Julie Mayo
LRH and I [16 Apr 1996]
From: mayo@lightlink.com (Julie Mayo)
Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology
Subject: LRH and I
Date: 16 Apr 1996 14:46:29 -0400
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My experiences with LRH, L. Ron Hubbard, Founder of Scientology
For a long time I have felt the need to communicate some of my
experiences with L. Ron Hubbard. Bear with me, dear critics, but I
am writing this primarily for a.r.s. readers who have been
Scientologists.
While I was in Scientology, from 1971-1983, I had what I
considered to be the privilege of working directly with LRH. I did
the SHSBC in 1971-72 and joined the Sea Organization. I went to
the Flagship Apollo (Flag) in 1973 where I met L. Ron Hubbard. I
had never really expected to meet L.R.H. personally -- but not only
did I meet him, but ended up as his technical aide (Training and
Services Aide/CS 4) for several years.
I had gotten interested in Scientology because people told me that it
would enlighten me regarding out of body experiences, telepathy,
and it would answer various questions I had concerning the meaning
of life. I also wanted to do my bit concerning helping mankind. I
was much more interested in training, rather than receiving auditing,
which is why I had done the briefing course. I was fascinated by the
"technology" in many ways. First, that there was a subject that
sought to improve human abilities, which was codified and laid out
into theory and processes. Secondly, that there were all kinds of
explanations and instructions on how to do these processes. Thirdly,
that when I sat down across from another person and did the
processes, the phenomena that were supposed to occur actually did
happen most of the time. If a person was upset, I flew the ruds, or
maybe did an LIC and the person became happy and the meter
F/Ned. Pretty extraordinary stuff. Not everything happened exactly
like it was supposed to: people didn't have perfect out of body
experiences on Op Pro by Dup like was suggested in the tech -- but
most people got some type of extroversion. The fact that any of it
worked impressed me. The fact that so much of it seemed to do
what it was supposed to do so much of the time, seemed miraculous.
The methodology clearly wasn't perfect, as anyone who had done
the SHSBC could see. The tech was an ever changing, evolving
process. I spent hundreds of hours listening to LRH discuss the
theory and techniques and change his mind about things and try new
things. It was exciting. I formed an impression of LRH from
listening to all those tapes. He sounded like a man who was very
interested in people and in exploring human potential. He almost
sounded a bit fatherly, and he was a wonderfully entertaining
speaker.
So, when I arrived on the ship in 1973 in Lisbon, I was very curious
to see how LRH matched up. The first night I was there I snuck a
peak into the "research room" where he was working. To me, his
presence seemed to fill the room.
I was not on board for much time before we set sail. We sailed to
the Canary Islands, on a trip that was very rough -- strong winds and
high seas. Everyone had a sea watch. I realized that, like me, most
of us really didn't know what we were doing. People had been
"hatted" to some degree on a ship duty like radar, lookout, and so
forth, but we really were a bunch of amateurs sailing a big vessel in
high seas. Amazing and scary. In the morning we mustered on
deck. The Canary Islands were coming into view and LRH came out
on deck. He was smiling, exuberant. His eyes were sparkling. Life
seemed to be a great adventure to him. It was very infectious.
I saw aspects of Hubbard I hadn't suspected while listening to all
those course lectures. He was extraordinarily adventurous; he
expected people to do incredible things, and people responded and
did things that they wouldn't have dreamed doing had he not
demanded them.
I was struck by the fact that when I ran into him on the decks he
always gave me a big smile -- the kind of smile that made me happy
for the rest of the day. It seemed like he would give people his
complete attention. I was surprised at these qualities -- I thought he
would have been too busy to pay attention to people and to small
details to the degree that he did. On the other hand, he had some
bad qualities that were equally unexpected. Sometimes he would
lose his temper, and when he did, you would feel it down to the very
cells in your bones.
When he was angry, he could be quite mean. He would write an
ethics order on someone, condemning them to the galley, or never to
be an executive again. Then two weeks later, he would change his
mind, and he would appoint that same person to one of the highest
positions in Scientology. There were no overboards when I was on
the ship, but there were plenty of sleepless nights and conditions
were really quite terrible at times. Not that we really noticed much,
we were completely occupied day and night.
During the first months of 1974, I worked in external
communications and although I saw LRH daily, I never really got to
know what it was like to work with him until I was a Tech Programs
Chief and then Training and Services Aide. When I was appointed
to Tech Programs Chief I did my first eval. It was an "all hands" --
all the programs chiefs were doing evals. At this particular time they
were all going straight to LRH for approval via a messenger. I
remember doing my eval and sending it to him. A few minutes later
I got it back down via a running messenger with a note about
something that needed to be changed. I changed it and sent it back
up and I got a surprise: a messenger screamed at me "What the H--
!" "You didn't...." I really was quite indignant and insisted that I
had too made the requested change and sent it back up to him via the
messenger. Two minutes later it was approved. It shocked me that
LRH was so explosive, but it was certainly exciting working for him.
He issued lots of "orders" and liked very, very fast action and
deadlines. All nighters was more of a routine, than an occasional, in
1974. He was much better tempered in 1975 when we were in the
Caribbean. We got lots of sleep, though conditions were so
crowded that about 60 of us had to sleep on the sun deck as there
were no more bunks.
I was temporary CS 4 in January 1975 and again in the fall. When I
was T/CS 4 one of my first "message runs" concerned the
Conditional Certificate system. LRH was furious with Ron Shafron,
for instituting conditional certs. I had a tape in the office of a
briefing on the subject between LRH and Ron Shafron. The tape
clearly showed that it was Hubbard who had ordered the conditional
cert system, not Shafron, so I was quick to point this out to LRH. I
soon learned that this really wasn't the politically acceptable way to
deal with him: the usual way was to "PR" him and take the blame
yourself. I was disappointed, but not disillusioned. LRH sent me a
few mean messages for my obvious blunder, but forgave me by the
end of the evening. I also forgave LRH. Hubbard was an
extraordinary man, though not perfect. Most people don't
accomplish a tenth of what he did. He authored huge amounts of the
tech, which mostly produced remarkable results. Hubbard definitely
had redeeming qualities, in my estimation.
Speaking of authorship. That was another situation that I had to
deal with as CS 4. The truth was that lots of the tech was not
authored by Hubbard. In fact, one of the things I did as LRH's
technical aide was write bulletins, HCOBs. If it was important, it
had to bear LRH's name, because that was the way the religion was
set up. I didn't like the system much for several reasons. The first
was I thought people should know who actually wrote the bulletins.
Secondly, the system was set up that if something went wrong, or if
Hubbard wanted to change something, he could save face and blame
it on some one else. "The mice have been gnawing at the pillars
again... ." I reached a compromise with Hubbard: if I wrote a
bulletin, it would be "Assisted by". That didn't always work,
though, because if it was an important bulletin, it wouldn't do to
have it assisted by someone else.
One of the first orders I got from Hubbard was that I was to cancel
everything the last two CS 4s had ever written. It was an impossible
task because I would have just canceled out the grade chart. What
was clear to me from this order, was that there were a line of fall
guys before me. It would be just a matter of time before, I too,
would be the "who" and have my work canceled.
As CS 4, I had various projects done and had several people
working for me at different times. LRH had written Technical
Correction Roundup in 1976 or 77 which called for a great deal of
writing and compilation. The Expanded Dianetic project was a
particular nightmare -- for many reasons. The first was that a lot of
the work that had been done on it originally was by Allan Gilbertson.
LRH decided that Allan Gilbertson was a squirrel, so he wanted the
EX DN course done again, using only LRH material. (LRH loved
the idea that if there was something wrong with the tech, it was
because someone else messed it up.) The problem was that
Expanded Dianetics really wasn't fully researched to start with, and
there were no, or few, successful case histories. I remember getting
a nudge from him concerning what was taking the re-write so long.
I told him that the project of re-writing the case histories was
incomplete. Much to my embarrassment, Hubbard took what I said
out of context and wrote an HCOB saying that Training and
Services Aide had found the why on Expanded Dianetics-- the case
histories hadn't been fully written up. The real problem was
Expanded Dianetics wasn't completely researched -- something I
believe LRH really didn't want to think about at the time.
Sifting through HCOBs and canceling "out tech" ones or ones
written by "other people" was something that went on constantly.
The "out tech" HCOBs were then corrected by a project and the
HCOBs written by that project would be sifted through a few years
later and canceled as out tech. In 1974 there was a project done by
Molly and another girl, FMO ___. They were supposed to change
bulletins into BTBs that hadn't been written by LRH. But the
important ones were all retained as HCOBs whether they were
written by Hubbard or not. In compliance to the LRH order to me
to cancel everything written by Livingston and Shafron, I had stacks
of bulletins put together with their CSWs. The problem was, what
to revise them to? I couldn't just cancel important bulletins which
described technical processes for no reason. Most of them had been
ordered written by LRH, and even though he had ordered them
canceled, he would have been furious if they were canceled with no
replacement. Finally, I asked Shafron to go through his stack and let
me know if he thought anything needed to be revised, which he did
graciously. He found a few that he thought needed to be updated so
I sent them over to David Mayo to check and if he agreed, up to
LRH Pers Comm for approval. Sometimes they went to Hubbard,
but mostly LRH didn't look at stuff like that.
It was in December of 1975 that I had one of my more memorable
experiences with LRH. This is during the period when we were
coming to land. We'd been sailing around the Med in 1974 and the
Caribbean in 1975 and the ship was getting crowded. We had the
problem of getting kicked out of ports, too, but that is another story.
LRH went to Daytona, Florida with most of the Flag crew and
"FCCIs", (public), and I went to NYC with about 30 of the
management crew. LRH had just done a couple of "international
evaluations" and it was our job to keep things going and get the
"eval" programs implemented by the outer orgs while the Flag Land
Base was being set up. As CS4 I had a couple LRH orders in
particular I was supposed to implement, one of which was to switch
internships from the qualifications division to the technical division
of the service organizations.
As it was an LRH order, I did it with gusto. I remember Kerry
Gleason, who was the Commanding Officer of the Flag Bureau at
the time, cautioning me about it. He kept saying that I should hold
back on it. To me, it would have been sacrilege to do anything but
go full speed ahead. It was an LRH order and that meant it had to
be done, and right away. Looking back at it, I realize that it had
probably been Kerry's idea in the first place that Hubbard had
adopted and put into the eval program.
Well, the international statistics went down around Thanksgiving.
They always did around that time of the year but it was "off-policy"
to blame anything else but ourselves. "The Why is God" -- is the
policy letter. So when we joined the rest of the Flag crew in
Clearwater we were in disgrace, we were sent down from NYC by
slow bus. On the other hand, the Flag Land Base had been doing
really well so everyone else was being praised. Then, the obligatory
why -finding began. A who had to be found for the down
international statistics.
I was woken up at 2 AM one December 1975 morning by a
messenger yelling at me that I had crashed international statistics and
to assign myself a lower "ethics" condition for doing so.
Furthermore, I was to immediately gather up all the issues I had ever
written to send to LRH so that they could be reviewed, and
presumably be canceled. Up I got, in a state of panic. I ran over to
the Clearwater Building from my dorm in the Fort Harrison, losing a
shoe in my haste along the way. I went to mimeo and searched the
files, gathering up things I had written. I started sending them "up"
to "R". LRH was giving me a really hard time via his messengers --
who were making it quite clear I was in deep trouble. Suddenly,
everything changed. I got a soothing message, delivered by Annie
Broeker, telling me that the why had been found. I was to read a
policy letter in Volume 5 of the OEC. In the late 60's Hubbard had
tried to move the internships from Qual to Tech, and it hadn't
worked then either. A messenger told me, on the side, that LRH had
thought that I had been following an order from Shafron and then
realized his error when he saw a copy of the eval written by himself.
LRH was obviously no longer as angry with me, but I still wasn't off
the hook on crashing international statistics, so I sat down and
assigned myself a condition of "Treason". I figured I was in
"Treason" because I hadn't fully worn my hat as CS 4. CS 4 was
responsible for rising technical statistics -- I should have "made
things go right", somehow. I remembered something Maureen
Sarfatti had told me years ago. Mo had said that when she was
appointed as "Programs Chief", (first time programs chiefs came into
existence), that she and the others had been called into the research
room for a conference with LRH. LRH had sat them all down and
told them that they were each assigned a "continent" to manage.
The world was broken down into sections: Europe, Africa, US, UK
and so forth. LRH looked them each in the eye and told them that
they were responsible to make sure that their assigned continent was
expanding and doing well statistically. He said, "Each one of you
have managed planets in the past." A mere continent would be a
piece of cake.
I was ashamed that I hadn't managed to keep tech division statistics
rising. I was off to a poor start on my CS 4 post. I sent up the
Treason Formula to LRH. By now it was New Year's Eve and I
would spend the evening doing amends. Surprisingly, I got a
response back from LRH almost immediately. He wrote in his own
handwriting, "Condition mitigated to Danger. Brush up on
pinpointing whys with DSEC." It was a God send. Not only had
LRH given me the night off to go to the party -- which I did
thoroughly enjoy -- but he told me something. He told me it was
OK for me to disagree with him and even change his orders, as long
as I had a correct reason for doing so. I took the lesson to heart and
for a long time I could almost do no wrong as CS 4. LRH was
extremely happy with almost everything I did-- and if I disagreed
with him on something, I wrote to him about, with a suggested
handling, with which he almost always agreed.
There were lots of things that happened between then and my final
departure in 1983. When I did leave Scientology, it was really quite
overdue, but I was and still am happy to have had a chance to have
known LRH. He was an extraordinary individual. He was incredibly
brilliant in some ways, evil (at times) -- and he was always
interesting and exciting and most, of the time, fun to work with.
Unfortunately I believe that today's Scientology is memorializing his
worst qualities and forgetting about his best qualities. One of his
most outstanding characteristics is that he could change, and did, all
the time.
When I say evil, I mean things like dirty tricks, harassment, and so
forth. Staff members really weren't aware of that side of things --
because it was all done by separate departments like G.O. But there
are other things -- like his temper tantrums, and the observable fact
he treated people like his slaves. He really should not have been
allowed to get away with it.
What I personally most liked about LRH was that he was
extraordinarily interested in things -- and would get excited at things
that were particularly smart. To this day when I encounter
something particularly bright, especially technically, I think about
how much Hubbard would have appreciated it. It was fabulous to be
able to share things with him, because he would be genuinely
fascinated. In this respect, he was completely delightful to work
with.
I didn't feel any pang of guilt or disloyalty towards LRH when I left
Scientology thirteen years ago. There was no doubt that LRH
would have been furious with me because he hated splinter groups.
No doubt, I, and others, would have been made "who's" and blamed
for anything that went wrong. That was LRH's style. But I knew
that if he had been me, he would have left long before I did. He, for
one, would have never put up with the treatment that we all did!
Julie Gillespie Mayo
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Back to "Ex-Scientologists Speak"
Re: LRH and I [28 Apr 1996]
From: Julie Mayo <mayo@lightlink.com>
Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology
Subject: Re: LRH and I
Date: 28 Apr 1996 00:42:19 -0400
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On Wed, 24 Apr 1996 20:23:17 UTC, an557846@anon.penet.fi (David Cooke)
wrote:
[...]
>noticed how the situation improved from 1983 onwards. According
>to Ron's Journal 38 again, this sudden boom was general around
>the world. It followed on the departure from the admin and tech
>areas of many people whom L. Ron Hubbard regarded as
>suppressives.
Did L. Ron Hubbard consider me to be a suppressive? If so, he never
told me so. The first thing I recall LRH calling me was a "trouper".
That was in 1974 after I had done a mission which was to carry out an
eval that he had done personally. As I recall, the mission was rewarded
the status of "Power".
A year or two later L. Ron Hubbard ordered that I be appointed to the
post of CS 4, which was his personal aide for technical matters.
(Do you think COST has preserved L. Ron Hubbard's dispatches concerning
the above?)
In 1980, I became Senior C/S INT Assistant. One of the first things that
I did as Senior C/S INT Assistant was to help David Mayo write Solo
NOTs. In fact, part of the original SOLO NOTs checksheet was written by
yours truly. Hubbard wasn't around Gilman Hot Springs at that time. He
was in seclusion with the Broekers.
In late 1981, LRH began communicating with David Mayo, Senior C/S INT,
and the CMO and his personal accountants. From 1981 until August of
1982, David Mayo and the Senior C/S INT Office received many messages
and letters from LRH. Amongst other things, LRH suggested that David
develop a Happiness Rundown, which David did. When the rundown and
course were completed, auditors and C/Ses from around the world came to
ASHO in LA. David personally taught the course and internship. It was
a huge success.
If LRH was pleased with a person, and thought that a person was
successful in carrying out projects, it was LRH's habit to then give
that person many more projects to do. Such was the case of the Senior
C/S INT office in 1982. We were swamped with projects. LRH was praising
our work over and over again and offering various suggestions and
comments concerning technical matters.
(These letters from L. Ron Hubbard to David Mayo must have been
preserved by COST as they would be very important indeed. There may
have been some "third party" concerning David and I which has colored
people's opinion of us, but surely the words of L. Ron Hubbard
concerning such an important topic as the Bridge would have been
preserved. Wouldn't you agree?)
In April 1982, L. Ron Hubbard sent a very long and detailed letter to
David Mayo concerning the future of the tech. A copy of the letter was
sent to a good many other people: I was on the list, as Senior C/S INT
Assistant; also CO CMO INT (John Nelson, at the time); Maureen Samuels
(who was either CO CMO SU of CO CMO GOLD); and several others.
In the letter LRH did some reminiscing concerning his long term
association with David and David's extensive experience concerning the
tech. LRH said that he expected to live for 2 years longer at the most,
and that he wanted David to take over all of his technical hats,
including research. LRH said he thought that David should have a
separate corporation to do this work, apart from Scientology management.
LRH also wrote to Lyman Spurlock concerning setting up a separate
corporation for David Mayo and his technical research. Lyman Spurlock
was a CPA and had graduated from UC Berkeley, I believe, so was the Sea
Org member who had the most knowledge concerning finances and corporate
matters.
In August the Senior C/S INT Office was very, very busy as we had many
projects. We were receiving letters from LRH almost daily, commending
us, and advising even more projects. One night, David and I worked late
to finish one of the projects so that it could be sent up to LRH. This
particular project had to do with Div 6 -- new public.
I hadn't been asleep long when I was awoken by Marc Yager and taken to
meet David Miscavige at the Senior C/S INT Office. David Miscavige put
me into the RPF -- as I detailed in my letter to D. Miscavige which I
posted on ars last week. You may have seen it.
Being placed under guard, incommunicado, was a big surprise to me
because we had apparently, according to letters from LRH, been doing
splendidly. If there was an order from LRH to put me in the RPF, I
never saw it, and nobody told me about it.
I was put on a running program for 12 hours a day, 7 days a week, and
made to run around a tree in all types of extreme desert conditions. In
October of 1982, a Scientology "Committee of Evidence" was issued on me
and 15 other well-respected Scientologists. This "Committee of
Evidence" had apparently already found us guilty of ridiculously
outrageous things, before the committee was ever convened. If you
haven't seen the issue, you really must read it. It was a rather long
FCO, but I'll see if I can post some excerpts for you, in a separate
posting.
I remember the moment I first saw it vividly because I couldn't believe
what I was reading. My knees were shakey, but I had to keep running
around that tree. Johnny Schlessinger, who was also in the RPF and
running around the same tree kept teasing: "I knew you were working for
the KGB all along."
Things got even more bizarre. One night soon thereafter I was awoken in
the middle of the night after a hard day of running, and escorted to
"Qual" in the old spa building. It was around 2 or 3 AM. There were
several people already assembled and waiting. The 16 of us who were
being "comm-eved" were each going to be interviewed individually by
three top members of RTC: Vicki Aznaran, (President of RTC), Jessie
Prince, (whom. I think, was also an officer of RTC), and Geoff Shervell
(formerly of the G.O. and now with RTC).
Finally, it was my turn. I was taken into a small "auditing" room and
sat opposite from the three who faced me. I was told that unless I
confessed to working for the IRS, FBI, or other government agency, I was
going to: A) be sent to jail B) lose my eternity C) be banned from
tech lines forever. When I said I didn't work for a government agency,
I was told that they might go lighter on me if I confessed to supplying
Alan Walters with a mailing list. I said I hadn't done that either, so
was told to go think about it and write my confession.
Finally, after several hours, I was allowed to go back to sleep. But the
experience was chilling. The weeks dragged on or shall I say, "ran on"?
I met with the Committee of Evidence on a couple different occasions.
An investigation had been done which had prompted the Committee of
Evidence, but I wasn't allowed to see the investigation.
I gathered that the investigation had been done by Gelda Mithoff. Gelda
Mithoff was also a member of the Committee of Evidence. The Chairman of
the Committee of Evidence was Ray Mithoff. Gelda apparently had done a
secret investigation which had resulted in David Mayo and myself being
removed from our positions and which had inserted Ray Mithoff, her
husband, as the new Senior C/S International. To make things worse, our
only recourse was the Committee of Evidence, which was chaired by Ray
Mithoff. David Miscavige had ordered the Scientology Committee of
Evidence and his wife, Shelly, was a member of the committee.
It was just me alone with the committee (which had about 7 members). I
had no representation and I had no opportunity to present my side of the
story. I wasn't even allowed to see or know of the investigation which
had put me in this position. I was still being guarded and was not
allowed to talk to the rest of the staff or even make a phone call.
The Committee of Evidence didn't have any evidence against me. If you
haven't seen the Findings and Recommendations of the Committee of
Evidence, I'll try to find a copy and post some excerpts for you. I
think I may have pleaded guilty to "hats, not wearing", or something to
try to appease the committee. I always felt a bit guilty of that,
because I was always behind on executing LRH orders.
The Committee of Evidence tried to get me to say that I had "mutual out
ruds" with David Mayo. (Meaning I agreed with his disagreements.) This
would have explained why I had proposed a C/S to run him on "Effects of
an R/Ser" checklist. I explained this in my posting concerning letter
to D. Miscavige. I don't remember if I actually did assess the "Effects
of an R/Ser Checklist", I think he wasn't interested in it when I
inquired. I did fly the ruds, though.
Finally I was called into the Committee of Evidence for the last time.
There was a sign in front of Ray Mithoff which read: "You could be sent
to the pokey for two years."
I asked Ray Mithoff on what basis I could be sent to the pokey, and he
said something about having committed some "out tech" or done something
that was "off policy". I couldn't believe that I could be sent to jail
based on that allegation -- but I wasn't in a good position to prevent
it if they decided to frame me on something. I had only about $200 in
savings and was being kept under guard.
It was at this time that I knew I *had* to leave and as fast as I could.
I wrote a CSW asking to leave. By this time there were security fences
surrounding Gilman Hot Springs with electronically locked gates. The
only way that you could get through the gates was to have a personalized
card. I didn't have a card; my card had been confiscated.
In response to my CSW, I was taken to the security office where I met
with Rick Aznaran who was the boss of the security guards. Rick asked
me where I would go if I were to leave and I said to Orange County.
Rick immediately was suspicious. I hadn't realized at that time that
John Nelson had gone to Orange County. I truthfully told Rick that I
wanted to go to Orange County because I had a cousin there, but if the
idea concerned him, I could go somewhere else. I was intimidated by the
interview because the security office was full of guns. In other times
when I'd been in the office there had not been any guns. I was getting
more and more worried about what was going to happen.
I waited almost two weeks for an answer to my CSW -- hoping that I would
be released. No answer came. So I decided I would try to escape on my
own. By this time it was January 1983 -- 6 months since I was initially
put under guard. We had been moved in from Happy Valley and I was
staying with about 5 other woman in a small cottage. Our group was kept
separate from the other staff -- we ate after everyone else had eaten
and worked in a garage at night. It was dark and damp and cold where we
were working. I think we were supposed to be chipping paint or rust,
but mainly they were just keeping us occupied. We went to bed around 3
or 4 in the morning.
One night I went to bed but did not go to sleep. I stayed awake until
around 8:00 AM. I cautiously got down from my top bunk and gathered up
a few meager possessions into a pillow case. I thought that I might be
able to get through the gate when the guards went across the road to
breakfast. I crept out of the cottage and waited until I saw someone go
through the gate, then I slipped through it before it shut.
Now the task was to walk down the road without being noticed. I had to
get by two guard booths. I slung my pillow case over my shoulder and
walked casually. I wanted people to think that I was just a staff
member going off to do their laundry, so I wouldn't arouse suspicion.
My heart was pounding, but nobody noticed me.
After I got about a half mile down the road, I stuck out my thumb and
hitch hiked to Hemet. I was in luck: within about 5 minutes someone
picked me up and I made it to the bus station without incident. But
the bus wasn't there and I had quite a long wait on the bench. I was
worried that I would be noticed by a Scientology staff member and, sure
enough, I was. Bridget Lantz stopped and said, "Are you supposed to be
here?" I quickly replied, "Yes!" She looked doubtful, but drove off.
The bus did finally come, but at the same time, so did two security
guards. Bridget must have tipped them off. "Julie! Come here!" They
shouted. It was too late. I already had a foot on the bus, and there
was no way that they could force me to go with them.
>But the great majority of Scientologists don't leave when things
>get tough. They don't expect it to be all fun and free
>hamburgers. You probably recognise the quote ""We're not playing
>some minor game in Scientology. It isn't cute or something to do
>for lack of something better". I've had a relatively soft trip
>over the bridge (pc route, never on staff) but I've known many
>people who devote their whole lives to changing the direction
>this society is going and improving life for us all. They work
>their guts out for others. They don't worry about having fun,
What can I say? No, being falsely imprisoned wasn't fun. I don't think
it was cute either. I *have* dedicated my life to helping mankind.
That is a big reason why I am trying to write about my personal
experiences. Knowledge helps people.
>though I always get the impression they find plenty to smile
>about. People like Peter Sparshott, the C/S at AOSH ANZO, for
>example. Perhaps you knew Fred Schraitle, who would have been at
>Flag around your time there. And just the other week I saw a post
>from Melbourne's loudest anti-scientologist that insulted another
>one, Pat Wilson.
Sorry, don't know these people. Someone sent me a copy of
"International Scientology News" which I read yesterday. I carefully
looked over the various executive staff to see if there was anyone that
I knew that hadn't left. I found a few people. (RTC was noticeably
absent.) The Danilovichs in the UK, Ron Norton of Flag Management,
Claire Parz I knew well. Although I haven't had any contact with them
since 1980, I can say that when I knew these people they were extremely
nice and certainly dedicated. I met Rae Mathieson, now of Eastern US, a
couple times in England in the '70s. He is Scottish and had a wonderful
sense of humor. I hope he still has it! I'd call these people
"troupers", wouldn't you? Of course I recognized Heber. Fred Harris
looked great -- being LRH Pers PR in ASI must be a pretty good job. And
was that Neville Potter?
>
>Thank you for taking the time to write such a thorough reply to
>my post. But I don't think you have said anything to change my
>opinion of David Mayo and those who ally themselves with him.
Wasn't trying to. I was just trying to relate some of my personal
experiences with LRH and you were interested enough to post a follow up
message.
>You cite some more evidence of L. Ron Hubbard's contempt for
>David Mayo after 1983. This fits the scenario of DM as a traitor
>to L. Ron Hubbard and Scientology - but not his claim to be the
>heir to all Ron's technical hats.
You could be correct about DM (also known as David Miscavige) being a
traitor to L. Ron Hubbard and Scientology. But I think that is
something you need to judge for yourself when you get all the facts. (We
used to call David Miscavige "DM".)
As far as "L. Ron Hubbard's contempt for David Mayo after 1983," I
pointed out that information had been sent to L. Ron Hubbard that had
caused L. Ron Hubbard to be upset with David and me and several others
- -- information which had not been revealed to us and in which we had no
opportunity to correct.
>> Are you an "Aussie bleeder?"
>Yes, you're right.
Thought so. I'm an American, but as I'm sure you know, am married to a
Kiwi. I couldn't help but notice that the Kiwis have made a pretty good
showing -- David Mayo, Brian Livingston, Jeff Walker, Bent Corydon,
Graham Berry, ...even Liesa Goodman. Did she really say that
Scientology "isn't a turn your other cheek religion"?
And for the Aussies.....they uh, well their boat sank last year, but...I
think they've got some spirit too. Why don't you ask head of OSA, Mike
Rinder, another Aussie, to show you some of the actual LRH letters to
David Mayo, including the April 1982 letter concerning his technical
hats. (Actually there were some Aussies -- Tony Dunleavy, former Staff
Captain -- left in 1982; Judy Graham, former CS 5 --left, Peter Graham
- -- left; the Maces --left ...)
I'm not trying to convince you that David should try to take over LRH's
technical hat, I'm just trying to get the truth known, because I think
it has been hidden and people have been misinformed.
And we have been harassed because of it, which I don't like. I would
describe it in stronger terms than "not fun".
>David Cooke
>cooke.david@ pi.sa.gov.au
Julie Mayo
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LRH comments re jailing [17 May 1996]
From: julie.mayo@lightlink.com (Julie Mayo)
Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology
Subject: LRH comments re jailing
Date: 17 May 1996 18:21:03 -0400
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In the summer of 1982 I was working in the SENIOR C/S INT Office at Gilman
Hot Springs as Senior C/S INT Assistant. L. Ron Hubbard was in hiding but
there was a great deal of "traffic" (correspondence) between SNR C/S INT
UNIT and LRH.
The correspondence from L. Ron Hubbard to SENIOR C/S INT, David Mayo,
covered many different subjects but one letter particularly disturbed me.
The subject was concerning getting Scientology (lower) organizations to
send two staff members away for training at a higher Scientology
organization. This type of project was pretty usual -- when I had been CS
4 earlier we had often executed similar projects of this nature.
But in this letter Hubbard expressed a new idea. He announced that soon,
executives would be able to put some "teeth" into their orders. His
intent was to empower executives with the ability to send staff to jail
for non-compliance with their orders. So, if an order was sent down to a
lower Scientology org for two people to be sent off for training and that
order was non-complied with, whoever non-complied with the order could be
sent to jail!
This was somehow being made possible by the formation of RTC. It struck
us as a pretty heavy penalty and I mentally discarded it. We thought it
couldn't and shouldn't be possible for a person to go to jail for failing
to comply with an order! We couldn't see it ever being implemented, and
would never dream of attempting to put a staff member in jail for such a
matter.
I had heard that Pat Broeker and David Miscavige were worried about how
they were going to get their orders complied with after LRH died, and
supposed that the solution of "jailing" people for non-compliance may have
resulted from some of their concerns. I didn't see the correspondence
concerning how RTC could accomplish "jailing" but I knew that lawyers were
being consulted concerning the formation of RTC.
In fact, the story we were told was that we were renovating the pool area
so that Hubbard could meet with and entertain his lawyers. LRH was in
hiding but we kept hearing that any time soon he would be coming to live
at Hemet. For months the entire crew had foregone their day off to
renovate the property in preparation for his arrival.
At the end of August 1982, David Miscavige removed me from my post as
SENIOR C/S INT Assistant and put me in the RPF. In October 1982, 16 top
Scientology executives were "comm eved", at Gilman Hot Springs.
Apparently an investigation had been done unbeknownst to us. The
Scientology "Committee of Evidence" was chaired by the new SENIOR C/S INT,
Ray Mithoff.
When I was brought in to hear the findings and recommendations, Ray
Mithoff had a sign which read "You could go to the pokey for two years".
I asked why, and he said for "out tech" or "off policy". I queried him as
to whether I could go to jail for that? He said yes. That earlier letter
from Hubbard came to mind where he had expressed the idea of jailing
people for non-compliance with orders.
I left Scientology in February 1983, but there have been several attempts
made by Scientology since then to get David or me jailed. After we
started the AAC, there was a mission sent by RTC to try to get us jailed.
One incident that occurred was that we got a message on an answering
machine from Kurt Weiland, OSA, saying that David was going to have
trouble getting back into the country. (David was giving a lecture in
Vancouver.) The next day David was detained at the Canadian Border and
searched for drugs. (None were found and he was allowed to come into the
country.)
Private Investigators, working under the license of Eugene Ingram, did a
noisy investigation in which they posed as a "Task Force on White Collar
Crime and Drug Smuggling". The investigators called up parents of staff,
members of the AAC, the AAC's bank, travel agency, associates of the AAC's
lawyer and told them that they were investigating David Mayo and the AAC
for drug smuggling, smuggling fire arms, being a member of the Red Brigade
and other crimes. (All of which was untrue.) The private investigators
contacted Interpol, FBI, and so forth.
The "investigation" had a chilling effect on staff and public and in the
summer of 1984 we filed for and obtained an restraining order against this
type of harassment. But despite this, harassment of a similar nature by
Scientology has continued over the years, including further attempts to
get us jailed by them as recently as during 1994 and 1995. (I will be
posting a separate account of this.)
Julie Mayo
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UN-FAIR GAME, TOO [10 Jun 1996]
Path: szdc!zdc!zdc-e!uunet!in2.uu.net!EU.net!Norway.EU.net!nntp.uio.no!news.lightlink.com!not-for-mail
From: Julie Mayo <julie.mayo@lightlink.com>
Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology
Subject: UN-FAIR GAME, TOO
Date: 10 Jun 1996 02:36:12 -0400
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During 1994 and 1995, my husband, (David Mayo), and I were persecuted
in the Dominican Republic by Scientology acting through INTERPOL, DNCD,
(Dominican Republic equivalent to U.S. DEA, Drug Enforcement Agency), US
DEA, (or someone purporting to be a DEA agent), and someone purporting
to be working for the FBI. Due to this persecution, we have been driven
out of our home.
BACKGROUND
David and I were former members of the Church of Scientology and left
it in 1983 due to disagreements with it. We had tried to reform it from
within and had been falsely imprisoned for several months (from August
1982-February 1983) after we had expressed disagreements. After we left
the Church of Scientology, we were involved in a reform movement which
resulted in the Church of the New Civilization being formed in July of
1983. The Church of the New Civilization started an Advanced Ability
Center which was closed down in April of 1986 after extensive harassment
by RTC/Church of Scientology, such as:
In 1984, Private Investigator Al Bei did a noisy investigation of
David Mayo and the AAC for Scientology (operating under Eugene Ingram's
private investigator license), in which Al Bei had business cards
printed and distributed that claimed he was a "Special Agent" working on
a "Task Force against White Collar Crime and Drugs." Private
investigators operating under Eugene Ingram's license called up parents
of AAC staff clients of AAC, the bank for the AAC, neighbor's of the
AAC's attorney (Gary Bright), the AAC's travel agent and asked questions
about David Mayo's involvement with drug smuggling, gun smuggling, the
Italian terrorist group, (The Red Brigade), whether the AAC was doing
money laundering for the Mafia, and so forth. These were all false
accusations, but the noisy investigation adversely effected the AAC.
Additionally, in 1984, Al Bei contacted the FBI, INTERPOL, and the
local Santa Barbara sheriff's department to try to get something to get
David Mayo "jailed". Al Bei informed the FBI that he was waiting for
evidence from Denmark concerning David Mayo's involvement with Robin
Scott's theft of "stolen documents", but that no evidence in David
Mayo's involvement ever arrived.
RTC/Church of Scientology went on to file 4 lawsuits against the AAC
and David Mayo alleging that David Mayo had received "stolen documents".
All of these lawsuits were dismissed and Scientology was sanctioned
heavily for abusive litigation in 1993. (The AAC had already been
closed in 1986 due to harassment and abusive litigation by the Church of
Scientology/RTC.)
In June of 1994, Monique Yingling and Bill Drescher (Scientology
lawyers), Mike Rinder (head of OSA), and Gerbode's lawyer paid a
surprise visit to our lawyer, Jerold Fagelbaum. After a series of
meetings between Miscavige and Gerbode, Miscavige and his lawyers had
managed to get Gerbode to break his contract with CNC/David Mayo, and
our lawyers. At that time, Gerbode had been the major contributor to
the Mayo/CNC Legal Defense Fund. (Per Gerbode, the settlement was to
end the harassment of him by Scientology.) Furthermore, as part of a
secret settlement between Gerbode and Scientology, Gerbode had assigned
over a canceled and superseded agreement to Scientology's C.O.S.T.
corporation, (Church of Spiritual Technology), which C.O.S.T. was going
to value at an enormously inflated 5.5 million dollars.
We didn't cave in.
Toward the end of July 1994 our phone rang in our home in the Dominican
Republic. It was Mike Rinder, head of OSA. He wanted to arrange a
meeting between OSA and David, with no lawyers present. David told him
to send a proposal to our lawyer, Jerold Fagelbaum. Mike Rinder didn't
want to do that.
On August 4, 1994 I flew to Miami on personal matters. When I got to
Miami I received an urgent message from the Perdomos, who managed the
residential community where we lived in the Dominican Republic. DNCD
agents had surrounded our home and had held Juan Perdomo in jail for
several hours until David was located. Our home was searched and David
had been taken off in hand cuffs by the DNCD. Noone knew why or where
he had been taken. Guido Perdomo had only been told that it had been
ordered by General Ventura Bayonet, the top DNCD person in the country.
Guido was shaken up about it but told me there was nothing that could be
done that day, and probably not until after the weekend. (It was
Thursday, but he didn't think anything could be done about it on Friday
because it was some sort of a holiday.)
I was very upset and worried that David had been framed somehow by
Scientology. I was also worried that my phone might be bugged, so I
went to the nearest hotel and checked in. I was on the phone almost
constantly that night and the next morning. I contacted Bill Kirkman,
the American Consular Representative for the North Shore of the
Dominican Republic. He was very helpful, but told me that there was
nothing that could be done about it that night. He would contact the
American Embassy in the morning. He assured me that he had known us for
several years, (he lived down the road from us), and that he knew we
didn't have the lifestyle of drug smugglers. (We lived in a modest home
and didn't even have a car.)
I called a lawyer I knew in L.A. who had represented someone in the
Dominican Republic. He couldn't do anything, but got me in touch with
someone he knew in Santo Domingo. The conditions in the Santo Domingo
jail were awful. He told me that his client had contracted TB in jail
after being held there for 3 weeks without being charged with anything.
This worried me even more.
The next day, Bill Kirkman phoned me and told me that David had been
located. He was in the section for drug smugglers of the Santo Domingo
prison. Good news, he was going to be released that day. I waited and
waited. Still no word. I called the American Embassy in Santo Domingo
and spoke with Carlos Medina. I was told that they had gone over to the
prison and seen David's personal effects, including his credit cards, so
he knew he was there. But he hadn't been allowed to see David or talk
to him. Carlos Medina told me that the incident never had anything to
do with drugs, David had been accused of "practicing Scientology without
a license." INTERPOL had called the head of the Drug department,
Ventura Bayonet. David would be released that day without being charged
with anything as he had not committed any crime. Carlos Medina
suggested to me that maybe David had taken on too much in trying to
expose Scientology.
I also spoke with Pat Alsup at the American Embassy.. Something
strange had happened the day before. Someone who identified himself as
a lawyer representing the Church of Scientology, named Aldrich, had
called asking for the Mayo's address in the Dominican Republic. Aldrich
had been told that they couldn't give out this information, but a half
hour later someone who worked for the US DEA had phoned asking for the
same information.
5:00 PM on August 5th, and I still hadn't heard from David. The
American Embassy assured me that by now he should have been released. I
was worried that there had been foul play. Finally, at midnight I
received a call from David. They had released him that night. Relief.
September 1994. We received several phone calls from friends or
clients that a private investigator, named John Bertrant, had contacted
them and asked them if they knew David Mayo was in jail. Bertrant told
one client that Bertrant had done contract work for the government,
including the CIA. (But he couldn't disclose who his client was in this
case, only that he was working for a "group".)
September 1994. Church of Spiritual Technology (C.O.S.T.) filed a
lawsuit against David and I, as individuals, and the Church of the New
Civilization in San Mateo County in California. David and I hadn't
lived in that area since 1988, (we had lived in Redwood City between
1986-1988, but had lived in the Dominican Republic since 1988), and the
CNC had never operated there. (The Advanced Ability Center had operated
in Santa Barbara until it was closed in 1986.) Our lawyers were in
Santa Barbara and L.A. Scientology's C.O.S.T. corporation immediately
moved to attach the 2.9 million dollar sanction, so that it would be
tied up if we were able to collect it in the lawsuit in the Central
District of California.
October 1994. Margaret Dellerson, C.O.S.T. private investigator, came
to our home in the Dominican Republic at night while we were in Miami
with two off-duty policemen that she had hired. She wanted to break
into the house, but was stopped by Chago, who was watching the house for
us. Chago got his machete and held it in front of her so she couldn't
progress up the driveway. Chago had been drinking coffee with a German
lady, (who was our neighbor), a German man, who was staying in her
house, and her "sereno." Dellerson wrote in a declaration, falsely,
that there were two armed guards with shotguns guarding our house. The
two off-duty police agreed with Chago that what Dellerson was doing was
incorrect and the three of them left.
January 1994 -March 1994. More harassment. In January by the DNCD who
believed that they were working from instructions from the FBI -- but
when we checked with the American Embassy, the word came back that
apparently the FBI wasn't doing an investigation. See David Mayo's
posting for the details of this and for details of the harassment by the
DNCD in March of 1995.
.
On May 15, 1995 I flew back home to the Dominican Republic to pick up a
few things and try to take care of some personal matters. I was worried
about my pets and brought more food for them. Chago informed me that
Margaret Dellerson, the Scientology private investigator from Florida,
had been around with a couple off-duty police that she had paid to
accompany her. He didn't know why. He advised me to not leave the
house alone. This news made me nervous and I was afraid that there
might be another dirty trick about to happen. I decided to cut my trip
short and leave the next day.
May 16, 1995. As I was going through passport control I was stopped.
A DNCD official, named Medina, looked at my passport then back to the
sheet of paper he had before him. He had a picture of me. He seemed as
surprised as I was. I was escorted to the airport office of the DNCD.
There began the interrogation. "Had I ever been arrested for drugs?"
"Never." I was angry and frustrated, but that made them even more edgy.
There were 5 DNCD agents in the office and me, alone. I wanted to make
a phone call to the American Embassy. No. I couldn't make any phone
calls. I knew I was in trouble because I had changed my plans and had
told no one that I was flying out that day. I hadn't even told David.
The American Consular Representative had told me that he was flying to
Miami earlier that same day and he wouldn't be back for a week. They
got my suitcases off the flight and searched them. They didn't find
guns or drugs or money. They found a small amount of money in my purse
which Medina announced as poverty level. Bautista wanted to know where
my husband was -- out of the country.
The questioning went on for 5 hours. Shortly after it started, they
demanded I speak in Spanish, so the next 5 hours I struggled on in my
poor Spanish, trying to answer their questions and explain the
situation. Bautista told me they were going to take me to Santo Domingo
and put me in jail overnight for questioning. (5 hours away.) Bautista
and Medina drove me to my home, in a shiny new DNCD jeep -- to look at
it and see if there was anybody else there. (I was told that the DNCD
is largely funded by U.S. DEA.) Finally, around 7 PM, Medina told me
that they were going to let me go. It had been a case of "mistaken
identity". Medina confided to me that he didn't think it was a mistaken
identity, though, because he had a picture of me windsurfing and I had
just spent the last half hour telling him about Dominican Republic
windsurfing conditions, (some of the best surf sailing conditions in the
world). Medina also told me that I was right in thinking that
Scientology was involved in the DNCD investigating me.
Medina warned me that my name and picture were still at passport
control, so I might have trouble getting out of the country the next
day. He gave me the phone number of "Corcino", one of the DNCD agents,
and told me to call him before I went through passport control. I had
the impression that they had decided to let me go after their superiors
had gotten off work. The situation might start all over again the next
day, if I was still in the country when his superiors reported to work,
or so I thought. Medina wanted to know which flight I was going out on.
I said the first one, 8AM. He helped book me on it at the American
Airlines counter.
I took a taxi home. But now not only was I worried about Dellerson and
her off-duty cops but the DNCD changing their minds before the morning.
I felt that with all the persecution that had been happening that it
wasn't safe to stay in the country. I didn't sleep at all that night.
I kept packing and re-packing my suitcases. I didn't know if I would
ever be able to return. I felt like I knew what it must have been like
for the Cubans when they fled from Cuba. I was sad about my cats and
dogs. They needed care. My cats had a skin problem and my female dog
was pregnant again.
May 16th, 1995. I was in a taxi on my way to the airport by 6AM. I
checked in and decided to call Corcino, as I had been told to do. No
one answered the phone. I went through passport control without being
stopped. The flight started to board around 7:45. I thought I had it
made until I saw 4 DNCD agents checking passports just before the door
to the plane. The woman in front of me wondered what it was all about
but I marched right up and stuck my passport out. The DNCD agent looked
at me hard, but let me go through. I wondered if they were looking for
David.
We haven't been back home since, now over a year later. Most of the
time we have stayed with friends who have been very charitable in
letting us stay with them. I try not to think what has happened to our
pets and the garden. I hope Chago was able to give them away to good
homes. The food in the refrigerator is undoubtedly a bit moldy by now.
I keep hearing stories that someone is telling our neighbors that David
is in jail.
We had a very good decision from the 9th Circuit Court of Appeal on
April 11, 1996-- the 2.9 million dollar sanction was affirmed and our
counterclaims reinstated. But the CofS/RTC has requested for a
rehearing en banc. In the meantime, the San Mateo case is scheduled to
go to trial in a couple weeks.
Julie Mayo
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