And then they hire Steve Blum to voice the male lead.

and they turn my mature anime into funimated ones

>the original creators of the work get paid as well

No.

>>34985182

I can't remember the last time they changed the source material.

>>34985183
they do. its not like they'd give out licenses for free.
anyway, I dont exactly hate it; sometimes the subbing is just pretty bad, and that is not something I'd like to pay for. I will not say anything about dubs, I simply dont care about them but I cant say someone is wrong for wanting them or anything.

Kaibe is still not licensed

>>34985219
seto no hanayome seems to be pretty bad and recent
translating "chivalry" to "honor among thieves"..is just ridiculous.

>>34985145
>They license shows to bring it stateside

Years late.

>shit subs
>shit dubs
>slow shows

By the time they get shit into the States, I would've already watched it.

Also, not a US citizen, this shit doesn't matter to me.

>>34985226
>I don't know how licensing works

The Japanese company pay the original creator for rights, after that the Japanese company is free to do with it as the company wants.

>dubs
>buying

inb4 shitstorm, same pic last night.

>>34985256

Are there any other recent commercial sub failures I should be aware of?

>>34985264
well, I thought the one you'd like to support would be the Japanese company. they certainly do get money.

>>34985308
But their main market isn't the American market.

They get money off the DVD sales in Japan + various other shit (such as dolls, posters) that otaku buy.

I'm scared at what the english dub will be like for Index and Railgun, personally.

"Such misfortune" is a mouth full. Kuruko's voice alone would be hard to pinpoint with english. Index would be hard as well. And if they bring in fucking Wendi to do Misaka, the clones, and LO, I bust a fucking nut.

>>34985308
>/a/
>support the industry

I think you have a mistake.

>>34985350
>But their main market isn't the American market.
that doesnt make the money they get irrelevant.
>>34985353
feel free to read the thread

>>34985351

You are imagining English dubbed Haruhi voice as Misaka.

>>34985400
How about you? Not a single mention of anyone wishing to purchase.

>>34985400
I'm pointing out that they can survive fine with out it.

>>34985422
yet there was discussiona bout the money going/not going to the "original creator" / "Japanese company x".

>>34985419

I fucking hate you

obligatory

>>34985455
But you see, newfriend, /a/ simply doesn't support the industry.

The more you know as you lurk more.

i would support it if they didn't dub everything and just subtitled it properly. too much localization and giant yellow subs is crap.

>>34985455
That's a counterargument to OP, retard.

>>34985487
....yeah?
>>34985480
room/collection threads

If the anime industry died tomorrow, I would still have more than enough on my backlog to keep me busy until my attention wanders elsewhere.

>>34985532
Lose anime being "mainstream" in America?

Yes, oh god, yes.

>>34985546

But then you wouldn't get any new series once you watched them all.

>>34985532

Even if they stooped, its too late. Too many faggots roaming around getting their faggot friends into animu.

all licensors and localisators should just die

>>34985579
Well, there's still the game industry.

>>34985522
>facepalm.jpg

The more you lurk, the more you learn.

I buy R2 and BlueRei anime. Expensive but worth it.

>They license shows to bring it stateside
>They create newfags on /a/
>Hey /a/, why do you hate the American anime industry?

>>34985583
>Too many faggots roaming around getting their faggot friends into animu
This by far and away. I honestly hate the American anime fanbase. Shounen up the ass. Not just any shounen, no. Linear shounen with no depth. Every person I've met throughout highschool and college has been this way and the most complicated they can get is Death Note, and even then they might not have the attention span to go through the 37 episodes.

gtfo funi devs

>Implying I'm American.

>>34985430
That's a pretty poor justification for not buying considering the state of the anime industry today. Maybe if the Japanese publishers were receiving more revenue via whatever means, the studios wouldn't be in such dire straits. The main case for this that can be made would be Big O S2 where US interests were so high on CN, they co-produced S2.

Don't like subs for a particular series? I can understand that as it can be pretty disconcerting when you are used to seeing something different. Not all anime is like that and the anime and manga industry itself is/was filled with actual oldfags these days (before they kicked the bucket for the most part.) If you don't want to buy anime period because you don't think it's a worthwhile hobby or don't have any money to waste on luxury hobbies that should be shown on television normally, that's perfectly fine too. Just to don't try to make lackluster excuses and arguments.

There was a thread like this yesterday only it was about some guy proposing that /co/ and /a/ be fused because "they're both cartoons and comics", so I'll copypaste some of what I said before. Whatever I say about the /co/ people, pretend it's casual anime watching newfriends.


>Is Haruhi not a good enough show to stand on its own, in the realm of actual television
It is, however the /aco/ fusion board would probably be filled with mainstream, linear shounen that only people that watch Adult Swim or people new to anime would talk about. The more obscure (To the masses anyway), old or even newer anime airing in Japan right now would be outnumbered by the sheer amount of mainstream stuff that really no one here cares about.


I then spoke more about casuals:
Except that for at least a year there will be a ton of recommendation threads, Adult Swim threads, big 3 threads and other stuff -we don't want.- Talking about them isn't bad, but if you were to get people new to anime, we'd have over 8 pages of this stuff for about a year. Even then, because 4chan is mainstream thanks to the shithole known as /b/, maybe if we're lucky it would reduce to 2 or 3 pages.


Talking about exactly what this thread is about:
>Unless you have a friend who directly hands you things it's basically impossible to get into, due to different boards and different websites and different standards
I'm not the majority but I got myself into it just fine. It's also exactly -because- of the those different boards and websites that anime is portrayed the way it is over here. The average American anime viewer I can assume, and correct me if I'm wrong, will watch anime for fights and mild story. If the anime is too long or the story gets too deep they will drop it. Acquaintances I know that I casually talk to about anime fit the bill dead on for this. The most complex thing they can get into is Death Note.


Anyone have anything to say about this post?

>>34985226
Whether you wanted to or not, when you buy a set with a dub you're paying for the voice actors. That's half the reason buying series is so expensive.

All I really want is to be able to turn on my TV and watch an episode subbed within a week of it airing in Japan.

Don't bother me until then.

>>34985262
dont forget censorship up the ass to appease to the christian groups and other feminist groups

>>34985879
are feminazis lobbying against anime now? more proof that they should spend their time doing other things, like cleaning, and making me a sandwich

>>34985731
>Don't like subs for a particular series? I can understand that as it can be pretty disconcerting when you are used to seeing something different.
I'm not the anon you quoted. This is one of the main reason I hate licensing. The translations. They're terrible. It's a script rewrite rather than a direct translation. I hate it even more when they include Japanese audio but the only available subtitles are DUBTITLES. This is why I stopped buying anime at 12.

There's also the fact they FUCKING CHANGE THE CHARACTER'S PERSONALITY.
I saw Death Note subbed. Ryuk had an easygoing, always comical voice and personality in the Japanese version. Not in the English version, no. The voice actor they gave him made him try to sound more sinister at all times, even at points he was happy in the Japanese version. They also did the same with Light. Instead of sounding sinister in his thoughts, it's all the fucking time. Anyone could tell he was up to no good after hearing his English voice.

The majority of what gets over here is action-packed shounen and light comedies like Ouran and Love Hina. We may get some better things, however most of the time we don't. This is another reason I hate the American fanbase. They dismiss anime as kiddie shit even though in Japan different shows are aimed for different ages. There are shows aimed for people above 20 that have complex plots. Do we get them? No.

>>34985806 here
Found another thing that might be worth mentioning. Guy was calling me an elitist asshole even though all I did was Bring up a few points.

>If there's anyone who is an uncivilized jackass it's you for putting yourself on a higher level than other human beings
Look, I'm trying to have a discussion with you. No need to resort to namecalling. Reread my post. I said the -average- American anime viewer. It's a given those at /a/ will have heard of others, but the majority of Americans haven't. Keep in mind I'm just giving a generalization. Can you honestly go up to an anime fan at your school or work and expect them to have heard of nearly ANYTHING mentioned on /a/? It would be rare.

>>34985806
Sure, tl;dr.

A board join with /a/ and /co/ would be dumb for many reasons. /co/ has long threads with comic dumps with several issues for story time and they can last long enough for people to actually read it via 4chan without being constantly bumped. /a/ simply moves at too much of a rapid rate. This is also a main argument involved with splitting off manga - not because of content but rather to slow thread creation and posting. If "Big 3" threads weren't spammed on the days that they came out, it'd be an improvement.

Honestly, if your goal is try to introduce new people into anime, 4chan is probably not the best way to go about it. If a person is interesting in a different category, they should be able to search via google to see if anything interests them.

>>34985879
There hasn't been that much censorship especially during anime boom era outside of the 4kids stuff which was mostly shounen. Some old stuff was censored like Sailor Moon but that was also applicable to above.

>This is one of the main reason I hate licensing. The translations. They're terrible. It's a script rewrite rather than a direct translation. I hate it even more when they include Japanese audio but the only available subtitles are DUBTITLES. This is why I stopped buying anime at 12.

Dubtitles and "rewrites" aren't particularly common in modern licenses, AFAIK.

because fuck dubtitles and every company that does them.

Hey anonymous, why do you want me to hate Index?

Seriously, stop using her for posts related to this. I already don't particularly care for her, and associating her with these threads is not helping. Also its pointless, because To Aru * will never be brought stateside anyway

>>34985303
Hidamari Sketch got it pretty bad, it seems like it was farmed out to a 5th string team who communicated over the phone and worked only with the audio stream with no video (pic super fucking related).

Granted, I know that Hidamari is niche even within its niche, and there is no way they could've expected it to sell much and it's amazing it was brought over at all, but there's really no excuse for shit like this.

Other than this and random translation and typographical errors, there's also a part where a whole line was just missed, so the next few lines got brought forward one and were spoken by the wrong character. It seems like references to Sae's masculinity (mostly by Miyako) were toned down (for example the "newhalf/newquarter" bit was rendered as "you like to crossdress/you sometimes like to crossdress" which is fucking lame).

Not to mention the fact that they used the broadcast rather than DVD footage for episodes 1, 5, and 6.

I don't have a problem with R1 anime. Dubs can be as shitty as they want; they're mostly irrelevant to my viewing. Subs vary depending on the company(FUNimation's are a shit-ton better than Bang Zoom!'s, for instance) and since FUNimation are the ones licensing almost everything, it's awwwwwright.

Now, R1 manga? Fuck that censored, uncomprehensibly adapted shit. It's more or less the same as really bad scanlators, except you paid for it. Ugh.

>>34985264
>implying studios give out shows for free
MIPTV, you ignoramus.

>>34986530
>Now, R1 manga? Fuck that censored, uncomprehensibly adapted shit. It's more or less the same as really bad scanlators, except you paid for it. Ugh.
What the hell series are you reading that get that treatment? Pokemon Adventures? (not saying this condescendingly towards the series, it's just the only example with actual censhorship I can pull off the top fo my head)

I buy manga regularly and genuinely can't remember the last time I actually saw something censored.

>>34986632

It's old, but here's an example of some manga censorship in the licensed English version. http://eyevocal.ottawa-anime.org/aihatecensors/index2.html

>>34986530
Most manga aren't censored and translators that are bad are normally dropped after fan complaints these days. Both the anime and manga industry have come a long way from the past. Yes, some of them are equal to bad fan translations because English manga publishers pretty much pulled talent from the scanslations industry including translators. I knew of a few, for example, who worked for Tokyopop and the like.

Most of the people working solely for a publishing company (and may not have ties to manga/scanslations outside of working for said company) were pretty cool too for the lack of a better word when they came around to chat with people on IRC. That feels like such a long time ago though and I can't help but feel that hostility has unnaturally grown for whatever reasons.

>>34986729
>old
Exactly my point.
That shit barely goes on anymore. Same for anime. Whenever somebody says they don't buy licensed anime because it's all censored they immediately demonstrate the invalidity of any view they might have on the matter, because it's outdated.

Censorship still happens, but it's the exception now, not the norm.

>>34986632
>I buy manga regularly and genuinely can't remember the last time I actually saw something censored.
Easiest instances to point out is when the original cover art is censored and/or modified. For example, compare the US and Japanese covers for Negima vol 16 and 23.

>>34985731
>That's a pretty poor justification for not buying considering the state of the anime industry today. Maybe if the Japanese publishers were receiving more revenue via whatever means, the studios wouldn't be in such dire straits. The main case for this that can be made would be Big O S2 where US interests were so high on CN, they co-produced S2.
Hey, guess what just came and by? The recession. (no help there, America.) Anime/Manga has been, is, and will be for a small demographic of any country. To ludicrously license everything left right and centre (Viz, was it?) is partly why the American anime companies are dying. And again, I'd like to reiterate that I support these American companies going belly-up.

What of in the glorious country of NIPPON? They have a self-sustainable model; where good companies grow and improve and bad ones die off.

>>34986632
>What the hell series are you reading that get that treatment? Pokemon Adventures?
I read the scanlations as far as they went (Gold arc). What was edited in the official translations?

>>34986994
Okay, but that's only one series, with two instances of censorship, and only on the covers, did they change anything inside the volumes? (I'm aware of censorship within earlier volumes, but that's stopped so isn't really valid)

Remember, I didn't say censorship didn't exist, just that it is pretty rare these days.

>>34987089
Pokeball boobs removed, replaced with her confusing them with some stupid tagline or something. I don't know, I don't remember, just that it made no fucking sense.

>>34986632
>I buy manga regularly and genuinely can't remember the last time I actually saw something censored.
I'm not surprised. If you buy it rather than read a scanlation you don't even know what is censored or not because you're not given a comparison.

>>34986888
>Tokyopop
You mean the Tokyopop that adds shitty jokes that weren't there to begin with and further rewrites the script?

>>34987024
It would help if you read the entire post before criticizing specific points in order to make yourself feel better. If you want licensing companies to kick the bucket, that's great. I don't see what logical reason there is to do so however when they have only shown mostly improvements over time. There are a few things they need to still work out, but it's not as if there is no market in English speaking communities or sites like this wouldn't exist in the first place. Some of these so called "English" companies were direct extensions of Japanese ones.

Sustainable? No, if it was sustainable, then we would still have diversity and other things. It hasn't been sustainable so they have moved to what sells while others having trouble. You can argue that this is how capitalism works which is true. I believe video games also underwent a similar period of transition but perhaps for different reasons.

/a/ doesn't appreciate anime enough to actually pay for it.

>>34987178
I like how you claim to know all of my reading habits outside of what I've stated.

Even with the series that I'm buying without having read them as scanlations first, it's pretty obvious that they haven't censored anything (otherwise Goku's penis wouldn't be clearly visible in Dragonball, nor Natsumi's underwear in Sgt. Frog).

>>34987178
Again, that's not for every series. Not every series received the Battle Vixen treatment. You would know if you actually tried them out perhaps?

I used to buy tons of dvds. But I gradually got sick of how expensive it became and how they liked to milk that 8th dvd of a series with 3-4-2-3-etc episode counts.

>>34987299
Alright. Fair enough. What about scripts? When I'm reading an official English manga and I know there's something wrong I get a bit annoyed.

>>34987327
I haven't read Battle Vixens. I dropped Tokyopop a couple years back after GTO and a few others I can't remember.

Not going to pay for English audio track I don't want.
I'd rather import.

BECAUSE THEY INCLUDE EXTRAS LIKE AN ENGLISH DUB

THAT MAKES ME SO FUCKING ANGRY

>>34985351
Stop here, struck with terror.

>>34987588
You probably don't import very much. If you do, that's pretty stupid for most cases as you are better off buying cheaper English dvd boxsets on sale (maybe with less extras though) and turning to Japanese audio with no subs on.

My Face when i heard Animax dubs were not the same as american dubs.

No one talks about the animax dubs - http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/answerman/2010-05-15

we in asia don't get your FUNi subtitles, crunchyroll's limited, no HULU.

we have no other legal alternatives than Eyeshield 21 and naruto shippuden on CR and animax dubs on cable.

Tell me what to do?

>>34987773
American proxy and torrents.

>>34987844

proxy can. torrents cannot. i'm in singapore :(

>>34985579
Damn boy.. You have 4 dollars? That's gangsta

Here's what it comes down to. I don't want to pay for an English version because of what they do to it.

They might mess up the script through localization or "polish" it to make it more appealing. If they don't fuck that up, the voices might not match the character. If they do, the voices only match the character's look without giving regard to their age or -personality- (Very evident in FMA. Ed is 12). If they don't fuck that up, voices are usually bland. If they're not bland, congratulations. They have produced a decent dub that only comes along once every 100 anime.

>>34987773
That link is priceless. They're talking about why DVDs of English licensed anime doesn't sell well.

>Fansubs are free, DVDs aren't. Haruhi sold well on DVD; it truly did. How well? I don't know, and the only people who do know for certain are still working at Bandai, and they would very quickly no longer work at Bandai if they were to leak that information.

>Fansubs are free, DVDs aren't.
Ignoring all the shit they do in terms of voices and characters, "polished" translations they attempt, they blow it off and say "FANSUBS ARE FREE LOL". This is yet another reason I don't support these morons.

>>34988071 here
Forgot to mention. When an anime gets licensed, the fansubs usually stop depending on the company. I want a damn translation, not a rewrite. I won't even pirate the DVDs.

>>34987903
enjoy your police state

>>34987618
Don't worry... Index and Railgun haven't been licensed yet... and neither has K-On! for some strange reason. One would think those would be slam-dunks for licensing.

Anyway, one of the worst mistranslations in recent memory was in the Love Hina manga. Anyone who has watched or read it subbed/scanslated will know that Keitaro always refers to Naru by her last name. Well, TokyoPop dropped all the honorifics and had everyone call each other by their first names. Ruined a fair number of jokes including the final joke in the manga. Very sad.

Found this image at http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/answerman/2010-05-15

How about try licensing more unique manga instead of the same bullshit you've been licensing for years? There are a lot of good manga that aren't your generic shounen fightan or extra generic comedy like Love Hina or Ouran. Get some that aren't being scanlated but look enjoyable and i might consider buying them (What a concept).

>>34988388
>When an anime gets licensed, the fansubs usually stop depending on the company
No they don't. At most the fansub group X "stops" subbing the show and "out of nowhere" a new group Y starts subbing the show with the exact same fonts, opening lyrics and whatnot.

>>34988473
>How about try licensing more unique manga instead of the same bullshit you've been licensing for years? There are a lot of good manga that aren't your generic shounen fightan or extra generic comedy like Love Hina or Ouran. Get some that aren't being scanlated but look enjoyable and i might consider buying them (What a concept).

See Viz's SigIkki project. Hell, they post translated chapters online for free.

>>34988433
>Don't worry... Index and Railgun haven't been licensed yet... and neither has K-On! for some strange reason. One would think those would be slam-dunks for licensing.
I don't think America would have the same reaction as Japan towards anything moe, especially stuff like K-On. If anything we'd get angry moms and hardcore bible thumpers for stuff like Railgun (Kuroko swimsuit anyone?).

>Anyone who has watched or read it subbed/scanslated will know that Keitaro always refers to Naru by her last name. Well, TokyoPop dropped all the honorifics and had everyone call each other by their first names. Ruined a fair number of jokes including the final joke in the manga. Very sad.
Well shit. And that's why I stay away from Tokyopop even if there aren't scanlations.

>>34987355
Almost every show just gets a box set nowadays.

>>34988433
>One would think those would be slam-dunks for licensing.
Moe doesn't really sell well in America because the fans prefer pirating them. The licencing fees must be fucking huge, too, since Japan doesn't really understand the American market.

>>34988481
I rarely see this happen, however I'm aware it sometimes does. What really annoys me, though, is what you said -never- happens for manga.

>>34988527
Sounds pretty interesting. This might be a good idea. How are the translations compared to scanlations if there are any?

I hate it because they seem to operate on the mistaken impression that ANYONE buys a TV show before watching it. Ever. And because of this they push their BUY DVDS NOW without really going to the effort give us a high quality free version on TV with ads first. They get the most popular shows on Hulu in lower quality than popular shows, and Funimation streams in very low quality, but that's just not enough. I can watch House in HD the day it comes out and then buy the DVDs months later if I feel like it. Why should I have to watch Fullmetal Alchemist Brotherhood in my firefox window as if it were a youtube screen, covered in pixels and other bullshit?

>>34988473
License To Love Ru and they would have an easy 14 volumes sold to me and many others. But I guess Shounen Jump doesn't want their lineup to be Pirates, Ninjas, Death Gods and then Naked Aliens.

>>34988559
After the smashing success of series like Shana I would think another show by the same studio would be a no brainer. Same deal goes for K-On when you consider how well Haruhi sold and how they went back and re-released Clannad with a dub after the sub only version did so well.

>>34988433
America is filled with closet homos who can't watch little girls do things because they think it might be gay. They're repressed like that. one nipple slip or sexy in game action and they're in a panic.

>>34988669
>Why should I have to watch Fullmetal Alchemist Brotherhood in my firefox window as if it were a youtube screen, covered in pixels and other bullshit?
Because very few American channels actually offer anime, and most of the ones that do have their timeslots filled. It isn't like Japan where a fuckton of channels get anime all the time.

Japan's anime airtimes are the equivalent of our cartoons' airtime.

>>34988660
Viz usually has decent to good translations. I dunno, I guess you could compare the scanlations of Bokurano or Doredohedoro (sp?) which are the only two series in the project which are scanlated.

Many of them are too weird for scanlations. Tokyo Flow Chart is amazingly bizarre, for instance.

>>34988669
>>34988669
>>34988669
>>34988669
This. Do they realize that not everyone lives in japan and not everyone gets all these shows on public access TV for free there?

every country has its own advertisements and stuff and we pay our TV licenses. that's how shit stays cheap on TV - but most of it is not watchable or we don't like the shows in our country.

:/

>>34988473
What they should do is get license to translate and sell poplar magazines stateside, in simultaneous releases. They should also be faster in releasing volumes. I find it completely unacceptable that in the 21st century, a graphic novel could be SEVERAL volumes behind the Japanese version in translation.

>>34988679
>But I guess Shounen Jump doesn't want their lineup to be Pirates, Ninjas, Death Gods and then Naked Aliens.
Hell, Shounen Jump in Japan offers a lot more. I think if they made it a weekly or even a twice a month issue -with all the shit that's in the weekly and monthly Japan issues- there wouldn't be much of a problem in terms of manga.

Shounen Jump, as far as I know, is pretty decent when it comes to translations. Honorifics and calling by last name are sometimes dropped (Which sometimes gets in the way like the Love Hina guy said) but other than that it's pretty okay. I really wouldn't mind if they got a few more series.

>>34988765
>Many of them are too weird for scanlations
I'm sorry, but could you elaborate on that? Are you saying the language and dialogue (Kanji jokes, wordplay, etc) used are too weird to attempt or that the story and content are too weird?

>>34988716
1000 times this. Also soccermoms and biblethumpers.

i hate the american anime industry because i hate anime in general, i only watch it because it's free

in 98 replies to a lame troll thread OP, I'm certain this has been said. But I'll say it again.

I don't mind rewarding the original producers since it'd prompt them to make more of what I like, but reward some international media company for insulting my American face with their halfbaked asinine dub (and/or partial Macek-job or rewrite?)

Never.

Total boycott.

>>34988856
I fully agree with you, especially since scanlators are getting them out within 24 hours of Japanese release.

>>34988473
>Image: Do we simply shut these sites down?
Yes, by all means. Go ahead and kill the manga industry further. Honestly, if a series has been going for a year, no one is gonna wait another year for your ass to publish an English version. They're killing the god damn series for anyone that wants it. They will ALWAYS been at least a volume or two behind and the translations might be off. They're alienating the fans more than supporting them. You do not fucking do this. If people like the series, they'll buy it even after reading scanlations. Hell, I did because Shounen Jump is actually okay with translations.

>>34988997
0/10

Nowadays, I've noticed that standards have really risen in (manga, I don't buy anime) translations. The whole rewriting thing doesn't really happen anymore except for manga obviously meant for kids; which I'm not interested in buying. In fact, a lot of the time in the last couple of years, I'd say the official translations make a lot more sense than fan ones which are usually (not always) amateurish, only barely QC'd, or both.

>>34989443
>I'd say the official translations make a lot more sense than fan ones which are usually (not always) amateurish,
Could you elaborate on that? The vast majority of scanlations I've seen are great. The only thing wrong might be cleaning or image quality, but I easily get past that because the translations are nice. If there's a language joke, it even explains it unlike official translations who change it into something new.

>Nowadays, I've noticed that standards have really risen in (manga, I don't buy anime) translations. The whole rewriting thing doesn't really happen anymore except for manga obviously meant for kids
I'm interested now. What company does this? I'd like to be able to respect at least one.

>"polished" translations

>I want a damn translation, not a rewrite.

>partial Macek-job or rewrite

Seriously, guys, I don't think Macekre rewrites are that common in today's licensing business. Wouldn't it make more sense to rally against plain bad/lazy translations instead?

>>34990192
don't stealth-reply, shill

>>34989693
DelRay does an AMAZING job with translating manga. They properly use honorifics and typically have 2-8 pages of translator notes in the back of the volume explaining any cultural references or other things your average reader wouldn't pick up on. And aside from the aforementioned censorship of a couple Negima covers, they don't censor anything (and that's just to allow it to be sold in stores, you can't blame them for that, really)

>>34990192
>dvd
Dat font.

>Wouldn't it make more sense to rally against plain bad/lazy translations instead?
Yes it would, however most groups do a good job. Because they aren't looking for money out of this, they actually put in effort to make it great. I'm not saying all companies don't put in an effort, but there really seems to be a difference between them. For some reason American companies like to translate and phrase it will the stereotypical villain lines or words from western scripts. Fansubs handle this a lot better by translating it the way they're actually saying it. Maybe I'm just picky, but I don't care for it. I like the bottom sub in that screenshot best.

>>34985145
>why do you hate America?

>>34990359
God damn. This is the shit I'm looking for. This is what everyone should be doing. I'll check them out then. Thanks.

>>34990440
GTFO kimmo

>>34990359
And to give credit where credit is due, they actually included a color page of volume 16's unaltered art just inside the cover. Volume 23 was not as lucky but you did get it in normal b/w screen-tone a few pages in.

>>34990490
Well then. I like color. Out of curiosity, how's the page size? Is it still tiny as hell compared to fullsize pages?

>Yes it would, however most groups do a good job.

I was talking about bad official subs, such as Hidamari and Seto no Hanayome, which have been mentioned in this thread.

You're right that many fansubs groups do a really good job, but fansubs also have many severe problems that are almost omnipresent, such karaoke and on-screen TL notes.

>>34990705
>such karaoke and on-screen TL notes.
Out of curiosity, is it that much of a bother? Takes up maybe 1/12 of the screen lengthwise. I'd also like to know what the joke or whatever they feel needed a note now then rather than looking it up later. If I miss it the first time I can't appreciate it. It'll just be an "Oh, so that's what it meant" moment.

>>34990705
>Yellow subs
Nostalgia bomb.

>>34990672
American manga releases are actually larger than the Japanese... and that insert was the same size as the cover. It was just a glossy page right behind the cover.

>>34990829
Seriously? Manga here is 7.5x5 inches. How small are Japanese volumes? Is it just the weekly/monthly that are huge?

>>34990490
I just checked vol 16 and damn, I never even noticed they did that.
Yeah Del rey has done a pretty good job with Negima

>>34988767
you know that's bullshit though
fansubbers don't stick to only what's free on TV
there's fansubs of OVAs, movies, pay-per-view, AT-X paid subscriptions, and as soon as the DVD/BD release comes out everybody drops the TV version and switches to that, and includes all the extras

You guys want for free what Japanese are expected to pay for, so stop bullshitting about that and just admit it

>>34988577
The last show I bought was Stellvia and the slimpack tincan thing. They never came out with box sets until a year after the dvd set was complete, thus charging full price for the whole thing. Even if you went DVD pacific or some shit it was still pricey. By the time they started the slimpack boxset thing I had broadband and never looked back.

>>34990973
japanese manga are about 1cm shorter and the pages dont run all the way to the spine
you can read the whole page clearly, and without having to flatten it open and damage the spine

>>34989147
mad, buyfag?

>>34990999

You upset?

>>34990999
>You guys want for free what Japanese are expected to pay for, so stop bullshitting about that and just admit it
No, we want a good job done. We might pay for it if the official quality was even close to being on-par with fansubs. If even groups with little experience can do better than large companies, I think that's pretty damn sad.

I'm indifferent to foreign localization industries.
I just buy BDs from Amazon Japan.

>>34990359

The fuck? They had rewrites for the first few volumes, followed by erratic translation quality before evening out around volume 20.

Also, why the hell shouldn't we "blame them"? This was after stating that there would be no edits. That's the kind of shit they just won't learn from.

They can cry about "DA CULTURAL DIFFERENCES" straight to the grave. Officially translated manga is becoming less and less relevant. Needlessly editing shit, any shit, is not helping.

>>34991027
>you can read the whole page clearly, and without having to flatten it open and damage the spine
Jesus fuck that's useful. And here I am trying to scan my official volumes I bought, getting shit quality because I didn't want to kill the spine.

P.S. loli or porn-ey cover art / box art means fewer (non-internet) retail sales, not more.

I don't understand why people IN THE INDUSTRY, who've supposedly studied the demographics involved, cling to such crappy caricatured stereotypes. (Oh wait, no, I do. They're still losing sales, but I do.)

>>34991122

How much do you waste on shipping?

I'm rich and I watch em raw so I don't give a damn and buy them.

>>34991122
HLJ.co.jp
It's been a while since I saw one of those boxes in my room ;_;
That'll end in July with Alter's Yoshika and Sanya.

>>34990973
Comparison for you. Love Hina is the only series I own both japanese and english for so it's what you get. But that is the standard size for both american and japanese manga volumes.

>>34991185
In a thread full of people complaining about edits and censorship you're suggesting cover art should be changed?

yeah that's going to go over well

>Out of curiosity, is it that much of a bother?

It is. It screws up the reading rhythm, breaks immersion and goes against the norm of translator's invisibility. A good rule of thumb is, if there are more than two lines of text on the screen, you're approaching a cognitive bottleneck which may force the viewer to pause the video.

Besides, TL notes are usually a sign of lazy translation, when the translator hasn't bothered to come up with a simple, functionally equivalent line.

Where I live it's cheaper to buy dvd than to pay a shitload of money for bandwith . The choice is clear

I don't care about the American anime industry because I am not american...

>>34991251
Amazon has an interesting shipping system

>>34991270
I think that's the one edit that people will let slide as if you've got loli tits or barely clothed females on your covers it's straight to the porno aisle or you're banned from being sold in stores.

>>34991318
440 yen has got to be for domestic shipping. The shipping fees to the USA is like 3300 yen.

>>34989693
Okay, "usually" was poor word choice. I'd go with "sometimes." This is mostly the case with older manga, because fan-translating standards have risen recently as well (although they do bigger watermarking now sometimes which is the most annoying thing in the history of ever). But if you read the earlier volumes of Berserk, there are a ton of issues to take that you wouldn't find in any officially translated manga (with the exception of rewritten shit).

As for good translations, Yen Press and Del Rey do a good job. Although both companies have blurbs on their products that are among the most retarded things you'll ever read, for some reason.

>>34991318
>Queen's Blade
>Blu-Ray

>>34991280
These days, they only do TL notes to fuck around, though, which is even worse.

>>34991280
>It screws up the reading rhythm, breaks immersion and goes against the norm of translator's invisibility
Would you rather they omit the joke completely or leave it to you to understand it? If you can miss it that's a problem.

>if there are more than two lines of text on the screen, you're approaching a cognitive bottleneck which may force the viewer to pause the video.
That's why you leave the TL up for maybe 2 more characters' dialogue.

>when the translator hasn't bothered to come up with a simple, functionally equivalent line
That would be a rewrite, which is frowned upon. If I wanted a rewrite I'd buy the English release. I want a translation.

What you don't seem to understand is that the nips pay 100$ per month for TV and watch a shitload of ads to watch their show for "free"

>>34991416
>HURRDURR I know nothing about translation

>>34991283
Where I live it's a monthly fee. Where are you? Korea?

>>34991436
Sounds like a more expensive version of cable television in the rest of the world, where we pay for services but still get ads.

>>34991371
Domestic shipping is free.

The reason you get results like >>34991318 is because you can pre-order a bunch of items months in advance and only pay "single shipment" shipping, but Amazon splits up the order and ships each individual item as it comes out at no extra charge, splitting she shipping cost across all the shipments.

>>34991444
>I'll just dismiss what he says instead of answering a valid comment
Don't be so childish. We're having a discussion here.

>>34991449
Probably Australia or some other third world country.

>>34991283
I never understood the people who are always talking about bandwidth. I've never had to concern myself with bandwidth once.

>>34991449
I'd also like to know.

>>34991449
It's a montly fee but with a maximum of 5go +10$ per go up to 100$ . Rural Canada

>>34991505
The problem is that you are spouting nonsense without even taking into account the practices of professional translators, and likely without any knowledge of the structure of the Japanese language.

>>34991568
>the practices of professional translators
Okay. I was talking about a rewrite, which is what professionals (At least in companies) usually do. You even supported that.
>when the translator hasn't bothered to come up with a simple, functionally equivalent line.
>equivalent
What's your Idea of equivalent? I'd like to know.

Your other complaint was pausing the video. What if they kept the note up longer?

>Would you rather they omit the joke completely or leave it to you to understand it?

You seem to be underestimating translators' ability to create functionally equivalent lines. TL notes can be used to explain the original joke further, but they do not belong on the screen.

>That's why you leave the TL up for maybe 2 more characters' dialogue.

Then it would just be an even more flagrant violation of the invisibility norm.

>That would be a rewrite, which is frowned upon.

Creating a functionally equivalent translation =/= rewrite. A "literal" translation without any functional equivalence would be nigh unintelligible gibberish. You should read some Christiane Nord, she has some pretty good examples of this.

156 posts and 23 image replies omitted. Click Reply to view.

Sigh

>>34987773
Fuck. Fuck fuck fuck. I am raging so hard at the Answerfans section.

>>34991735
I'm not a professional translator by any means... but speaking as someone who has done QC work for scanslations before (Sketchbook is the prime example that I'll use) there are often times where it is impossible to re-write a phrase or line of dialogue into english without totally losing the meaning. So you've got to make the painful choice of having TL Notes everywhere or write it into proper english.

The worst is when you've got puns that work perfectly in japanese but for obvious reasons won't in english. Do you translate it and explain the joke in a TL note or do you re-write the joke and hope you did a good job?

>What's your Idea of equivalent? I'd like to know.

The target text achieves the same textual effect as the original. For example, an entertaining text remains entertaining even when it's been translated. An instructive text remains instructive, and so on.

I'm not the durrr-anon, BTW.

>>34991777
Except there's a serious discussion this time. Don't be sad.

>>34991122

Can you speaketh nipponese or do you time the subs yourself?

>the original creators of the work get paid as well through the process

ITT: Lies

>>34991267
i`ve bought hatsukoi gentei manga from japan (also anedoki, love kawashita), and i`m dissapoint with the quality and size of tankobons. reading those small kanji is a pain in the eyes. reading scanlations on my Full HD 24" monitor is much more comfortable. so guess what i do?

>>34991644

>>34991568 here.
You're quoting lines I didn't write. >>34991735 is not me, but explains it well enough. I'll give you an example.

Japanese: chichi wa watashi ni osake o nomasete kureta
Literal translation into English: "Father gave me allowing to drink alcohol."

That is not an acceptable translation, however, and even fansubbers will change it to something like "Father let me to drink alcohol." So there you have re-writing right there and you probably didn't even know it was happening right under your nose.

>Do you translate it and explain the joke in a TL note or do you re-write the joke and hope you did a good job?

Many professionals prefer the combination of functional "duct tape fix" translation, supported by a note in liner notes. Translation is an inherently flawed practice, so there's really no point in worrying over some signal loss.

>>34991976
yeah I know Japanese

I hear on DVDs it's pretty easy to load subtitle files into VLC or whatever but I don't know about BD.

Because

I hate them.

Where I live, they don't air any anime on tv. But still licensed anime gets removed from the internet in an attempt to make me IMPORT the anime.

What a bunch of greedy cuntflaps.

>>34991735
>TL notes can be used to explain the original joke further, but they do not belong on the screen.
Where would you (If you were in charge of a fansub group), put them?

>Then it would just be an even more flagrant violation of the invisibility norm.
Alright.

>Creating a functionally equivalent translation =/= rewrite.
See, but they way you were describing it, it sounded like you were implying they make a new joke but along the same lines as the original.

>>34991929
>Do you translate it and explain the joke in a TL note or do you re-write the joke and hope you did a good job?
I myself would translate the words the best I can, trying to preserve it, and explain what the joke is in a note if it's not very obvious. Something like "This is a play on words. [Word] sounds similar to [Word]"

>>34992061
You're not making sense.
For the line you gave, "Father let me drink alcohol" is the literal translation, not a rewrite.

>>34992161
well the above "tsundora" joke can`t go without TL note
and i`m ok with that
also i rage at how they have translated manga on display in book shop but don`t give original name anywhere on the cover or in the book. how the fuck i`m supposed to know what is this they are even selling? maybe i would even consider buying it, but i don`t really want to buy anything i`ve not even heard of. i live in russia and here we have licensed crappy chinese and korean (as far as i can tell) "manga". maybe they do it to save licensing costs, i dont know. but you wouldn`t buy some lame-ass "internet dating" manga (that`s the name on cover, yeah) from some obscure author you know nothing about, would you?
and we also have Тетрадь Смерти (Death Note), yeah classy, if you want to look cool in school then read this

>>34992357

I heard Russian dubs are god tier, though.

>>34992269
Die

>>34992269
New to the discussion here, and I support *good* TL notes

Some of the best TL notes I've seen in fansubs, especially for historical/cultural references take a few minutes before or after (typically before) the show to explain things. WOrks amazing.

As for play on words, one of the best translation jobs I've seen comes from ARIA, where the fansubbers translated the line literally, then placed romanized Japanese above the words in question. Simple, didn't break the flow of the show, and extremely effective in letting the audience get the joke without having to *explain* it.

>>34992275
>chichi wa watashi ni osake o nomasete kureta
>father TOP I DAT alcohol ACC cause-to-drink gave
>(TOP = topic particle, DAT = dative particle, ACC = accusative particle)

Don't tell me I'm not making sense. If "father let me drink alcohol" is the literal translation, then what happened to the word "gave"? Do you understand that in a "literal translation," you can't just omit the main verb of a sentence?

dont worry Funi OP, I plan to buy a shitton of animu once i get a job
really, a lot of it

>>34992472
But that's just it... when you're translating you're supposed to translate the meaning... not exactly what is being said word for word. If you wanted a translation like that, a machine can do it for you.

>>34992406
yeah they are actually. i`ve encountered some shitty ones a couple of times, but there`s always better alternative from another group in that case, and most of the stuff gets TLed really great. i`ve never seen any of the QUALITY translations like sometimes get posted here (with nonsense TL and long TL notes). also russian is somehow more adequate to translate from japanese, it just manages to pack more sense in shorter lines, while english subs tend to have much longer lines. i watch both languages though, it doesnt matter much to me. i also know a bit of japanese, so that i can check if the subs are actually accurate when choosing them.

Because I don't want to pay extra for dubs, those no talent voice actors don't deserve to be paid.

I would however buy an official sub only version because I like having the nice disc and case

I generally buy things that I like once they come out here. I'm planning on purchasing Eden of the East and a couple of Ghibli movies in the future.

The only time that it annoys me when people say that they won't buy is when they claim that the dvds are overpriced when they're only charging a fourth of what the Japanese companies are. I mean holy hell I can kind of get not wanting to buy something because you don't like the translation but don't dance around the issue and say that it's too expensive because it's not.

You people don't seem to understand that there is quite a bit of re-writing in professional translations, and NEVER any of the half-ass TL notes trying to explain some ridiculous idiom. Here's an excerpt from a professional translation:

Japanese: "Hotto hito iki. Ki ga yurunda sei ka, kuufuku o oboeta S-ko-san, futo, shuutome ga chikaku no koukyuu suupaa de katta to iu donatsu no fukuro ni me ga tommatta."

Literal translation HURR: "In a single breath said, 'ho.' Perhaps the fault of spirit relaxing, Ms. S, who suddenly remembered her hunger, suddenly her eyes stopped on the bag of donuts her mother-in-law said she bought at a nearby high-class supermarket."

Professional translation: "S-ko breathed a sigh of relief. As she relaxed, S-ko felt hungry, and her eyes suddenly came to rest upon the bag of donuts that her mother-in-law had bought at a luxury supermarket nearby.

>why do you hate the American anime industry?
This again, eh? I'll make this quick this time since I say it so often.
1 - blu-ray prices for VHS video quality.
2 - buying US releases supports emotionless English dubs.
3 - the subs aren't as good as fansubber work, which says a lot about how god awful official subs are.

>Where would you (If you were in charge of a fansub group), put them?

There are lots of potential places: the group's website, text screens after the episode proper, an alternate sub track...

>See, but they way you were describing it, it sounded like you were implying they make a new joke but along the same lines as the original.

That's exactly what I meant, actually, but your definition of rewrite is too narrow. Like the anon in >>34992061 demonstrated, "rewrites" of such a small magnitude are present everywhere, probably in pretty much every single line of your favorite fansub. There's no black-and-white dichotomy between "accurate translations" and "rewrites". Instead, there's a continuum with varying degrees of formal accuracy vs. adaptation, and your typical licensed DVD subtitles are located nearer to the accurate end of the spectrum.

>Something like "This is a play on words. [Word] sounds similar to [Word]"

If you do this on-screen, you're then "rewriting" the text function. Yeah, sometimes a translator just can't win.

>>34992703
No that's not it. Fansubbers miss the meaning and try to translate the words too often and that's what we're talking about. Obviously they don't do it with simple idioms like I quoted in >>34992472, but in plenty of other phrases where the "meaning" is less obvious.

No, machines can't do it for you, either. If you've ever tried to Google Translate a Japanese website (clearly you haven't), you'd see that over half of the translated sentences are awkward, horribly worded, or simply make no sense unless you can guess at their original Japanese wording.

>>34992813

holy shit, is this still alive? Might as well have gone "guaranteed replies"

>>34992813
really long TL comments for some obscure cultural references or naming conventions or plot devices and setting or whatever usually go in comments.txt file, short TL notes are better left in sub. TL notes > official "rewrites"

>>34992962
And this is what /a/ thinks makes for an eloquent professional translation which is kind of sad.

>>34993003
for some complex shows like fate stay/night i can get a pretty long comments file, and i`m fine with that. also official translations are shit

>>34993040
Because you're fluent in English and Japanese and would totally know.

>>34993073
and also in my native language, so yes, i would

>>34993003
hey funi dev, WE DONT WANT ELOQUENCE, WE WANT CLARITY OF ORIGINAL MEANING, WHICH OFTEN REQUIRES TL NOTES
maybe if you did stuff we liked instead of trying to get us to like what you do, YOU WOULD HAVE SOME CUSTOMERS

most of the stuff they made, it would too good to call it shit:
Teen Titans
TOTALLY SPIES
Marvin the Martian Hunter
HiHiPuffyAmiYumi
and a sea of more.

The only series that pleased me was:Avatar the Last Airbender. I shit you not, that was a pretty damn good series.

>34993003
Having a short translator's note explaining a wordplay or something is much better than some moron US studio putting some horrible cheesy joke in there instead

or as far as "anime" American animation goes. if you were talking about FUNI etc etc, then I apologise.

>>34993107
Why do you guys think that dub companies would ever bother with this place?

I'm just a normal Anon.

I only like literal translations now because I can understand 30-40% of the Japanese I hear in a show and sometimes the terrible wording in English, though nearly unintelligible to an average native speaker, actually helps me place the words I'm hearing in Japanese.

Index dick check.

>>34993003
how would "professionals" translate something like SZS or Bakemonogatari? no, really? what do you propose? also keep in mind you are limited to DVD and cannot even provide a txt with comments.

now compare this to the fansubs i got and nice comments.txt that even describes the history of tsubasa`s family and other relevant plot points and cultural references

fuck official translations

>>34992797
But that's not a rewrite. Literal may not be the right word, but your example of 'rewrite' is still exactly what the person is saying, just with cleaned up grammar and sentence structure. Rewriting is changing the line to say something different in meaning, typically with the intention of the audience understanding it better.

>>34993202
You don't know what you're talking about.

>>34993182
Not that Anon but SZS is getting a sub only release so I have no idea what they're going to do there.

Bakemonogatari will NEVER. NEVER. be licensed.

I like it when they have a booklet that explains crap. Like Azu Manga Daioh and Haibane Renmei.

>>34985164
Haha, so true. Sooooo true. That poor guy is in nearly every anime that comes stateside. Sure, it may not always been the main character, but he is there; oh, you better believe he is voicing someone (or something).

Though I'm sure he wouldn't complain. He is easily the richest American VA.

>>34993202
exactly. all the examples he came up so far is not a rewrites in any logical sense. example of "rewrite" and localization would be something like how "100 yen" turns into "a couple of bucks", or some other shit

>>34993144
remember back when they kept posting the daily "/a/'s official list of must-buy anime" and the OP pic just HAPPENED to be all the new funi releases? and then the OP would vanish form the thread?
well they obviously realized that was a stupid approach, and lately more of these kinds of threads where they are directly engaging /a/, are popping up daily.
4chan is a fucking pirate cove and people get flack for buying things, so they figure if they can get the fucking HURR GREENTEXTAN pirate faggots to actually quit being so fuckjing cheap and buy some of the shit and support the people who make the shit they claim to love, then they can turn anyone and they might survive the year

>>34993246
>Bakemonogatari will NEVER. NEVER. be licensed.
why? it sold pretty well in Japan

>>34993182
Have you seen the American release of PPD? Every episode has a separate sub track with TL notes explaining nearly everything (they seemed to miss more as the series went on). Sometimes the notes covered the entire screen. It could be enables/disabled independent of the main subs, so you could watch the show clean, then rewatch it with TL notes.

>>34993368
how about no

>>34993310
It contains a lot of Japanese word play and some old anime references.

>>34993310
That's just it. It won't sell well in America. It's not the type of show that does well in America. It would cost too much to license and would be very difficult to make a profit off of.

Also a couple of pages from the Haibane booklet that came with the first Dvd.

>>34993368
They also did that for Excel Saga, and Nerima Daikon Bros.

>>34993400
SZS got licensed, and it's nothing but word play and references. It's the better show, but BMG might sell better here like it did in Japan.

>>34993307
mind = blown

>>34993446
It'll take off when the marketing department decides on Twilight comparisons.

>>34993310
Because it sold so well, Japan wants a shitton of money to license it. The most likely scenario would be Funimation being forced to pick it up in a package deal.

in after shitstorm

>>34993307
THEY'RE... LEARNING.

>>34993509
A few other shows that will never be licensed are any of the Macross titles, K-On, and Angel Beats.

>>34988747
>Japan's anime airtimes are the equivalent of our cartoons' airtime.
Someone's not from here

That's not true at all.