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:47
No.5432733

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:47 No.5432733

>2012
>not voting Christen Unie

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:51
No.5432799

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:51 No.5432799

>>5432708
tx breh

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:54
No.5432852

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:54 No.5432852

Replies: >>5432956 >>5433034 >>5433071 >>5433079

>>5432708
god damn as an american, holy shit here I thought we were fucked with our 2 party system but what the fuck are you supposed to do when all 7 parties suck balls

is there an anti-EU party, that loves MUH-freedoms and proFreemarkets?

paultard here btw

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:57
No.5432927

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:57 No.5432927

Replies: >>5432971

>PvdA
>voting for a nuclear 'scientist' that doesn't want nuclear power, has been a greenpeacer and has been called out on his bullshit by his old professor on buitenhof

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:58
No.5432956

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:58 No.5432956

Replies: >>5433039

>>5432852
There's a "Sovereign Netherlands" party or something.

They SEEM to be what you're describing.

Too bad a part of their demands for the government are that the government has to declassify their meetings with aliens.

Nobody is taking them seriously.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)12:58
No.5432971

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)12:58 No.5432971

>>5432927
>VVD
>Voting for a historian who is also pretty retarded
>PVV
>Voting for a zionist

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:01
No.5433034

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:01 No.5433034

Replies: >>5433075 >>5433088 >>5433131

>>5432852

The PVV comes close, but they want to ban weed.
They are pro free market and also most personal freedom. For example they want to create something like the American first amendment right in our constitution that guarantees unlimited freedom of speech.
(Wilders was taken to court over alleged hate speech (which is illegal here I think) and aquitted last year)

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:02
No.5433039

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:02 No.5433039

Replies: >>5433078

>>5432956
>declassify their meetings with aliens

sorry retard here what does that mean?

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:03
No.5433071

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:03 No.5433071

Replies: >>5433116

>>5432852
The lack of anti-EU parties is the only real issue.

The majority of Dutch people aren't happy with the EU, but every single party except for the far-left socialists and extreme-right neo-Nazi's love sucking EU dick.

Which makes sense, because all those politicians (except for the socialists, who have to give their earnings to the party) can make a fortune if they end their careers in Brussels.

Most you can make as a politicans in the Netherlands is just under €200k. - and that's only for prime-minister.

But a simple members of EU parliament makes over half a million per year (including all benefits).

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:03
No.5433075

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:03 No.5433075

>>5433034
I'd like to add that the PVV would be classified as communist in America.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:03
No.5433078

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:03 No.5433078

>>5433039

Means they think the government is hiding aliens and/or alien technology.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:03
No.5433079

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:03 No.5433079

>>5432852
And by the way we have 21 parties of which about 13 will get a seat in the parliament, I just listed the 8 biggest ones. I'm almost sure the Sovereign Party will not get a seat.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:04
No.5433088

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:04 No.5433088

Replies: >>5433219

>>5433034
welp now you faggots are just confusing me
that is not what this anon says about the PVV
>>5430156

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:05
No.5433116

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:05 No.5433116

Replies: >>5433171

File: 1347469539372.jpg-(60 KB, 419x330, Arthur_Seyss_Inquart.jpg)

>>5433071
>
>Which makes sense, because all those politicians (except for the socialists, who have to give their earnings to the party) can make a fortune if they end their careers in Brussels.
>
>Most you can make as a politicans in the Netherlands is just under €200k. - and that's only for prime-minister.
>
>But a simple members of EU parliament makes over half a million per year (including all benefits).


You are a fucking retard. Lrn2Dutch

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:06
No.5433130

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:06 No.5433130

>>5432543
The first one, the problem with the second one is that he describes the PVV as VVD with nationalism, but the PVV is more like the PVDA with nationalism.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:06
No.5433131

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:06 No.5433131

>>5433034
>they want to create something like the American first amendment right in our constitution that guarantees unlimited freedom of speech.

And at the same time they also want to ban the Koran.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:08
No.5433171

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:08 No.5433171

>>5433116
Bedankt voor je constructieve opmerking.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:11
No.5433219

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:11 No.5433219

Replies: >>5433322

>>5433088
PVV is kinda hard to describe becasue they have conflicting opinions, and many things they claim to stand for everybody knows is just election rhetoric.

Specifically they pretend to be very left-wing economically, but that's hard to believe when Geert Wilders was a MP of the right-wing VVD for longer than any current VVD MP.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:12
No.5433231

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:12 No.5433231

Replies: >>5433366 >>5433476

>Geert Wilders
>Indonesian mother
>Catholic baptism
>Hungarian wife
>worked in Israel
What the hell is up with that fucker? How's he against foreigner when he's pretty foreign himself?!?
Hypocriet!

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:17
No.5433322

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:17 No.5433322

Replies: >>5433406 >>5433523

>>5433219
That's because the PVV will adopt any stance that will get them more voters. For example in the last elections he said, retirement age would stay at 65 if it were up to him whatever were to happen. About 12 seconds after the voting was finished he said they were going to be "flexible" on that point. He really only has a few issues that he cares about. The rest of his program is all about winning votes cheaply.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:19
No.5433366

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:19 No.5433366

>>5433231
He also dares question the loyalty of people with dual citizenship.
But has no issue relying heavily on America and Israel for his campaign funds.

Netherlands has suddenly become the most pro-Israel country in the world.
Even America is a critic compared to us.
But of course this has nothing to do with the money Israel payed to get Wilders elected.....

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:22
No.5433406

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:22 No.5433406

Replies: >>5433523

>>5433322
Exactly.

But unfortunately the kind of people who might vote for him are also the kind of people too stupid to see through these obvious tactics.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:26
No.5433476

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:26 No.5433476

Replies: >>5433551

>>5433231
We should have never abandoned the colonies, even more shamefully we are now seeking to collectively shame loyal servicemen that served there at the time under a collective banner of warcriminals and monsters, much like was done with Dutchbat.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:29
No.5433523

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:29 No.5433523

Replies: >>5433606

>>5433322
>>5433406
Everyone flipflops on retirement age, even the unions who were supposedly adamantly against it suddenly changed their minds when union leaders were offered boatloads of cash. Only the SP has no direct flipflopping on the issue because they've never been in a position of power to force it.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:30
No.5433551

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:30 No.5433551

Replies: >>5433603

>>5433476
If you'd have kept the colonies than much, much more muslims would have migrated to Nederland. See what happened to Britain with its former empire, and how London is now in parts more Pakistani than English.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:34
No.5433603

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:34 No.5433603

Replies: >>5433658

>>5433551
No, that was because they abandoned their colonies as well, everyone who had an ounce of sense tried to into Britain when India gained independence.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:34
No.5433606

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:34 No.5433606

Replies: >>5433828

>>5433523
>the SP has no direct flipflopping on the issue

You haven't read their budget plan, have you?

They switched as well, they just did it quietly.
And I celebrate this "flipflop" actually - it's a lost battle so they are right in just letting it slide.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:36
No.5433658

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:36 No.5433658

Replies: >>5433751 >>5433828

>>5433603
What colonies were there? I know of Indonesia, and I know Aruba, Bonaire, Curacao and Suriname are somehow still affiliated with the Netherlands. (I'm not sure how.)

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:41
No.5433751

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:41 No.5433751

Replies: >>5433809

>>5433658
That's it, rest was lost to the English.

Netherlands was never good at colonies, they were more into trading posts.
Didn't have the population anyways.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:45
No.5433809

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:45 No.5433809

>>5433751
Right now this second on Phoenix (http://www.phoenix.de/content/phoenix/tv_programm/das_weltreich_der_deutschen_(2_3)/302346):
A documentary about the Kaiser time colonies of the Germans.

Am watching, so far I don't feel I miss anything not having those colonies anymore ...

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:46
No.5433828

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:46 No.5433828

>>5433606
It's a cash grab and you know it. AOW was never supposed to be related to how long you worked, it was always meant to be social subsidy related to how long you lived in the Netherlands. Changing the pension age isn't necessary either, if you change it to use saner interest rates to calculate over a longer period of time instead of the incredibly short periods its being done now it would be equally fine.

>>5433658
Those were them, yes. The Dutch Antilles keep coming back to us for extra money in some way or form because their governments suffer from severe corruption.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:50
No.5433891

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:50 No.5433891

File: 1347472213935.jpg-(78 KB, 600x864, ns_9047.jpg)

>former colonies

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:52
No.5433944

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:52 No.5433944

Replies: >>5434041 >>5434101

>PowNews weggestuurd bij PVV
censorship?

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)13:57
No.5434041

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)13:57 No.5434041

Replies: >>5434107

>>5433944

PowNews is just confrontational (understatement), most parties and politicians don't know how to deal with them.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)14:01
No.5434101

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)14:01 No.5434101

Replies: >>5434139

>>5433944
Did they allow other media?

Normally they keep their doors closed anyways.
They probably wouldn't even take part in debates is their ratings weren't so low.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)14:01
No.5434107

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)14:01 No.5434107

>>5434041
OK.

>19:57 uur Nieuwe opkomstcijfers 65 procent

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)14:03
No.5434139

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)14:03 No.5434139

Replies: >>5434274

>>5434101
????
>19:41 uur PowNews weggestuurd bij PVV
>Waarom dat is gebeurd, is nog niet bekend.
sauce: NOS

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)14:12
No.5434274

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)14:12 No.5434274

>>5434139
>20:06 uur Update over PowNews bij PVV

>Verslaggever Michiel Breedveld meldt dat medewerkers van PowNews "lastige vragen over het persvak" hebben gesteld.
>Daarna zijn ze door beveiligers verwijderd.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)14:42
No.5434824

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)14:42 No.5434824

Replies: >>5434858 >>5434877 >>5434890 >>5434923 >>5435095

>>5429219
>growing power of the non-democratic EU.
>non-democratic

Anyone care to elaborate on this? Not denying/attacking it or anything, just curious as to why people think this.

anoniem
09/12/12(Wed)14:42
No.5434829

anoniem 09/12/12(Wed)14:42 No.5434829

>>5428866

CU is social conservative, you moron

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)14:45
No.5434858

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)14:45 No.5434858

Replies: >>5435064

>>5434824
There's a democratic election for the european parliament. But the european parliament holds relatively little power compared to some other parts of the european government, which are not directly chosen. Basically, it's not a democracy like ours, where the parliament of elected officials holds ultimate power.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)14:46
No.5434877

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)14:46 No.5434877

Replies: >>5435064

>>5434824

The elected part is the part that has no power to decide things.
The part that does have power is not democratic, and controlled by a mix of international and corporate interests.

And the whole thing seems to be build like a maze to discourage anyone from trying to figure out how it works.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)14:47
No.5434890

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)14:47 No.5434890

Replies: >>5434936 >>5435064

>>5434824
Most power in the EU still lies with the European Commission, which gets appointed without any democratic elections.

The EU parliament is elected democratically and has some power, but they have distanced themselves very far from the common people.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)14:50
No.5434923

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)14:50 No.5434923

Replies: >>5435064

>>5434824
Both the Irish and Dutch (and maybe also the French I'm not sure) referendum rejecting the Lisbon treaty, a treaty which transfered a lot of power from the Dutch parliament to the European parliament, were ignored by the European Commission.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)14:51
No.5434936

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)14:51 No.5434936

>>5434890
Somehow reminds me of a Central Comittee of the Politbureau of the EUSS and a people's congress that isn't really of the people.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)14:58
No.5435064

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)14:58 No.5435064

Replies: >>5435095

>>5434858
>>5434877
>>5434890
>>5434923
Thanks, guys. I guess I'll look into it a bit further.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)14:59
No.5435083

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)14:59 No.5435083

En waar heeft /pol/ op gestemd

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)14:59
No.5435095

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)14:59 No.5435095

>>5434824
>>5435064
We never voted for its creation, we never voted for its expansions, the referendums we had over the constitution were ignored in both France and the Netherlands, the law makers are not directly elected, the parliament that partly approves laws is fed constant bullshit while the important shit is done outside of the real EU structure, no referendums on any of plans to save the EU or anything else.

It does not matter who we elect, because they are always pressured through economic forces to comply, no matter what their policy was before the elections.

We're supposed to like it because we of a supposed wealth increase, free trade and free travel, but without democratic freedom those are just measures to placate the people to shut up about wanting a say. Honestly, even the bribe they offer sucks, because they pretty much replaced Guilder prices for Euro prices by just replacing the ƒ for the € instead of using the exchange rate.

Anonymous
09/12/12(Wed)15:01
No.5435120

Anonymous 09/12/12(Wed)15:01 No.5435120

21:00 uur
DE VOORLOPIGE PROGNOSE

Hier is de voorlopige prognose:

VVD 41 (+10)
PvdA 40 (+10)
PVV 13 (-11)
CDA 13 (-8)
SP 15 (0)
D66 12 (+2)
GL 4 (-6)
CU 4 (-1)
SGP 3 (+1)
PvdD 2 (0)
50PLUS 3