your idea is fucking nuts, but my only problem is how was your pic not related?

>>126755
Some ppl live in ships. We WONT build a crazy city in the ocean. Just gather the ships at one point, so we live better.

>>126756
Thanks bro.

What sea are you planning on living on? I would imagine that would make quite a difference.

Make sure you dont have anything or anyone of value because pirates will rob/rape it/them
Yarr matey

You can't just sail out to sea and do whatever you want. You need an international sailing licence, loads of different permits for a ship, and you have to follow the maritime laws of whichever country's waters you are in. International waters also have laws.

>>126776
Not to far way from the coast, we don't want to throw ourselves on any climatic danger. We will stay near a island. We wont pass the boarder either.

>>126766
Arrr, that is why we wont go to far way from the coast, and we have ak-47 and bazzokas with us... And throw-able kittens, just in case.

>>126787
Aware of it. We wont just sail like a douch bag in the sea, we will stay near the coast, and one of our friends already sail, he is savy with sea and laws, still needing to see ALL the laws pertinent to our country.

You could use some form of tidal generator for the power??

Hydroponics for food, especiallyvhigh pressure aeroponics. Uses about 10% of the water of standard earth farming with yields far greater than soil or standard hydroponic tech. You could easily power it using tidal and VAWT, as the tidal pressures are cost effective to harness and can be converted to pressurization systems with minimal hassle (Aero requires either high pressure of ultrasonic transducers; pressure is more reliable).

>>126820

Could easily be fully organic as well, using algae derivatives and fish meal as a nutrient base.

>>126756

You can apply this concept to greenhouses and things, basically self-watering planters that don't have to be fully enclosed. It's a neat concept, though it's mostly done on land.

Anyway, it's not like the OP is actually going to do what he says he wants to do, but if you ever did something like this, well, look at what Blueseed is doing. They're basically going to live on a cruise ship and make money selling various services to residents of other countries, or something. There are huge problems with Blueseed but the basic idea is there.

Building on the sea isn't a trivial matter. Many materials can't resist corrosion from seawater, though some can. Look up things like concrete barges. There are some cement products out there that can resist seawater for many, many years with minimal maintenance. (Interestingly the part of the cement that's always below water gets attacked less - minerals start to deposit onto it and there's no air, less temperature variation, and so on.)

ftcenergy.com

The vertical mills are a great idea offshore- hits both tidal winds.

>>126828

Or you could go with a Kitegen/Skysails rig.

(If it didn't start tugging you around.)

>>126818
We are thinking of using wind generation. Don't know about tidal generation, I will consult my friend if we can somehow apply it.

>>126825
>>126820
We are thinking of using some sort of algae culture, to extract oil or food for fish, we are not sure of it yet through of what exactly expect from algae culture but we know it is possible. We are planing a lot and we have much time to think and study this things (up to 3 years!), but I like the ideas and we will think about it.

>>126826
We will do, half of us have jobs near the cost, we wont even need to quit our jobs. :). Just not now, we are thinking of building one single ship in 3 years and travel, test, et cetera, and them build our actual ships separated, sell or reuse the testing one. But we are not looking for anything fancy and crazy, just living together at the sea, like many ppl do on land. Most of us leave near beachs or islands, we love the sea and travel by boat is pretty common for us.

We are thinking of building it from some sort of light metal and use industrial paint, fiberglass (much more common here) or carbon fiber. We are not sure yet, some of us want the fiberglass (me being one of the ones how want it), others the metal, others the carbon fiber.
I will look for the concrete, although an odd material, I am curious, never knew of a concrete ship.

I used to crew for a friend who had a 40ft ferro cement ketch. The hull didn't flex or leak even in storm force winds although it took a force 4 to even get it moving at a reasonable pace.

Ferro cement is an ideal product for larger seagoing vessels/platforms. It's also cheap to build.

Fibreglass etc is by comparison a short term product as you start to get problems after 20-30 years even with the best resins. Forget steel unless you are into constant maintenance and same for aluminium.

Another alternative is copper sheathed wood - the copper acts as an antifouling. Lots of flexing though so you have to keep an eye on bilge levels.

>>126857
Steel and aluminium can suffer badly from corrosion so need constant maintenance. Aluminium is especially bad, get it near a different metal in salt water and a galvanic circuit sets up that can literally turn bits of your hull into white powder in a very short time. You can get 'blocking' circuits but as I say, any metal requires tons of maintenance.

>>126857

I personally suggest cement due to the more permanent nature of the settlements proposed. You won't be moving this thing much. I hope.

Yes, it's incredibly heavy, yes, it takes an absolute shitload of energy to move. No, it's not weak, it's much more chemically stable than any metal or (currently known) resin, and relatively speaking it's not very expensive.

Here's what I would do, personally. First, take a look at the building techniques that are being explored by the Broad Group. They use mass produced, factory fabricated metallic structural elements based on a building design that's drafted and tested in a computer. It's basically a gigantic Meccano set, only they pour concrete into it where that's appropriate. You could use these kinds of elements to make large skeleton frames around which mesh and textiles are wrapped, and then sprayed down (or poured over) with cement. With the right design you could maximize displacement and structural strength all at once, and make repeating modules that could be linked together to make larger structures, or at least the foundation of the bigger structure you're making. Think concrete pontoons made of honeycomb cylinders and buckyball joints, and putting stuff either on top of or inside (or even under) them. Since you'll only move it rarely if at all, building for speed shouldn't be your first concern.

>>126869
>>126857
I think this will convince the guys to not use the metal, I was against it since the start, but we have two guys with knowledge of eletronics and they think steel is better, and are thinking of polarising the hull to prevent corrosion. But it looks expansive and less retarded them make the hull with some appropriated material.

I think you just convinced me to use ferro cement. haha

Thank you bros, you are awesome, keep coming!

Grow apple trees. They grow easy their fruit is great and if you burn their wood to cook your food it makes your food taste good. setting up a distillery to distill ocean water would provide you with salt and drinkable if somewhat less nourishing water however it makes great water for freshwater fish and therefore aquaponics which would put nutrients back in the water that you could then filter into perfect drinking water.

god i love stealth shtf

>>126875
My project was something on this lines. Make a skeleton with materials with different properties, treat so it doesn't corrode with time or something like that, and cover it with some fiber or plastic like material. Little maintenance with good and durable properties. But I like your idea, I will search more.

Concretefag here again.

Consider designing some kind of barge system where the barges can be linked together one by one into a much larger (but flexing) grid -think multiple pontoon bridges hooked together.

Each person that wants to join the community has to provide at least one barge that fulfils a specific function. Design the barges for interlinking sewage, water, power etc.

Have open water areas every so often to let light through underneath.

Moor said construction in reasonably shallow water (diving distance of the bottom)

Allow weed etc to build up underneath - this acts to attract fish which attract more fish and eventually you have a whole scale ecology underneath you.

You now have a food source to hand.

You could also string nets out and form enclosures for your own fish farms.

Drape thick lines into the water and get mussels/oysters growing on them - another food source.

There are quite a few 'desert' areas of shallow water that have been brought back to life by the addition of artificial reefs in concrete, old ships or even dumping degreased vehicles over the side.

Power from Solar and Wind generation. Water from reverse osmosis and solar stills.

>>126898

It might be out of OP's league but you can harness power from longitudinal waves in the water as well. The Pelamis power gizmo does this. Technically wind power, as the waves are wind-driven more than anything else.

It's basically a hydraulic ram driven by the bending of a long, articulated pipe in the water; the waves cause it to bend, and power is extracted from that motion.

On artificial reef construction: If you wind up cultivating a nice, pretty patch of wildlife, it might be an attractive place for recreational diving, too - but giving yourself fish to catch is probably the better use of this resource.

I spent a LOT of time discussing this sorta thing on previous chans, most recently 888&808s /sov/s

There are a few conclusions that...well, you can disagree with me if you don't like the sound of them, but they're still true.

1: unusual materials.

No. If they were a good idea, they'd be what ships were made from now. For anything of any size, steel. Definitely steel. There are other materials for less tricky waters, but if you want something large to spent 99% of the time in international waters (or any), you have a choice of hundreds of different types of steel.

2: Stationary/touching the sea bed.

Not even slightly possible from a legal perspective, anywhere shallow enough would come within a nations EEZ.

3: Lots of little boats or one big thing.

While lots of little boats is emminently possible, there isn't much point. You want a boat to live on, buy one. You can sail to international waters with your other boat owning friends if you like, but it doesn't really allow for anything really related to /diy or /sov or /suv. You want one big thing.

4: How big?

The bigger the better, larger=more stable, less sinkable, more room(well dur), and cheaper. For srs, per square foot(so berth), big ships are cheaper to build/run.

5: income.

You need one. Fuck growing your own food, generating your own power....that's barely relevant (although extremely interesting/cool ofc)...you need cash. You will need maintenance, and eventually.....to have a whole new one built. Or possibly go like george washingtons axe depending on design.

>>126935
Continued, two more points that are my opinion.

first/sixth...the best way to get income would be to tax/rent your citizens/comrades/whatever.

trying to run some sorta communist system and sell fish for cash....or whatever you think of to sell....it just ain't gonna work. Sure, you're going to fish a lot, and you may as well sell your excess....but....well if you think you're gonna pull of something like this and fix communism at the same time, you may as well just go to bed at this point. Let individuals worry about their income, and contribute as individuals.

>>126949
>>126949
continued
Seventh...on design & cost (because fuck knows the cost for designs which aren't essentially ships, but it'll be higher)....you basically want the hull of the biggest cruise ship you can get enough people for...but set up for functionality, eco/hippy/fisherman lifestyle, rather than luxury. For the reason (among others) of wanting a different set up (especially if you want stuff like onboard hydroponic farms, wave electro generators etc), I strongly suggest having something custom built rather than buying an old ship and trying to convert it how you like ad hoc.

Assuming you get around 10,000 people in your floating town, and go for the cruise ship hull, but set up for functional permanent apartments rather than luxury holidays....you're probably looking at a cost of ~1BilUS$, or 200k per house, (assuming average of two people per).

This is about the cost of a house as normal in the western world, so it's doable. Anything else (smaller/a design like OPs pic) would be more expensive, with the exception of buying some knackered old ship and trying to DIY....which, may be the more appropriate option for this board, but is the less likely to work IMO.

In summary, if you can find 10,000 people wanting to live on the sea, in what could essentially be described as a whole new nation, with international waters & a flag of convenience if any...capable of financially supporting themselves in the middle of an ocean....and willing to cough up ~100US& each....it is, from a technical perspective, completely doable to live on a fuckoffhuge cruise ship type thing. Other options are progressively harder, rapidly going on to be realistically impossible

>>126745
I think your friend has seen this video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cvn9l1pJ3-A

>>126953
That sank. He made another.

That sank too.

You 4 channers need to realize that one of these projects will never take off from 4 chan.

You might be able to ddos a site from pushing a few buttons but I don't think this site even possesses ten people that could actually be able to create anything in the real world.

If you doubt me show me even one of these threads where the OP didn't slink away within a month or so.

>>127040
There've been many similar threads since forever, sometimes they spawn websites, they never get anywhere. The most longlived ones are the ones which can distract themselves longest (with making fancy websites, writing constitutions etc) from realising that none of them are prepared to contribute any money.

There was a site (I forget the name) last year which was particularly successful at this because it had a donations section. Where people could post how much money they were willing to donate. Tens of thousands in donations were not gathered in any way shape or form, difficulties with negotiating a voting system for taking decisions were smoothed over by congratulating themselves on a new round number of donations -which didn't actually exist because there wasn't even a bank account and they hadn't gathered a single penny- reached.

Nevertheless I find such threads/forums/sites interesting, and one day I'll post when I have actually done something vaguely along these lines. I'm just not talking about it beforehand because....well, ya know how these threads go.....

OP here. I made this thread so we could get some ideas, although I have mechanic degree, I don't know a single flying fuck about ships despite the basics, so are my friends, even the one that actually sail, he doesn't know much.
Here I live is common thing you build Artficial island with PET bottles and live on it near the beach/island/river, yes, ppl build house over pet bottles. So, we aren't trying anything new and fancy here. Just the common thing, but with boats, which mean they can move, so we don't need to count with luck. We are 7 friends, some of us have Girlfriends, some not, we are projecting this thing to accommodate 14 people, two on every boat, but know we only have 9-10 ppl.

What we hope is that we can leave there cheaply like many people. We though building a small community-like on the coast would be a good idea for many reasons.

The plain is building 7 boats that can accommodate 2 ppl easily, and them make a small artificial island from here we would tie the boats. The island would be more of a base, with a small farm of some. We think of expanding the farm and even sell whatever the shit it produce, but I think that is too much of a dream.

Anyway, we WONT build this colossal shit at the pic. I just post it there because its was one of the first things that came when I typed "floating city" in my language.

But thank you all many ideas opened my eyes.

>TL;DR Just 7 boats, for 7 friends, one small island to tie the boats that have a farm of something. Live cheap. Doing it is common here. No colossal futuristic like floating city.

Gif relevant

Theres village like this in Ha Long bay, Vietnam I believe.

>>126745
Am I the only one that thought OP's pic was some kind of Star Trek shaped spaceship in space, and not a floating island on water?

Can it be done? Probably. Why won't it work? It needs to work as a destination and that is harder than anyone expected. This is also a problem with Moon and Mars bases.

>>127383
lol what?

>>127344
Ah okay. Don't those bottle island things sink as soon as there's a storm though?

It depends considerably whether you're looking for a farm that's going to be destroyed and need rebuilding every few years, or something permenant......if you invest in some permenant stuff, and then it sinks.....

The main problem is environmental influences. The sea can rip the largest megastructure to shreds if it doesn't have a direct foundation linked to the bottom of the ocean.

The same with moon and mars bases. The corrosive dust makes our toughest alloys look like paper. We're not technologically advanced enough to pull off such pioneer projects - YET.

So get out there, get a specialized education, and help the future of the human race.

>>126935

Ships are made from steel chiefly because they have to move. Concrete is THE choice for stationary applications, and is currently used in everything from houseboats to drilling platforms. HOWEVER, if the seastead needs to get anywhere fast, concrete is an awful idea. It's far too heavy and concrete ships that are meant to sail are gigantic power-hogs because of their mass. In all other respects it's a remarkable way to build a seaworthy craft or ocean structure.

Shit like fiberglass composites and whatever don't belong on anything bigger than a yacht. It's meant to be easy to shape, light, and pretty, not especially strong. It's total ass for anything else.

Agreeing on most other points besides the power generating bit. Being able to produce enough electricity to keep the lights on without any fuel is a huge deal. If this thing is not energy-independent, that's a colossal liability. Anything from financial hardship to storms could lead to prolonged power outages resulting in the structure becoming unsafe to inhabit.

>>127908

On the topic of ocean platforms, it's also worth noting that a concrete structure that can float can also be sunk deliberately, or lowered to a preset depth, awaiting further stages of a structure to be added to it. This is how a number of oil drilling platforms are made. The resulting structure can then be sealed to water and pumped out, or remain filled with water and lowered to the seabed. However, this is a huge engineering undertaking and not likely within the purview of this project.

However, a structure that is designed to start above water and descend as things are added to it over time is an intriguing possibility if it's useful from day one.

>>127906
>The main problem is environmental influences.

This man speaks the truth. If you can figure out how to engineer a stable environment or "safe harbor" for boats and makeshift housebarges then you'll have people lineing up at the door. If you look at the problem there are 3 main chalenges to overcome.

wind
waves
salt corosion

Would be good to get some ideas generated to deal with this. Only thing I can think of at this moment is having a island ring of wave breaks which will dampen the destructive effect waves will have on smaller ships.

>>127915

As a matter of fact, there's emerging science right now that proposes that the acoustic cloak effect can be applied to ocean waves, to deaden them and create areas that are wave-free, even partially protected from tsunamis. The idea is to use concentric circles of wave-breaks in a particular pattern, which causes the wave to cancel out and be routed around the structure.

It's also getting attention from people that want to earthquake-proof buildings, or create vibration-free platforms for instruments without needing to create a vibration-free room. Give it a look.

>>127915
>>127917

As for salt corrosion, this is the real stumper, because while concrete beneath the water can last ages, above the surface things get ugly. Fused ceramics aren't nearly as vulnerable but are loads more expensive. I have to wonder if some kind of tile or sea-brick is possible that is made of or at least coated with something that will never degrade in seawater unless broken.

>>127917
>>127915
>Poseidon carved the mountain where his love dwelt into a palace and enclosed it with three circular moats of increasing width, varying from one to three stadia and separated by rings of land proportional in size. - Plato's description of Atlantis

>>127919
>tile or sea-brick

What about coral? There are allot of people growing beds of coral right now. For compleatly different reasons but could you make bricks out of them?

in b4 coral castle

>>127908
Yeah, I had completely the wrong idea about what OP was after with that lot. Also, when I said 'fuck generating power', I didn't mean don't do it...I meant that no matter how self sufficient you'd try to be with power/food/whatever, you'd still need money.

If I've got it right what OPs after, other than a load of farming etc advice, his problem is making a floating island which can be pulled around by boats....or rather, that isn't his problem, it's easily doable.....the problem is living on it in an expendable way...so when big winds blow through and destroy it it's no big loss, just build another.....


Which kinda rules out relatively expensive shit like the hydro/aero/ponics that's always talked about on here.

If all the equipment has to be on/be able to be packed onto relatively fast....the boats (which I assume will be cheap cabin cruisers or similar) to pop back to land when there's a storm coming....this is kinda a challenge of sustainable energy, desalination, general ameneties...using the smallest (sizewise) amount of equipment.


Alternatively, he/we could think about having floating platforms that could be detatched from the main 'island', and sailed off somewhere sheltered pretty quick....but any attempt to design that will, I suspect....end up with the conclusion that the best bet is to buy a load of usa style houseboats.

>>127921

It's a bit more complicated in practice, but:

http://www.news.illinois.edu/news/11/0105sound_fang.html

This can be scaled up. This can also work in water. I'm trying to find the links for the ocean version, but long story short, you can make an object 'disappear' to ocean or seismic waves.

>>127924
I wonder if those concentric rings could double as tidal/wave energy generators?

>>127924

http://nextbigfuture.com/2008/09/tsunami-invisibility-hiding-structures.html

Here's one of them. Blog links to papers, etc.

And here's a wiki link for some other shit.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seismic_metamaterials#Dissipating_ocean_surface_waves_with_seismic_meta
materials

TL;DR the structures being investigated for light invisibility are widely applicable to other kinds of waves, though challenges remain.

>>127925
I doubt it, it appears to work by reflecting waves in a particular pattern, if you take energy out of the waves.....it's gonna dodge it up.

IIRC that old Scottish nodding duck design from the 80s made the sea behind it pretty flat....but once the weather gets bad, it stops working. I'm kinda guessing that the thing you're talking about will stop normal waves, but be overcome by a storm too....

>>127927

I'm not sure if this particular design can be overwhelmed or not. I imagine at some point, maybe mechanical stresses could just cause the structure to fail, but I don't know at what point that would be. Keep in mind, these are being proposed to arrest earthquakes. Seismic waves are some of the most energetic natural phenomena on Earth, and if a wave that would normally destroy a building can be guided around it without incident this must be some gnarly shit.

>>127927
This
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Salter%27s_Duck

Generates energy & the sea behind it is relatively calm....

>>127929

These have been scaled up in the Pelamis wave power system. It's an intriguing power source, but as a wave break it has limits.

>OP here

LOL this thread is getting even better!

I am thing of using the inertia to generate energy from wave, instead of a pressure or some thing like this. Like thus watch that charge themselfs as you walk.

The weather here is nice, no problem with much things.

Here, A randon chick as a thank you gift. You all are the finest gentlemen, on the internet.

>>127986
Okay, to clarify:

Where the hell are you?

Where is it gonna be? (open ocean, lake, river, lagoon etc)

Do you wanna tow the island(s) around often/when needed/never?

Other than food, energy, potable water, is there anything else you're after producing on boat/island?

How's the fishing where you're gonna be?

Do you have permission from the appropriate authorities?

>>127921
Atlantis = Britain.

Read "The Millennial Project: Colonizing the Galaxy In 8 Easy Steps" by Marshall T. Savage.

He describes bootstrapping from sea-steading to fueling rockets and colonizing our Solar System then the galaxy.

For sea structures consider using sea-crete. This is made using a metal framework that is electrified to accrete minerals from sea water. This same research spawned the fast-growing coral projects.

For sea power, consider OTEC. This technology uses an evacuated chamber at the surface and pumps cold water from the depths. Only works near benthic sources but generates power forever once started and produces room-temperature, nutrient-rich water afterward. OTEC have been demonstrated in Fiji and Hawai'i.

Pic is Aquarius, a proposed city-sized, OTEC powered, sustainable ocean micronation proposed by Marshall Savage in 1992. A "space colony at sea" as practice for actual space colonies made by the same organization.

One advantage to Aquarius over the OP's pic is the bio-inspired hex layout and wave-barrier/fish-farm. It can grow over time by adding hexen to the core and additional units to the barrier.

>> Avallon, their proposed Moon colony.

My best bet using existing construction for a starter sea colony beyond a boat-village:

Core of square (ideally hex) concrete barges with sealed floatation shells.
Same design, sinkable for beach and underwater structures.
Spar-based fish farms between core and barrier.
Multiple wave barriers based on wave-generators then floating breaks/jetty.
Located near equator on edge of continental shelf near shipping lanes.

Location is important- access to deep waters for OTEC, research and mining, shipping lanes to serve as port, the shelf for bio diversity and land access.

>>127994
Nasa is looking into large scale bio fuel production by growing algae in offshore collonies. If this can be done then off shore colonization will not only be feasible, it'll become proffitable. Maybe in 30 years or so off shore colonies will become the new oil barrons.

>>128191
>that pic
>the golden filtered galactic sky across the entire colony
>mfw

>>128191

You know there's a part of mercury at the polar regions where the sun never shines, so its permanently 180-200 degrees minus celsius. That would be the coolest place to colonise, you have access to immense heat from the sun yet you live in the cold just mining and shit.

Too bad it has no practical applications except for solar power, but that will be pointless when were advanced enough anyways...

>>128224

My assumption is that sometime in this century solar power will become the dominant form of electrical generation. Also in that assumption is that most of it will eventually be collected in orbit and beamed to the surface or other locations in space.

Things like OTEC will be specialized applications, as will wave and geothermal power. These do have one thing in common - relative passivity while generating power from entropy.

>>128197

Dem Domes.

>>128238

I dont think solar power will ever be a major energy source simply for the fact that fusion power will be feasible in the future, probably before we start large scale orbital platforms. Then again in the far far far future solar power and fusion power will probably be synonymous

>>128241

I always discount fusion for a few reasons and eagerly await being proven wrong.

First it has been "50 years away" for a long time. ITER or similar may change that but am not betting on it. Second there is a manufacturing issue in that solar can conceivably be built and installed robotically, modularly and anywhere with sunlight while fusion will always be a very large plant.

At dyson cloud or Kardashev 1 density, we harvest the Sun's energy as if it were an enormous fusion station.

>> No guts, no galaxy.

Tidal generators. If you fix an anchor to the bottom of the sea, and attach a line to your structure on the surface, the up/down motion of the ocean will generate energy. This allows you to both fix the position of the structure and generate energy. Although there isnt too much motion, the sheer weight of the structure creates lots of energy with bouyancy.

>>128248

We agree on the last point at least, in the end solar power and fusion power will be the same

here go nuts

http://dornob.com/design/architecture/houseboats/

>>128254

Of course. The critical issues are mostly around delivery method and delivery/storage infrastructure.

>>128251

Aquarius and other proposed sea colonies often include that. Aquarius IIRC had the generators on the outer barrier and maybe just anchors on the core.

>>128224
>permanently -397 degrees Fahrenheit
>temperature on the Moon in direct sunlight reaches about 250 degrees above zero F

screw photovoltaic solar. With that much heat differential at the poles you could create a ginormous thermal engine to generate power. With there being water at the poles and now the possibility of exporting 3He to earth for fusion generators it would appear the best stepping stone to space colonization.

>>128268

Who said anything about photovoltaic-only? There are all sorts of ways to generate power from the sun. Not even being tricky here - in direct harvesting sunlight in space it can be PV, solar-thermal, possibly microwave or magnetic tether. On Earth, PV, solar-thermal and balloon based PV.

>>128274
wouldn't a magnetic tether slow the earths rotation? also I think we've gone off topic here. Solar colonization isn't something any of us are going to /diy/

>>128278
You can /DIY things into space relatively easily these days. Best May did it for Ghana style pet coffins.

>>128278

Some of us are trying to DIY space.

Magnetic tethers are generally planned for use in Earth orbit but on a mega-scale could be set free to decelerate against the solar field. Almost all space power schema involve steerable or digital microwave transmission, which has been demoed in Hawai'i.

>>128286
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MhPgHlaMhMU

Gonna roll all my points on ocean colonization into one big thing:

1. Concrete barges that can be expanded from above or below should form the foundation of the structure. At a large enough size these floats become pylons.

2. Desalination with process heat and electricity from a concentrating thermal solar power plant should not be a big issue, and the resulting salt could have economic value. Plastic bubbles sitting on top of the seawater can also produce potable water and should be used to make greenhouses for food production and leisure.

3. The infrastructure should be repetitive, easy to manufacture, and strength should scale with size. Triangular and honeycomb frames work nicely for this.

4. Wind and wave power are both highly accessible on the open ocean as well.

Solar power is bitchin', dude.

For about a year I lived in a house that ran purely on solar energy. It made me a believer in solar.

Just get quality components, don't skimp on inverters.

>>128298

Seriously, the inverter almost matters more than the fucking panels. A shitty inverter will make your entire system useless.

Anyway, more points on colonization:

A hypothetical sea colony must have a source of income. If you dump your infrastructures into power generation, you could perhaps recycle things there, make synthetic chemicals (including fuels), but manufacturing probably would not come until much later. Neither would sea-mining. If you can manufacture synthetic LNG and sell it, you might have a business case.

Look up the Skysails ship. They use a very large traction kite to drag a container ship around the ocean in order to cut fuel costs. The fuel reduction amounts to a very, very substantial amount of bunker oil. Now imagine a similar ship with a stack of these kites, being dragged through the water to drive a turbine, tacking in circles while a cracking machine turns plastic and other garbage into syn-crude, or an electrolysis tank (or another device exploiting one of the metal oxide cycles) fills an interior tank with syn-LNG. When it's done, it uses some of this fuel (and possibly even the same turbine) to return to shore, or transfers its cargo to a more capable vessel.

These products will also be hugely useful at home.

>>127994
>OP here

Where the hell are you?
>South America
Where is it gonna be? (open ocean, lake, river, lagoon etc)
>Near the coast, near some island. Ocean.
Do you wanna tow the island(s) around often/when needed/never?
>Never. Only if a emergence appears.
Other than food, energy, potable water, is there anything else you're after producing on boat/island?
>Nope, only this things you said. No need to produce anything. Money wont be a problem.
How's the fishing where you're gonna be?
Hmmm That I can't give you a actual answer... Probably any Tropical fish.
Do you have permission from the appropriate authorities?
No, This will be a 3 years project, we will start with the bureaucratic shit when we decide whatever the fuck we will gonna make. (Probably in the next 2 years) Until there, better not waist money and patience with it. =P

>>128292

Man, that was beautiful

>>128317
I hear that.

>OP Here
>>128296

I want to make a manufacturing factory, but that is a future project (more like a dream...), and one that I could fully undestand, wont need to come here for that.

>>128312
Okay, so you're going to be off the coast of south america....and you don't think you'll ever get weather to break-up/sink an artificial island made from plastic bottles?

Are you really sure about that?

>>128325

Within a few degrees of the Equator never sees hurricanes - Coriolis effect.

>>128325
ON the coast of south america. And as incredible as it seens, I never heard of a such artificial island sinking, families live on thus things.

And south america barely have any natural disaster, no tsunami, no hurricane, no nothing. Just hot, hot as hell. Some times one thing or another happen, but never heard of tsunami/big tedal waves.

>>128335

There are artificial islands in Peruvian lakes but this is a bit different from living on the sea.

But it's still an amazing concept and it's fascinating to see just how old an idea it really is.

>>128292
I've always wondered weather a hydrogen balloon would be able to combust at high altitues. It needs oxygen to explode so at some point in our atmostphere a hydrogen balloon would be able to remain afloat with no risk of exploding in a giant fireball of death.

People will hate me for this but I think hydrogen zeppelins need a second look. All accidents that occured with them happened on the ground and they collided with something. The hindenberg for example wasn't even meant to use hydrogen, they switched it to hydrogen a day before the accident happened. I believe if you were to get a zeppelin that remained in low earth orbit perminently it would be quite safe.

>>128360

It can still blow up, even up there, but that's not the point.

The real point is that we have the technology now to handle hydrogen safely, and if we pussed out after every jumbo-jet crash as hard as we did with the Hindenburg, nobody would fly today. Helium is too expensive to consider as a lifting gas for commercial flight, but luxury air cruises and 'hovering hotels', I guarantee you they would have a huge market if they could be certified.

The trick is designing something lightweight, heat-resistant, and strong that can house hydrogen balloons like an egg carton and fail gracefully if one of them ignites or explodes - and then make it as hard as possible for them to do just that without killing your lifting capacity. You could blanket them in an inert atmosphere of nitrogen, design outlets to safely vent the contents of a leaking balloon, and shape the enclosing structure in such a way that the energy of an explosion is safely directed away from the structure to avoid a chain reaction. (Insulators, like aerogels, would be needed to deal with the heat of a hydrogen fire too.) To promote endurance, if a leak is detected in a balloon and it has to be emptied, backup balloons could be kept uninflated on the same nozzle assembly, and then filled with the ship's gas supply if it has one.

I see aerogels and carbon composites being the main materials of choice.

>>128335
Okay.

Knowing which hardiness zone you're in may help with plants, though I suspect you'll need to put a fair effort into protecting your plants from salt.
It doesn't actually take too much space to grow enough food to feed someone (or 14 someones), if you're in a decent planty climate (and south america is kinda well known for jungle, so I'm guessing you'll be fine) and willing to put a lot of effort into micromanaging a wide variety of plants. Keeping chickens is a definite yes, and depending on the size of the island you end up with, pigs may be a good idea too.

You may also think about raising crabs (I don't think you'll have the scale for fish farming, but you can do crabs even in a bathtub).

>>128371
>>128360
Lighter than air travel just sucks. Try to steer a hot air balloon. Now imagine it HUGE AND EXPLOSIVE.

>>128698

You can make balloons aerodynamic, though. Hot air balloons are hard to control because of their shape and (usually) lack of propellers and control surfaces, not because of their buoyancy.

I bought 2.5kw solar panels for my house. They produce more electricity than I consume.

I would recommend looking up the Venus project. They have a lot of great ideas on ocean cities..

>>128298
>>128760
If you got the time solar cells can be created at home for less than $1 per watt. For inverters you can get a shit ton of super cheap ones from china and rig them up in series. As for batteries I hear nickel iron batteries can last 50 years or so and don't get damaged from over/under charging. They cost more but they literally last a lifetime. I plan on using those for my system when I go off the powergrid.

>OP wants advice for building a boat(s) for 9 people.

>US$1Bil custom built cruise ship
>high tech experiment earthquake proofing
>location of atlantis
>DIY exploding cats in space
>colonise mars
>zeppelins

>>129542

We already deemed the OP's goals as fantastical.

We were never in the realm of practical things.

1. Toss garbage in ocean
2. All garbage in ocean coalesces into one point
3. man made island, just for you
4. ???????
5. Profit

>>129572
DIY exploding cats in space is easily done.


OPs goal doesn't seem as mad as people first thought, I'm just suspicious of the idea that those bottle islands can be on the sea and survive the weather.

Are you thinking of something in the line of the movie Waterworld?
This sounds fucking awesome.

ARE YOU GUYS AWARE
THAT MASSIVE BOATS ARE =SOOO= INEXPENSIVE CONTRARY TO WHAT YOU WOULD THINK?!!?

http://www.maritimesales.com/

I ALWAYS ASSUMED MASSIVE BOATS COST TENS OF MILLIONS AND MILLIONS OF DOLLARS, BECAUSE THEY ARE THE SIZE OF GODANM HIGHRISES BUT OH, THEY'RE FUCKING VEHICLES.

=BUT NO= YOU COULD GET A FREIGHTER THE SIZE OF YOUR =NEIGHBORHOOD= FOR A FEW HUNDRED THOUSAND, THIS IS REALLY BLOWING MY MIND

>>129747
There is a BIG difference between a boat built for staying/living on, and a clapped out trawler.

>>129758
http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/oil-tanker-ship-sale.html

http://www.shipseller.net/listings.php?category=23

>buy old oil tanker
>do what /diy/ does best and convert it to living and energy needs
>cosplay Waterworld

You could have greenhouses, solar panels, Savonius wind turbines, and all sorts of self living stuff on one.

>>129761
>>what /diy/ does best

You mean what nobody on /diy/ has ever done?

>>129772
>what /diy/ does best

= making things

I think you are projecting and that you've never made anything and therefore think no one else on /diy/ has made anything. I think you are an armchair /diy/er.

>>129773
I think no-one on /diy/ has ever converted an old oil tanker into a cruise ship.


I don't think anyone anywhere has ever converted an old oil tanker into a cruise ship. And there's reasons for this.

>>129758
but don't most of these ships have rooms for crew? I've been trying to find specifics, but there are definitely living areas on all of them.

I've really been getting infatuated in this idea, shipping shit around, hanging with my crew. buying shit to ward off pirates. What a neat life, just owning something that huge, and not paying rent is is the sexiest part of it all.

>OP Here
I suspect you all are thinking I will build a Floating hotel for 10,000 people with a luxury island with golf fields in the middle of the ocean...

>>129779
I never made wind turbines in my life.....until yesterday. I'm quite sure I could convert an oil tanker into a nice self sufficient living space for quite a few people. I mean people turn shipping containers into houses all the time. How hard would it be to convert a cargo/oil ship into a ship to live on?

I mean heck, you can have 6700 TONS of cargo weight on an oil tanker. It can hold a lot of shipping containers too. Some of those can be converted to work, growing, and living spaces.

You have very little imagination and ambition. You don't belong on /diy/.

>>129943
Not I. I envision a ship with enough people to have a small community, while making their own power, and growing/raising their own food.

>>129887
> What a neat life, just owning something that huge, and not paying rent is is the sexiest part of it all.

Lolz. The maintenance & fuel on big boats is a LOT. You can't just buy a trawler and use it as housing...or at least, not non-cripplingly expensive housing.

>>129949
Lots of people make turbines, it's a sensible project. No-one tries to live in an oil tanker. All that space is just space....they don't have decks or anything, it's a foolish project....it would be far far more sensible to buy an old cruise ship and work on restoring/improving it.

>>129943
We get your idea now, I think, just talking amongst ourselves.
Have you thought about how you're gonna protect your vegetable garden/farm from the saltyness?

>>129949
>How hard would it be to convert a cargo/oil ship into a ship to live on?

Jeremy Clarkson detected.

>>129761
>what /diy/ does best
small, cheap projects?

>>129968
Jesus, what the fuck? LOL Have you ever built a house before? I have. More than one. Guess what? People can build a lot of shit. Obviously, you are not up to snuff to be a /diy/er at all.

>>129985
>People can build a lot of shit
No shit sherlock.

>I have. More than one

Given your idiocy, I'm skeptical of that claim.

To convert an oil tanker to something akin to a cruise ship you'd need to, among other things, change the shape of the hull & fit decks. By a long long way, the simplest & cheapest way to do this would be to replace the hull: ie, buy a whole new ship.

>>130001
> change the shape of the hull

Full retard.

I bet you guys also think you couldn't turn an oil tanker into a hospital ship,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USNS_Mercy_%28T-AH-19%29

Or into an oil refinery like most oil tankers get converted into,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Floating_production_storage_and_offloading_unit

Also, buy a oil tanker and commission Merima to refit it for you.

>convert an oil tanker

Alternativly if you wanted to live indipendently AND make profits. You could do something like mentioned by
>>128195
You use algae to create biofuels. Fill up your tanker. Once it's full sell your load of ethenol for huge profits.

A better idea would be for you and your fellows to buy cruising sailboats and anchor off somewhere. That way you all have your freedom.
With a little searching, you can find older blue water capable hulls in good condition for little or no money. Usually they are a bit rough inside and may need rigging, but that's where the diy comes in.

does sage work in diy?

>>130017
Tankers are flat bottomed.

Just google it you fuckwit.

This thread has gone downhill.

One option not mentioned in this thread is building and island from the seabed up. (I'll admit pylons or even achors would be easier) I'm sure it's possible if a shallow ground can be found. I mean they do it in Florida all the time. Been looking in Google Earth for just that spot. Seewarte Seamount has a smallish area (about 40 acres) where the ocean floor is only 80 feet from the surface. It's in international waters and rarely sees any hurricanes. (see map for hurricane history)

>>130075
Yeah good luck with placing 80 feet long concrete pillars in the middle of nowhere

>>130064
>implying you need to change the hull in order to build in it.

lrn2ship

>OP Here again

Finally, some people with sense, I though most dudes were though I would build some crazy city on international sea, defend my self from pirates using homemade machine guns and them colonize space.

>>129949

>Not I. I envision a ship with enough people to have a small community, while making their own power, and growing/raising their own food.
THAT is more or less what I want. The idea is live cheap, make my own power and grow our own food.

I know this thread have potential guys. Keep going, please, you gave me some good advice.

I am thinking of instead of pet bottles, make a bigger island, with ferro cement/concrete like you suggested and anchor it. Since the little artificial island will stay at one place, I think it is a good idea. For the boats, I think a 3 hull boat would be good for sealing and still have a nice space to live and put other things and stay more stable, instead of 2 hulls. What you guys think?

pic kinda related.

>>130191
You probably want to do a little more research on the appropriate boats for your project. Most blue water cruising boats are monohulls for a variety of reasons ranging from seaworthiness to usable interior space.

>>130221
they're monohulls because it's cheaper and easier to build

same reason most boats are made from fiberglass and not aluminum

>>130243
There are a lot of functional reasons why most serious blue water sailors recommend monohulls over multihulls in addition to the cost.

>>130245
name them

>>130249
I'll just make the same recommendation to you that I made to OP: Do some research before deciding what type of boat to buy.
That's what I did. I am considering buying a boat to live aboard and to do some traveling when I save up some money. I started out wanting a multihull, but after researching it concluded that a monohull was the most practical design for a live aboard and a blue water cruising boat.

>>130254
Can you provide me some start? I would appreciate some advice of what exactly to search.

I want to see the reasons why monohull is the main choice, maybe a can work around it...

Thank you in advance

>>130129
You can go away now.
>>130788
>>130254
>but after researching it concluded that a monohull was the most practical design for a live aboard and a blue water cruising boat.

I suspect that may not be true in this case.
It depends what OP & pals want from the boats...probably not much 'cruising' at least.

With the 'islands' (which've been upgraded from plastic bottle to anchored cement, so this thread has actually been an improving one afterall), providing space, perhaps boats are going to be nothing more than a bed & transport for short(?) trips to port...in which case mebe a cheap trimaran'd be better....the surface area kinda fits with what I'm picturing for this project...and assuming the electronics are gonna be on boat, that's where you'd put the solar panels?

Then again, mebe I just can't stop imagining a waterworld without Costner.


Depends what role OPs guys want the boats to play.

>With the 'islands' (which've been upgraded from plastic bottle to anchored cement, so this thread has actually been an improving one afterall), providing space, perhaps boats are going to be nothing more than a bed & transport for short(?) trips to port...in which case mebe a cheap trimaran'd be better....the surface area kinda fits with what I'm picturing for this project...and assuming the electronics are gonna be on boat, that's where you'd put the solar panels?

Just like this bro.

3 hulls look more stable, racing boats have 3 hulls for a reason... Anyone with another idea for hulls?

With as much as this is developing you may as well find an atoll in international waters and use it as your foundation. Obviously it won't be portable, but it is a valid idea.

>>130853
>atoll in international waters

No point, it'd be away from shelter and usefullyness of land, and no less dependant on government. As soon as you connect to an atoll/whatever, it stops being international waters.

>>130853
>With as much as this is developing you may as well find an atoll in international waters and use it as your foundation. Obviously it won't be portable, but it is a valid idea.

Yea, always wanted my own country without copyright laws.

>>131133
move to sweeden