I'd do the woman in the white shirt

>>735091

(He's saying what we're all thinking)

70% of voters in Arizona support the measure.

>>735122

70% of Arizona are rednecks who fuck their sisters and cows.

>>735055
>>735091
>>735113
same beaner

>>735129
Go back to Mexico, Frito Bandito.

any of their banners say we are here legally?

>>735055

I'd rape the broad in the white shirt. She could certainly benefit from having a kid from a Jewish genius like myself. I mean, once the kid grows up he'll beat all his/her goyim counterparts in the race for scholarships and spots in good universities, get a good high paying job, and eventually support the stupid bitch once she reaches old age.

>>735153

Fuck you bitch. Do you even realize how racist this new policy is?

>>735186
>bawwww

Seriously, cry more faggot.

They should check the crowds immigration status.

>>735129
And they vote!!!

Sorry :-)

>>735186

How about exactly as racist as the non-racist federal law that has been in effect for decades.

>>735055
I like how the image tries to invoke emotion. The photographer had a good bias when he made this pic: Sex appeal, the child hold on to who may be his father, the focal point of the image is the lady's right breast, which looks like it "points" to the sign which is also meant to evoke emotion as though they are preaching against a true wrong. Very nifty, Mr. Photographer.

Will be watching to see if they get some teeth and organize some leftist militias to make the nazis think twice before trying shit.

Papers please.

>>735226
This is nothing like Nazi Germany. Jews are productive members of society.

>>735230

Yeah because immigrants, who happen to work jobs, are such a terrible strain on the economy right?

The amount of ignorance surrounding this issue astounds me.

>>735225

The Jews were exterminated because they were productive members of society outperforming their goyim counterparts in business and science; the Mexicans are being deported because they are unemployable failures who suck up welfare and cause crime.

See the difference there brah?

>>735258
The biggest immigration raid in history took place in my state, hundreds deported and the owners now in criminal proceedings. The site is under new ownership and wages are up! Not coincidental.

Mexico is a shithole. Why shouldnt they be allowed to escape? In reality, the number of jobs is almost limitless. People just need to get up off their lazy asses. Fuck, if you need to work, why not make your own job?

>>735281

Wow wages are up! They're paying more money out! That means racial profiling is good right? Jesus Christ you people are thick...

>>735301
This. The same conservitards that seem to consider "start your own business!" as a cure-all for unemployed people are also the ones that whine about immigrants taking their jobs. If you believe in personal responsibility and hard-work being all it takes, then at least be consistent.

>>735258
Illegal Immigrants, who don't pay taxes and export all the money they earn out of the country to Mexico are VERY MUCH a strain on the economy.

Wow that protest is ALMOST as violent as a tea party protest.

>>735333
>Derp I don't have any clue what it takes to start a business and how much collateral I'll need before hand, banks just give out huge sums of money for nothin! Especially now! Especially if you don't have credit!

>>735366
So how is it that people on welfare are lazy if it is so hard to make your own business, and there are so few jobs available?

>>735329
No, it's just proof that illegal immigration depresses wages.

>>735366

>Durrr hurr I have no reading comprehension at all and routinely make a fool of myself by not understanding what I'm replying to.

>>735333

Nobody is preventing Mexicans from leaving Mexico. What is so fucking hard about doing it the LEGAL way, though? If the problem is the US rules, then let's work to get those changed. If the problem is the Mexican rules, then let's work to get those changed. Just saying "they're here, deal with it" is a shitty fucking stance that has absolutely no rationality.

Some of the other arguments are absurd. "We're human too!" Yeah, no shit, Sherlock. Nobody's saying you're not human. But you're not a fucking citizen of this country either. Change THAT and nobody will care anymore. And if they do, they're just racists and can be outed for the racists that they are.

Deport. Them. All.

>>735380

Interesting point. Didn't you just agree with an anonymous that said there were tons of jobs available if people were willing to take them? If you're consistent as you proclaim others aren't, why don't you gripe about welfare fags not taking these jobs as well?

It seems to me we can end the welfare problem and the immigration problem by exporting the illegals and sticking the welfare folks into those jobs. Two with one stone.

YOU ARE THIEVES

>>735396
See picture. Considering the conditions in Mexico, I don't blame them for breaking the law to make a better life for themselves in America.
>>735422
My whole point was that the same crowd that exalts personal responsibility and finding work for yourself when it comes to people on welfare are the ones crying about immigrants stealing their jobs. I realise that finding work can be damn hard. I'm pointing out their inconsistency.

>>735467
i'm unemployed. no income. does that mean i can just rob someone else's house to get some dough?

breaking the law is breaking the law dipshit

>>735467
Most of these pathways make you a legal resident alien fairly quickly even before you become a full-fledged citizen, thereby negating the point.

Raged fucking hard when I watched the news and heard "The new bill makes it a CRIME to be an illegal immigrant"

IF IT WASN'T A FUCKING CRIME BEFORE TO BE AN _ILLEGAL_ FUCKING IMMIGRANT, THEN WHAT THE FUCK WAS IT.

>>735545
Unlawful wrong, a violation of civil code, not criminal.

>>735545
it was a crime, but just a federal crime. now it's a state crime.

>>735545

Unenforced. Now Arizona is going to enforce it.

>>735467 See picture. Considering the conditions in Mexico, I don't blame them for breaking the law to make a better life for themselves in America.

Key point "breaking the law". I'm not unsympathetic to their causes or plights. I become unsympathetic when you violate our nations laws and sovereignty to do it. This may seem "Robin Hood"ish to you (a crime worth committing) and maybe it is. To them, maybe it's worth the risk for a better life. But it is still a crime. No one in our country is allowed to violate the laws no matter how vindicated you think you are. If they want to live here, they have to understand that and they have to be responsible for their actions.

As you say, personal responsibility is a core value to conservatives.

So does anyone actually find the riot in the video justifiable?

>>735467

Right, that's the way it is. Many people wait in line for years to get citizenship. So you think it's worth it to cross the border illegally and take you chances. Fine. But don't expect any compassion if you get caught. YOU JUST SHIT ON EVERY PERSON WHO RESPECTS THE LEGAL PROCESS.

The illegal lobby is filled with assholes who will not hesitate to cry racism, or make up any story to discredit this law and accomplish their end. Cry for inhumanity. In the protest in AZ this weekend the man representing the mob declared that they will do whatever it takes, even if it gets them arrested. This declaration was met with cheers.

To this mob, the ends justify the means. They will make up whatever story is effective. They don't give a shit about anything but their personal gain, and they will take it as far as they can until they are physically stopped.

I'm Asian, and I say stop all unskilled immigration, the economic benefits are bullshit sugar coated with PC nonsense. We have plenty of unskilled/2year cert skilled labor.

Liberals will admit that Mexico sucks but they can't seem to figure out that it's because of the people who comprise Mexico

>>735579
pretty much this. mexico sucks and as an immigrant im all open to making immigration laws a little bit more loose, but when you cross a fucking border illegally, shit, i'm surprsied you don't get tried in a fucking military court.

>>735113
>We are legion
>(We are horny)

>>735579
Do you consider it more moral and responsible to keep their family in Mexico where they at risk of suffering violence and murder in the middle of a bloody gang war?

I live in Phoenix, AZ. I have not met a single person who likes this law. I don't understand :(

>>735615
the world isn't our responsibility.

>>735617

How's the ghetto working out for you?

>>735536
>quickly?
Looks like some one talks without any experience

>>735615 Do you consider it more moral and responsible to keep their family in Mexico where they at risk of suffering violence and murder in the middle of a bloody gang war?

You're exaggerating. However, the answer is "no". It is not "moral" to force people to live in a shitty situation. I told you I am not unsympathetic. But I have to obey the rules, so do you.

Like I said, if the problem is the rules, then fix the fucking rules. Don't just violate them because you don't agree with them.

>>735615
The entire idea behind countries, governments and borders is that responsibility is divided. The USA is not responsible for dealing with the problems of Mexico.

>>735626
Answer the question. Is it more moral and responsible to endanger your family than to break an immigration law?

>>735634
But I live in the Phoenix/Scottsdale area, the rich white Jew part of Arizona.

>>735654
I'd consider it a greater risk to my family to unlawfully bring them to another country.

sorry but it's a lot harder to have sympathy when you come from an legally immigrant family from a nation far worse off than mexico.

>>735467

All of our ancestors that turned this nation into what it is had to go through that process. There are reasons we don't just let everyone come on over.

The Arizona law will work. They're mad because they KNOW it will work.

>>735691
You mean, it's a lot harder to have sympathy once you're no longer in a vulnerable situation.

>>735617

I live in phoenix too. I don't know anyone who doesn't LOVE this law.

>>735716
we did it. they can too. also this guy is right >>735694 the immigration laws are what have america great.

Mexicans need to be exterminated, not deported.

>>735716

Actually what everyone with a rational mind means is that it's hard to have sympathy for a group of people who can't even gather together and petition the US government to get their side of the story to better reform immigration laws, instead of spilling over into a country illegally with no regard for it's culture or it's people.

>>735774
I like my culture, not Mexican culture. And I vote.

>>735774
>arguments about immigration
>issue is about illegal immigration
Wow you're dumb.

>>735788
>implying America has culture

>>735791
Insightful.

>>735788

>missed out on that whole "melting pot" culture thing

Man oh man...

>>735774
failchart is fail.

>>735805

>implying you aren't enthralled with the idea of America being a 3rd world country.

>>735824

The term melting pot was so 1980's dude.

I don't get the hate. Mexican immigrants are hard workers that love Morrissey and open awesome restaurants. They're like goth art fags, but cool.

>>735834
People who live in states that don't actually have Mexicans read about Atzlan shit, or whatever, and assume thats what they are all saying. Texan here, never had any issue with any of the hispanics here.

>>735834

That's because you're an ignorant gringo. We hate you and your faggot country, thanks for the support.

A CHALLENGER APPEARS

Honestly? This bill is racist. All it does is give police officers more of a reason to bug minorities and easily fill up quotas.

>>735834

>that love Morrissey

I don't know which Mexicans you're hanging out with, but most of the ones around here either don't know who Morrissey is, or would call him a fag and anyone who likes him a fag, before turning on their gangster rap/mariachi music.

>open awesome restaurants

Which they run according to their limited education and Third World sanitary practices.

>>735809

It's "insightful" because you failed to grasp the crux of the problem.

Few people are against immigration. What we're discussing here, and the whole point behind the Arizona law, is ILLEGAL immigration. The distinction is extremely important.

>>735645

Bull-fucking shit.

The laws take FAR too long, and let far too few people in. And what if you can't get a green card? It's not like you can afford to go to Europe.

>>735878
Because it's clearly racist to assume that the people sneaking in from Mexico are Mexican. Derp.

And this isn't exactly a "quota" situation. It's "your a citizen" or "you're deported". Cops don't get paid based on these arrests, but it is an overall positive for the community.

>>735834
No one is complaining about Mexican immigrants. They're complaining about Mexican illegal immigrants. For breaking the law and entering the country illegally, they should be punished.

Also, slippery slope time! For that matter, if we set the standard so that it's "okay" for the Mexican illegals to immigrate, why should any enter the country legally in the future?

There's nothing racist about sending illegal immigrants back to their home countries. That's called tough fucking luck.

>>735878

Whoops! I addressed this issue already:

>>735109

Besides, it's not as if Arizona doesn't have Mexican police officers. Are they all racists or just the whiteys?

>>735301
/b/ is a shithole, why not let them post all over every other board?

If the people protesting could actually VOTE then the law probably wouldn't have passed in the first place.

>>735905

Heh. Go to a Tea party rally.

>>735940
good thing they can;t!

Are there any organized platforms just for pro-immigration? People need to militarize themselves.

>>735894 Bull-fucking shit.

Then fix the rules. I already said that would be a viable solution. If the current rules don't work, fix them. If the current rules keep people from coming in and avoiding a harsh situation in their native land, fix them. If the current rules don't allow people to bring their families, fix them.

Do you think America hates the idea of being the Land of Opportunity? Do you think we hate helping people flee from oppression, disaster, hunger, and horrors? Do you think the Statue of Liberty's stands for nothing?

I'm all for people coming here for a better life. I just want them to do it legally! If that means changing the laws, then let's change the laws. Let's not just allow people to break the laws because you don't like them and are too fucking lazy to change them.

>>735908
but profiling is

>>735894

If it's would let far too few people in and we're in a recession with a double digit unemployment rate, wouldn't that make it worse with many more people in? Wouldn't the unemployment rate go up if we legalize everyone who crosses the border? And be able to take US government payed services? How fast would it be to see the US go under? Might as well let China take over since they own the US anyways now.

>>735924

Th..They do.

The best solution is to close the borders and exterminate all the niggers and beaners. Jews and Asians can stay, while keeping a close on eye on the Jews.

In b4 cops arresting and deporting demonstrators en masse.

>>735975

>allowing parasites into your nation

Bad idea goyim.

>>735902
The bill gives police the right to question any one of color as to whether they legally live within the United States. It IS a quota situation because officers will use arrests made by targeting minorities to fill said quota. No they don't get paid based on arrests. No one was suggesting that and if you thought that, maybe you should look into what a quota is for officers.

>>735917
Hurr durr. I said the bill was racist. Not the officers themselves.

>>735979

In b4 police stations are firebombed across the state, thousands of police are killed in ambushes, and prisons are raided while infrastructure is torn up and the state's congress and elected officials are executed en masse and Mexico grants the militia asylum.

it still cracks me up people think they have rights at all or that because you are brown you deserve some sort of special treatment

>>736003
Thus proving the bill's validity. Fuck the illegals.

>>736003

>implying you and your ilk aren't hoping for such events

>>735949

>Do you think America hates the idea of being the Land of Opportunity? Do you think we hate helping people flee from oppression, disaster, hunger, and horrors? Do you think the Statue of Liberty's stands for nothing?

Yes, at this point. Any attempt to fix the laws is stonewalled, and shit like this is put in.

I HATE to compare things to Nazis.

I utterly loath it.

But...this is how it starts.

The most effective way to stop illegal immigration is repeal NAFTA.

Operation Gatekeeper, the first attempt to enforce the border, occurred in 1994, within the same year as NAFTA.

The point was that they knew NAFTA was going to fuck Mexico up, and decided to get politicized over the issue.

>>736018

I very much am hoping for vigilante justice. The People need to take this country back and hang all the criminal scum cuntservatives. Idiots like you can go into the mass graves, too, nothing of value will be lost.

But, if illegal immigrants are allowed entry without consequences, what use is the legal way of entering this country? If we're going to take people in seeking refuge from their own country, then maybe we're trying to solve this problem incorrectly.

Maybe we should help Mexico crack down on the things it's nationals are running from?

>>736034
>I very much am hoping for vigilante justice. The People need to take this country back and hang all the criminal scum
Yeah, let's get all those illegals!

i am proud of arizon, fuck the illegals

>>736034

>implying you don't mean white people

The fact of the matter is, in Arizona, where I live and where this bill originated, there aren't Caucasian or Asian illegal immigrants. Do you know how far AZ is from Canada and Asia? Pretty far, pretty far. However, we have a shit ton of illegal Mexican immigrants here, they make up the vast, vast majority of our illegal alien population. This bill doesn't target Mexicans! It targets illegal aliens who, due to painfully obvious geographical reasons, happen to be Mexican because of the close proximity. This whole racism bullshit is another textbook example of playing the victim

>>736037

A good idea, helping them, and I am also not against deportation.

I AM against this law, as it gives too much power, and is far too much of a stepping stone to worse things.

>>735998 The bill gives police the right to question any one of color as to whether they legally live within the United States.

The bill gives the police the right to question anybody they suspect is an illegal immigrant. It does not specify "any one of color". You tacked that on to muddy the issue.

I already addressed this very fucking thing. The reason for the fear and paranoia amongst the Hispanic community is because thousands of illegal immigrants from Mexico cross the border every year. Do you think the white folks are afraid? Do you see Ireland, Germany, Russia, and whatever flooding Arizona with illegal immigrants? Do you think the black folks are afraid? Do you see South Africa flooding Arizona with illegal immigrants?

The reason the Mexican populace is afraid is because a bunch of their Mexican brethren have illegally crossed the border! It's no wonder they're screaming racism! They KNOW the problem lies amongst their own people!

Yes, it's probably going to suck for some legal immigrants and citizens for a while until the shitstorm settles down. I'm not ignoring the potential abuse by the law either. But "potential abuse" does not mean the entire thing is a racist doctrine.

Jesus Christ.

>>736058

Is that it? Are you scared the mean brown people are going to kill you for being white? Do unto them before they do unto you!

You're just setting yourself up to be lined up on the edge of that ditch. Plenty of white people like me will be willing to help if they get teeth. You're destroying this country.

>>736023 Yes, at this point. Any attempt to fix the laws is stonewalled, and shit like this is put in.

Try harder.

>>736068
Oh, you mean so the place where it's now okay to stop people for suspicion of being an illegal (whatever the fuck that means) just happens to be the place where all of the potential illegals are Mexican? Totally not to do with race, bro.

Could you be any stupider?

>>736077

>implying you wont be killed as well.

Hahaha, oh you libfags sure crack me up. HURF DURF CONSERVATARD!

>>736034 I very much am hoping for vigilante justice.

The only criminals here are the illegals. Be careful what you ask for. Sarah Palin might be reading.

>>736086

Not what the law says.

Read the fucking law.

Oh yeah, that's right, you don't care about laws, you just care about crying racism because you don't have your bottle.

>>736087
>call someone a libtard
> "hurf durf conservatard
are you fuckign serious?

I came here legally, can I get back the 8 months it took me to become a legal citizen? Not to mention the money it cost me? Maybe you guys can give me back the time it took me to get a job since I was so new to the country or how you illegals cut me out of any day laborer jobs because I couldn't take that shitty pay since I pay my bills.

Oh you can't... well, I guess I understand why you guys deserve to stay..

>>736085

You know what? Fuck it, you don't even have a foot to stand on, anymore.

>>736087
Because immigrants from Mexico aren't going to be Mexican?

They didn't make the law in Arizona because they have a Hispanic problem, they made the law because they have an illegal immigrant problem which happens to consist of Hispanics. If we had Canadians flooding into North Dakota illegally you bet your ass I'd want every LaBatt Blue-drinking blonde-haired blue-eyed pansy being carded for citizenship.

>>736093
It says that the police can inquire about a persons immigration status if there is a reasonable suspicion that he is here illegally.

>>736094

>implying I give a shit
>expecting proper debate on faggotchan

Libfags are brain washed scrubs.

>>736093
that is actually what the law says. they have the right to ask anyone they think may be an illegal and ask for their papers.

>>736098

>Implying illegals don't pay all the same bills you do, with far less cash.

>>736104
I dont' care if you give a shit or not. I was just pointing out that you are apparently retarded

>>736103

REASONABLE SUSPICION does not = "looking brown".

Especially considering that there are so many hispanics in the state.

Anyone complaining about this law is just looking for a strawman excuse and/or is just parroting the other strawman shit their so called "leaders" are crying about.

>>736087

No, that's Muslims. They might make me learn Spanish at worst. It'll be worth it to have watched you kind get what you had coming for centuries.

>>736088

True Libertarian strong! Bring it on cuntservatives!

>>736103

Right. Far too vague, far too open to abuse.

>>736112
illegals don't pay taxes, they all squat in one house and send their money to mexico, and as soon as they have enough of our money to live comfortably in mexico, they go back.

>>736086 Totally not to do with race, bro.

Chicken / egg argument: why would a state that has no problem with immigration from a border with a particular sovereign nation need to employ this "racist doctrine" if the denizens of that particular sovereign nation weren't crossing the border illegally?

You see it as Arizona only dealing with Mexican illegals, you're right. That's their fucking problem. If Arizona was bordering Canada, Canadians would be the problem. If Arizona bordered Ireland, Irish would be the problem. That there is a problem in the FIRST FUCKING PLACE is why this has come to a head.

>>736112
Yes, because illegals pay taxes and medical bills... oh forgot we pick up the tab on that.

I liked the guy who ran past about half way through who had a sign "I AM PROTESTING"
Shit's hilarious.

>>735301

Uhhhh why can't they just make their own jobs in Mexico?

>>735590
I agree. It's pissing off a lot of people who got here legally.

>>736116

Splitting
Us versus Them

No better than a conservatard.

>>736099 You know what? Fuck it, you don't even have a foot to stand on, anymore.

No, you just don't want to do what it takes to effect change. You're happier sitting at home screaming about it. Guess what? I'm not going to change anything for you and the laws aren't going to change for you.

Believe it or not, people do actually get shit done.

>>736115
Right, nobody knows what reasonable suspicion of being here illegally even means (hence my parenthetical "whatever that means"). It strikes me as the sort of thing that could be abused easily. And it obviously will be. And it will make hispanic/police relations even worse than they are... which is the only thing about this law that will have an actual effect.

You people are like children.

So... who doesn't know what this law says?

>Laws don't apply to non-whites
Such racism. Do you even understand how idiotic you sound?

>>736120

I'm an RN at a hospital in Tucson, and I can assure you, many do NOT pay medical bills.

i think this law is fascist, a threat to the freedom of american citizens and will be a mistake in the long run

>>736131
Whom are you addressing, brah?

>>736129

You're assuming and therefore making an ass out of everybody.

Why is one law somehow unfair/wrong because it can be subject to abuse, whereas all other laws are somehow not subject to abuse?

Oh that's right, it's because you don't care about any other laws, just the ones that are not in your favor.

>>736129
you think this is the only law that has a poorly defined concept of reasonable suspicion?

>>736128

>implying you know two shits about me, or the things I have done.

Fuck. The. Hell. Off.

You've got no idea what I have or have not done, to try and change those ass-backwards laws.

>>736139
No. I think they all do.
I think this one just happens to lead officers in the direction of brown people.

>>736120

And schools.

>>736116 True Libertarian strong! Bring it on cuntservatives!

Just like in my post about how free speech being controlled by threats of violence is abhorrent, so is your threat of violence abhorrent to a state's right to enforce the law of the land.

You wont win.

>>736138
No, they are all subject to abuse. This one happens to go in the direction of "harass brown people."

Don't you think that would strain relations?

>>736138

This is far more open to abuse, because of the vagueness of the wording. Christ, how do you not understand this?

>>736129

Its very clear cut. Let me give you an example.

---> cop pulls over someone for speeding. Their skin is brown. No reasonable suspicion of being illegal.

---> cops find a house with all windows boarded up and vans full of tens of people being shuffled in and out at all hours of the night reported by neighbors.... gues what, REASONABLE SUSPICION.

>>736138
also, I'm not mexican, and I don't live in Arizona. The only one with a personal stake in this is you, because you are a rabid racist.

>>736148
if a shit ton of brown people where not here illegally, relations might not be so strained

>>736156
They obviously would be strained. No doubt they get pulled over more often for drugs and the like. Minorities and the police have never gotten along. All we need is more reason for the minorities to distrust the police.

>>735654
It's moral for me to shit on a bunch of people parading their flag from another country while they are illegal showing that they shouldn't be in america because they don't want to be.

>>736141 You've got no idea what I have or have not done, to try and change those ass-backwards laws.

You're right. That WAS irresponsible of me. I apologize.

However, my point still stands. If you don't like the system, fix the system. Don't duck the system and then proclaim you should be exempt from it.

If laws have no meaning, why have them. Let society become anarchistic and you can have your way.

>>736148
>>736149

so guess what happens to police who abuse the laws? they get fired and/or thrown in jail. no problem.

White people just secretly want to see other white people get injured/killed. It gets their dicks hard.

>>736163
You live in a fucking fantasy, dude.
I can't put it any more accurately than that.

Ha, they actually believe they're real people. That's so cute.

>>736155

I don't give a shit about you personally, only your ideas. Cry racism more, it only discredits your position.

>>736169

And you're cynical. You both lose.

I don't doubt there will be abuse and the abusers will get away with some of it. However, not all abusers will get away with it. The law is controversial. In order to avoid a complete backlash politically, the enforcers of the laws will be watched a lot more heavily than you think.

At least initially. When the heat is off Arizona, things will get more lax. That's when problems will start.

>>736169

If you don't understand the subtext here, then you have no ability to sustain an argument.

>>736175
Let me quote you, since you are far too retarded to actually know what it is that YOU said

>you don't care about any other laws, just the ones that are not in your favor.
>just the ones that are not in your favor.

As I explained to you, I'm not Mexican and I'm not from Arizona. Do you see how that relates yet, you fucking dimwit?

>>736151

>Implying anyone will treat it like that, and it's not a free reign to pull over anyone you don't like.

The real issue is that the people who are here legally, for whatever reason (naturalized and born here or one who went through the process and has actual "papers" to show police if asked), THEY DON'T LIKE BEING TREATED AS AUTOMATICALLY A SUSPECT OF A CRIME BY DEFAULT.

Nobody does.
Do YOU like it when police officers immediately assume you were doing something wrong and demand you prove, right then and there, that you WEREN'T doing something wrong?
Fuck no. Nobody likes it and the fact that the law makes it possible for someone to land in prison over a simple mistake as forgetting to carry a piece of paper with you only increases people's anger at the legislation.

How would you like it if your state wrote a law that requires everyone leaving a major music concert to take a drug test and those who fail the test go to jail? Think about that.

>>736185

>implying you aren't a butthurt mexicunt

>>736185

wrongo. mr. ad hominem

>>736162

It does not make THIS law any less wrong, though. And, civil disobedient is still a tool.

>>736183
I'm not cynical. I'm a lawyer, who has actually studied criminal law. And as someone who cares more about the law than catching bad guys, I know well what sort of abuses cops will do in order to accomplish their goals (they care less about following the law than catching bad guys)

I've also personally witnessed a man get shot in the back by a cop. I have a friend whose dad is a cop, who informed me that thye all knew it was murder, but were going to do nothing about it. And you are telling me that cops will get fired for abusing (whatever that means, with such vague wording) this law?

It's jsut not gonna happen. And anyone with any modicum of experience in the real world would know this.

>>736187

Fuck this shit. Every time the police talk to me they treat me like a criminal and I'm fucking white.

Get over it, this law changes nothing. Police have been corrupt for decades in america.

>>736194
>oh noes he was mean to me
that's not what ad hominem is, dipshit.

I'm usually pretty civil but fuck them. I came here legally, hell I spent almost a year getting everything filled out for my family and I to come here and these lazy ass sons of bitches just waltz right on in with everyone giving them free handouts and sucking their dicks. What did I get? A boot in the ass at any job interview that needed someone to have lived in the states for more than a year and getting cut out of any day laborer jobs because I wasn't going to take such shitty pay. So fuck these illegals and their shit stain supporters.

>>736201

You don't talk like a lawyer.

>>736207

insults truly are the last refuge of the destitute mind.

>>736212
how is it you think that a lawyer "talks"?

>>736204
DURR THE POPO ARE BAD AND ANYONE WHO THINKS THIS ISN'T OKAY ARE FAGS
Nice to know humanity's ability to adapt to anything is still going strong in you.
The rest of us don't like corrupt police officers, enjoy your time in jail for being at the wrong place and wrong time.

>>736216
you still don't know what ad hominem means, though, do you?

And insults, to those who deserve them, are really just the natural flow of the conversation.

>How would you like it if your state wrote a law that requires everyone leaving a major music concert to take a drug test and those who fail the test go to jail? Think about that.
>my face when I read this statement
other than that I agree with the rest of your post

>>736217

I suppose I assumed too much about your rational intellect

>>736223

Defensive aren't we?

>>736227
>rational intellect
what do you even think this means?
fucking hell, you are the dumbest board on the internet.

>>736223

gtfo, real conversations are happening here.

>>736210

>I came here legally, hell I spent almost a year getting everything filled out

>almost a year

Lol no.

Nice try, conservatard troll.

Try 7-23 years.

>>736230
insults are defensive now? or do you not know what "defensive" means either?

>>736231

there goes another one off the deep end.

>>736201

There are video recorders. And you know everyone's going to follow each policeman and tape them.

>>736204
Attitude goes a long way, not to mention personal style. You'll get treated by the way you look and act, so if you have a shitty attitude towards cops they will have the same attitude toward you. Just look at yourself, what about you says you're trustworthy?

>>736220

I don't like it either but the protests are misguided and misfocused.

People should have been protesting corrupt police decades ago.

>>736235
That was a long while back before the system totally broke.

>>736225
Not really a strawman.
Anyone caught by the police in Arizona without their "papers" will be deported

Anyone in my made-up state caught with drugs in their system after a concert would go to jail.

Technically, both laws attempt to find and punish those who break a larger law. According to both laws, only those already guilty will face punishment and everyone else need only face a moment of discomfort under the glare of a police officer before you pass the drug screening/produce your papers and you both move on with life.

>>736243
In search of what? To determine whether or not the suspicion was "reasonable?" Fucking shit, people. Why can't you keep track of a conversation?

>>736244

A nice story, but wrong.

>>736260
>disagree
>don't give a reason why
>haters gonna hate

>>736199 It does not make THIS law any less wrong, though. And, civil disobedient is still a tool.

There's nothing "wrong" with this law. How it gets used might be wrong, but the law itself is only vague in some of it's terminology.

"Civil Disobedience", by the way, is a nice way of saying you don't want to follow the laws and don't want to get punished for it. It's crap.

>>736266

The counterargument is so obvious it doesn't need to be stated. Police shit on and abuse people who act respectfully and look decent and kempt all the time.

>forget ID at home
>cop runs name through database
>legal citizen recognized
>"have a nice day, sir"
FUCKING GAMESTOP

>>736267
wut? Civil Disobedience was practiced by people who fully expected to, and were, punished for it.

>>736274
>Got a ticket for speeding
>FUCK THE POLICE!

>>736276

Yeah because the police just accept a name....

Fucking teenage moronic faggot.

So why aren't the Tea baggers helping them?

>>736300
Because the deportation process involves them just dumping anyone without an ID over a fence, right?

Fucking teenage moronic faggot.

>>736300
actually if the database has a picture of you next to the name then they'll let you go, ie driver license. Though that's if they have an updated computer system in their car.

>>736308
Nobody suggested that.
They ARE suggesting that the police under this law will be required to detain this individual until they can get someone to prove their legal status or bring them their papers.

The trolls are simply trying to blow this out of proportion just like illegal immigrant supporters are.

Is it a fucked up law that will hassle people both legal and illegal? Yep

Will it be abused at times? of fucking course

Do illegals deserve any say in this? none at all

It will most certainly have fuck ups, it will most certainly be a hassle, it will most certainly use racial profiling. And since its Mexican immigrants moving across the border illegally it certainly should use racial profiling. Because the problem are illegal mexicans.

Any opinion other than this is a troll. Not a liberal Not a conservative just somehow who is too idealistic to face the reality of the situation and wants to offend no one. Or someone who is just trying to be an asshole ( ie 4chan) or defend their illegal family members

>>736280 wut? Civil Disobedience was practiced by people who fully expected to, and were, punished for it.

Great. It's still crap. Here's why:

"What is Non-Violence?

* Obviously, committing violence yourself is not non-violence!

* Hiring or encouraging others to commit violence for you also obviously cannot be termed non-violence. This includes relying on the legal system, which ultimately rests on the use of force as a last resort.

* Goading your opposition beyond endurance to the point where they respond violently is non-violence only in the most hypocritical, specious sense.

* So is obstructing the activities of others so much that they must resort to force to end the obstruction. The sit-ins of the 1960's were not non-violent in any meaningful sense.

* Putting people in the position where they either have to yield to your demands or resort to violence to stop you is emphatically not non-violence.

* Nor is provoking a violent response in the hope of getting an over-reaction that will discredit the opposition and gain sympathy for your side.

This is why "civil disobedience" is crap. It claims to be non-violent but fails miserably at being so.

>>736326
or someone who thinks that harassing citizens (for being born brown, of all reasons) is the last thing I want out of my country. And someone who realizes that when the police systematically harass brown people, brown people begin to dislike the police. And someone who realizes that citizens should not be feuding with the very people who are supposed to be protecting them - of course they aren't supposed to be doing that. But that is another post for another day.

>>736326

Your logic is impeccable good sir and I salute you. Am glad this discussion came to a resolution.

>>736341
Yep you fall under idealistic.

>>736353
So, being able to comprehend the upshot of this is too idealistic? Or thinking that police/minority tension is a bad thing is too idealistic?

>>736361
Complaining about the downsides while not providing an alternative and yet still expecting the problem to fix itself

IDEALISTIC

>>736361
I think its just the fact that there will always be tension between those in a position of authority and minorities

>>736366
I'll give you an alternative: don't pass this law.

It's not going to do anything about illegals, and will only serve to distance the hispanic population.

>>736369
So shouldn't we be doing things to decrease that tensions, and not doing things which will only serve to increase it?

>>736369

Guys guys, it's not just police vs. minorities. It's Americano Police vs. everyone.

In britain police are like, "good day old chap"

in america police are like STAND UP! SIT DOWN! RESPECT MY AUTHORITAY!

>>736366
People have offered the alternative. Go after the people hiring. They're directly responsible not some guy who gets harassed by cops for having too much of a tan.

>>736372

Hispanics need to be culled from this land.

>>736372

The law is awesome, and it is already doing something about illegals even before it goes into effect.

They are leaving the state and they are afraid to stay here. BIG WIN!!!

>>736372
ok we can add idiot to your job resume. Why should we not distance the ILLEGAL mexican population and therefore validate all the shit the legal residents had to go through? As i said will legal immigrants be hassled? fuck yes it's no worse than what i went through when i was abroad its part of actually going to another country. Not accepting that is simply childish

>>736376
honestly, I more or less agree with you. I just dont see anyone passing any other sort of laws that deal with illegal imagration. having said that, untill shit starts getting really bad between brown people and the police, well all this talk is just wanking isnt it?

>>736378
Granted, American police are the worst, and Americans are pussies for letting them behave the way they do. But of course, it is always minorities who get the worst of it.

Which, funnily enough, is what allows the police to behave that way. White people don't care if it's mainly brown people who have to deal with unruly policemen

>>736393
What? It will obviously be worse than what you wenr through? Are you fucking serious with this?

>>736395

>implying the police don't exist to keep savage brown people from stealing and killing for pleasure

>>736379
Sadly even if we did go after employers who's to say that the now unemployed illegal immigrants wouldn't mooch the system? if welfare doesn't already cover them ( i'm honestly not sure) who's to say they won't all start starving and then get added to welfare

>>736393
Nobody creates policies like that because then illegal immigrants who witness genuine crimes like rape and murder wouldn't act as a witness for fear of being deported.

>>736401
They exist for something like that. Not the savage brown people part, but they primarily exist to enforce the power structure.

>>736407

>implying brown people aren't savage creatures

>>736399
Yep i had to show my ID all the god damn time. Theoretically that's all this law does. I WAS racially profiled and it didn't bother me too much. Granted any legal immigrant who gets fucked over because of some yahoo has reason to complain but that's just how things work sadly

>>736413
I know oyu think that. That is why the police here have run amok. As long as you can be made to think that the division is between white people and brown people, rather than the power elites and those whom they fuck over, there will be no group to stop them.

>>736378
This is true.
I've been to Australia, the police down there were downright cordial compared to here.

And I think the problem is that the same groups of people who are most liable to commit crimes, are also the most liable to take up the badge so they "don't get hassled no mo'"
Thats not a race thing. All races do this. Why do you think the old stereotypical names for cops like McCoy and O'Brian were that way? Because back in the days when Irish immigrants were the new folk on the block and poor and committing crimes, THEY would decide to "get on the right side of the badge" and become police
Granted, some of these men and women did change and turn over a new leaf after they became cops.

Most don't. Most fell back into their bullying ways that outside of the uniform and badge would have been liable to wind them up in prison. They didn't NEED to commit crimes anymore, they had a job and got well paid. But they never did learn how to handle their anger properly and how to handle holding the life and death of a man in their hands. They were just as liable to shoot a man in the heat of the moment before they put the badge on as they are after


And that, ladies and gentlemen, is why you never trust cops. Rely on them and expect them to do their jobs, but NEVER trust them

>>736417
"that's just how things work, sadly" is just a cop out. Why don't you take responsibility to make it not how things work? It is just a way of not thinking about things. Fuckers love to not think about things.

>>736317

Driver's ani't cutting it, for the law, dude.

>>736424
You are feeding the troll.

Stop it

>>736403
They shouldn't be here in the first place. You seem to think that they're part of our society, but they're not. That's why they're "illegal" immigrants.

>>736434
I am making a point.
Get over it.

>>736432
Again IDEALISM is not a defense. You are asking me to provide a PERFECT solution. There is none and never will be.

>>736439
A defense to what? What am I defending against?

But lucky for you, the most perfect solution is where the people getting fucked over aren't you. You people are rotten and apathetic to the core.

>>736424

The most insightful thing on here all day.

Does anyone else realize how the system has got us arguing heatedly about surrogate issues that in fact have nothing to do with the real problems?

Someone up in the fucking govt is a fucking genius.

>>736432
You seem to be telling others to fix things without offering any suggestions up yourself.

>>736449
You seem to be incapable of comprehending what you read

>>736447

>implying savage brown people aren't the cause of most problems in America

>>736453

such subtlety is probably beyond your comprehension, green quote troll boy.

>>736460

>implying you aren't a troll

>>736446
basically any time i counter your point you say make it better. But when i say it cannot be perfect you say I'm just copping out. You are basically saying it isn't good enough and are ignoring why i say it can't be too much better.

But lets give it a try shall we?

Ok so it is on my shoulders to find a way to remove illegal immigrants without offending anyone or specifically going after the racial group that is illegally immigrating. I must also not bother the legal immigrants who may be of the same race & ethnic background as the illegal immigrants. I must also make sure that the law cannot be abused by anyone of power IE an officer of the law. ??

>>736469
So is that about the sum of it?

>>736469
I don't really expect you to make it better. I think that your acceptance of the violation of the rights and basic humanity of people (so long as they aren't you) is disgusting to me.

>>736476

>implying human rights aren't a pathetic ideal created by criminal politicians

>>736485
well, I didn't say anything about human rights...

>>736476
Well then you are simply easily offended. And will have to get thicker skin if you want to get anything done.

Don't get me wrong I'm a liberal atheist who bristles at the thought of racial profiling but i am also a pragmatist and realize that to get things done you've got to sometimes be a bit of an asshole.

>>736489
an asshole to brown people
not you, though.

>>736469

I think the new law is a great way to deal with this.

Problem is that the pro-illegals have an untenable position and will get angry at whatever result is not to their direct benefit, regardless of how impeccable it may be.

They are waging a PR war and have been for the past several years.

The longer we wait to deal with illegals, the stronger their voice will be, and the more destructive the result will be. They are struggling for power and political control, not rights.

>>736493
Now you're just using the race card. I think I've made my point.

>>735055

SoCalfag here. I would wager that most of the people in this video are not illegal.

My girlfriend has a lot of illegal family in the country. And all their friends are illegal too. And they are fucking terrified of the police. They do absolutely nothing but work, come home, then work, then come home. This is what 99% of them do.

>>736509
"Race card" has been rendered meaningless by idiots like you, who use it as an escape from an argument that they cannot handle.

My point is that it's extremely facile to say "them's the breaks" so long as you aren't the recipient of said breaks. You're just a fuckign self-centered piece of shit.

>>736524

I think you just made his point, too

>>736530
I don't think you understand this conversation.

>>736522

Hopefully they will be terrified enough to leave.

ITT: Delicious shitskin tears

Look at all the overweight chicanos waddle after them lol

>>736530
" "Race card" has been rendered meaningless by idiots like you, who use it as an escape from an argument that they cannot handle."

Correct sir you are saying as long as it doesn't happen to white people every time i make an arguement.

I'm glad you could admit you were using race as a defense, when i have never given my opinion of whites being treated in the same way in other countries

>>736539

Is that a conversation to you? retorting with "You're just a fuckign self-centered piece of shit"??

>>736530
Sorry misquote :)

>>736545
I was saying as long as it doesn't happen to you. I had no idea that you were white

>>736495
I dont think ANYONE is pro-illegal
Everyone just thinks that the easier way to get rid of illegals is to go after the jerks who HIRE them, not to go after them for getting those jobs.

Its a simple equation, what motivates them to come here illegally? TAKIN' OUR JOBS
So, you go after and SEVERELY FINE maybe even shut down any place that hires illegals BOOM no more illegals will want to come here.
Problem fucking solved

Instead of doing that they try to go after the illegals here, even though it will be nothing but a perpetual landslide of humanity coming over the border to be arrested and sent back and come again.

Its like stopping an ant infestation. YOU DON'T GO OUT STOMPING ON THEM.
You move your food into the fridge and move the rest of the stuff into a bag somewhere else. In other words, you remove the ants' motivation to come there in the first place.

>>736548
Thank you fellow anon but i've been arguing with lots of people for lots of reasons for a long time. :)

I don't actually expect to "win" I just make my points as logically as I can.

I also don't expect to convert anyone to my way of thinking. That's not what this is about. Just expressing my opinion on an imperfect law

>>736559

I'm just fighting for some standards in this wasteland here.

>>736557

I generally agree with this, except for the fact that the lobbies and representative of these groups actually walk and talk like they are pro-illegal. The minute they stop acting like fucking aztlan warrior reborn is the minute they get respect from normal US citizens.

>>736570
The problem is nothing can be done about illegal immigration without offending someone.

If we directly search for illegals its racial profiling invasion of privacy etc etc

If we go after employers of illegals then we are depriving them of a livelihood and offending family members etc etc.

There is NO solution that will not affect the current state of things

>>736592

Yup, which is why I think it's better to do shit like this state law now while the issue is smouldering, as opposed to ignoring it for 10 more years while it develops into mt. st. helens.

>>736592
I don't know where you've been getting your information, but the problem IS NOT that people "get offended" over having their illegal aunt and uncle wind up jobless.
The problem is most places that DO hire illegal immigrants do it because they can't complain about being underpaid or overworked. They do it to increase their profits by not hiring actual citizens who would say "Hey isn't 4.50 an hour below the state's minimum wage?"
Usually these companies are big corporations who are big donors to politicians. That is the problem

Nobody fucking cares if someone gets "offended" that illegal immigrants wind up jobless, least of all the police. They DO care when it impacts the way they do business and their profit margins and they DO care if all it takes is a little political pressure to get the police to look the other way for them.